Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

21 killed as terrorists stage serial attacks to disrupt Kashmir polls

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by Double Edge View Post
    This is the way it supposed to go down, fight the state and not some innocents.

    You do realise if they send any of their armed forced our way of their border they will be looking at a war. They don't need that. So the loophole is to use non-state actors until and for long as the costs are not exceeded.
    Innocents is a strong statement. They are not innocent. You can cut the head of a terrorist group and make sure another head doesn't grow. But how do you fight an entire nation that's sole purpose of existence is to kill every Indian ?

    Comment


    • Originally posted by commander View Post
      We(Indian military) didn't start the loop of this shit though. Their brethren started this long back and they are seeing it's effects till day.
      So you would torture them for cheering. Thought police anyone?

      Originally posted by commander View Post
      End of the day all I can see is that you are happy some innocent people were killed by one your friends and you are very glad about it. What's more you know his plans beforehand and informing authorities would have saved countless lives. You failed to do that. Morally you are already wrong and how do you expect me to be morally correct and play fair ?
      End of the day, you are offended by their cheering and you want to punish them for cheering.

      Originally posted by commander View Post
      And you know his whereabouts yet you don't want to give that information to the authorities.If nabbing that guy saves hundreds of lives I wouldn't mind torturing the shit out of you.
      Do I? How would you know if I do or I don't without torturing me? And if I know jack shit, you would use torture to learn I know jack shit.
      Chimo

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
        So you would torture them for cheering. Thought police anyone?
        Not for cheering but by not divulging potential information that could lead to saving hundreds of innocent lives. You lose the moral ground to say torturing in inhuman when you take pleasure in others dying.

        End of the day, you are offended by their cheering and you want to punish them for cheering.
        I don't remember saying you cheering for them alone would mean we will take you in custody and torture you, but rather I said providing moral support by encouraging him to take more lives. You are guilty as much as someone who is doing the killing.

        Do I? How would you know if I do or I don't without torturing me? And if I know jack shit, you would use torture to learn I know jack shit.
        We are not just going to storm into your house all of a sudden and start torturing. As I said before innocents should be spared no matter which side they are on. I have always maintained that. We WILL and SHOULD do the background work and ONLY after strong evidence that you ARE aiding some terrorist we will nab you and do the dirty work.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by commander View Post
          Not for cheering but by not divulging potential information that could lead to saving hundreds of innocent lives.
          You're moving the goal post.

          Originally posted by commander View Post
          You lose the moral ground to say torturing in inhuman when you take pleasure in others dying.
          That is not a crime.

          Originally posted by commander View Post
          I don't remember saying you cheering for them alone would mean we will take you in custody and torture you, but rather I said providing moral support by encouraging him to take more lives. You are guilty as much as someone who is doing the killing.
          That too is not a crime.

          Originally posted by commander View Post
          We are not just going to storm into your house all of a sudden and start torturing. As I said before innocents should be spared no matter which side they are on. I have always maintained that. We WILL and SHOULD do the background work and ONLY after strong evidence that you ARE aiding some terrorist we will nab you and do the dirty work.
          Then why do you need to torture if you got the info already?
          Chimo

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
            You're moving the goal post.
            Cheering / supporting is the same in my eyes tbh. You are encouraging him and making him believe whatever he is doing is correct.

            That is not a crime.
            What and what is not a crime is debatable. Cyber crimes are still crimes eventhough they are not harming anyone. So will we let them scums go about supporting these hate groups without facing law ?

            That too is not a crime.
            Again, my views are entirely different and you have your own. But supporting terrorism in any form is punishable by law.

            Then why do you need to torture if you got the info already?
            We know you have a hand in it. And we know you are just an arrow and archer is safe hiding somewhere with the help of other arrows . We still need to find the archer and if you are not willing to help then we have ways to extract that info from you.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by commander View Post
              Cheering / supporting is the same in my eyes tbh. You are encouraging him and making him believe whatever he is doing is correct.
              Thought policing.

              Originally posted by commander View Post
              What and what is not a crime is debatable. Cyber crimes are still crimes eventhough they are not harming anyone. So will we let them scums go about supporting these hate groups without facing law ?
              No, it is not debatable. The laws are clearly defined.

              Originally posted by commander View Post
              Again, my views are entirely different and you have your own. But supporting terrorism in any form is punishable by law.
              Cheering is not punishable.

              Originally posted by commander View Post
              We know you have a hand in it. And we know you are just an arrow and archer is safe hiding somewhere with the help of other arrows . We still need to find the archer and if you are not willing to help then we have ways to extract that info from you.
              By that time, it's way too late. Torture is the most useless thing to get real time info. The person could just lie, either to stop the pain or deliberately, and send you on a wild goose chase.
              Chimo

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                Thought policing.
                You are free to think whatever you want, but keep it to yourself and don't support a lunatic who is in a rampage of killing people.

                No, it is not debatable. The laws are clearly defined.
                Man made and not given by GOD himself. A hundred years ago in the US having a slave was permitted by law but is it now ? What are your views about those twitter handlers and facebook admins who propagate IS views and help radicalising more people into joining IS ?

                Cheering is not punishable.
                You call it cheering, I call it aiding a terrorist.

                By that time, it's way too late. Torture is the most useless thing to get real time info. The person could just lie, either to stop the pain or deliberately, and send you on a wild goose chase.
                And we are not going to verify those information or keep a close watch on you again to see your activities afterwards ?

                Comment


                • Again, torturing innocent is not acceptable in any means. ONLY if a connection is established between you and the terrorist which actually lead to the killing of many others is when the innocence argument doesn't matter. What CIA did is wrong , they tortured innocents too. I think I was clear in stating that in the beginning of this debate.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by commander View Post
                    You are free to think whatever you want, but keep it to yourself and don't support a lunatic who is in a rampage of killing people.
                    Freedom of Expression.

                    Originally posted by commander View Post
                    Man made and not given by GOD himself. A hundred years ago in the US having a slave was permitted by law but is it now ?
                    Laws change.

                    Originally posted by commander View Post
                    What are your views about those twitter handlers and facebook admins who propagate IS views and help radicalising more people into joining IS ?
                    Agreeing with the IS is not a crime. Even cheering for it is not a crime. Actually joining and participating in IS activities is.

                    Originally posted by commander View Post
                    You call it cheering, I call it aiding a terrorist.
                    Still not a crime.

                    Originally posted by commander View Post
                    And we are not going to verify those information or keep a close watch on you again to see your activities afterwards ?
                    You're changing the goal post again. You want to torture me just because I might know something.
                    Chimo

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                      Freedom of Expression.
                      Freedom of expression is good, but for good things that can develop humanity and such and not about violence. After all we are living in a civilized world aren't we. Then maybe we can go to stone age where everything was black and white.

                      Laws change.
                      Exactly, they do.

                      Agreeing with the IS is not a crime. Even cheering for it is not a crime. Actually joining and participating in IS activities is.
                      So agreeing with IS you agree to their ideology. You support beheading of innocent people and helping them recruit more foot soldiers so they can rape Kurdish women and sell them in the market ? Kill non believers and go on a rampage?

                      Still not a crime.
                      Based on whether you are cheering for barbaristic activities or a civilized one. And like I said because of hundreds of people cheering for this barbarism the IS is emboldened to increase it's attack on innocent victims. Had everyone condemned would this group have grown to such powerful organization ?

                      You're changing the goal post again. You want to torture me just because I might know something.
                      Nope I didn't. I was clear when I said Innocent should not be harmed whichever side they were on. But what CIA did was the opposite and without evidence that linked those apprehended to the terrorists were tortured I am against it.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by commander View Post
                        Freedom of expression is good, but for good things that can develop humanity and such and not about violence. After all we are living in a civilized world aren't we. Then maybe we can go to stone age where everything was black and white.
                        Either you have freedom of expression or you don't. Freedom of Expression is not about hearing what you want to hear. It is about people expressing ideas that you don't like. You have a right not to listen and you have the right to call them idiots but you do not have the right to slience them.

                        Otherwise, you have thought police. You're only allowed to voice those thoughts that the thought police allows you to. Case in point, North Korea. North Korea wants to go to war because we call Kim fat.

                        Originally posted by commander View Post
                        So agreeing with IS you agree to their ideology. You support beheading of innocent people and helping them recruit more foot soldiers so they can rape Kurdish women and sell them in the market ? Kill non believers and go on a rampage?
                        As long as I don't do any of those things, I can voice my support for them. That is the legal definition of Freedom of Expression. There is no such right as the right not to be offended.

                        Originally posted by commander View Post
                        Based on whether you are cheering for barbaristic activities or a civilized one. And like I said because of hundreds of people cheering for this barbarism the IS is emboldened to increase it's attack on innocent victims. Had everyone condemned would this group have grown to such powerful organization ?
                        I am even more repulsed by thought police.

                        Originally posted by commander View Post
                        Nope I didn't. I was clear when I said Innocent should not be harmed whichever side they were on. But what CIA did was the opposite and without evidence that linked those apprehended to the terrorists were tortured I am against it.
                        But you already assumed guilt by association. I knew Joe Jihardi. He was my friend. Yeah we were together last night. What we did is none of your business.

                        And you're already ready to torture me to find out what we did. For all you know, we were just getting drunk watching a boxing match.
                        Chimo

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
                          Either you have freedom of expression or you don't. Freedom of Expression is not about hearing what you want to hear. It is about people expressing ideas that you don't like. You have a right not to listen and you have the right to call them idiots but you do not have the right to slience them.

                          Otherwise, you have thought police. You're only allowed to voice those thoughts that the thought police allows you to. Case in point, North Korea. North Korea wants to go to war because we call Kim fat.

                          As long as I don't do any of those things, I can voice my support for them. That is the legal definition of Freedom of Expression. There is no such right as the right not to be offended.

                          I am even more repulsed by thought police.

                          But you already assumed guilt by association. I knew Joe Jihardi. He was my friend. Yeah we were together last night. What we did is none of your business.

                          And you're already ready to torture me to find out what we did. For all you know, we were just getting drunk watching a boxing match.
                          So you are saying everything is black and white and tomorrow if a Jihadi preaches beheading in front of your house your police will not arrest him but rather sympathize with him? I understand every human has a right for expression but not at the cost of killing innocent men and women? So why are the governments pounding on those that are helping these terrorist activities then are they all wrong at everybit? Then by your saying someone who is funding the operation is also not culpable because he only provided them with monetary support right ? Also the guy that makes bombs for them is not guilty because hey he is not detonating them but merely making them right ? I understand someone trying to control your thinking is way more dangerous than those terrorists. But come on... what you are saying looks more dangerous to me.

                          What the CIA did was exactly what you are saying. I wasn't supporting that and said only after enough evidence pointing towards your involvement in helping him is what makes you an accomplice and not before,

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by commander View Post
                            So you are saying everything is black and white and tomorrow if a Jihadi preaches beheading in front of your house your police will not arrest him but rather sympathize with him?
                            They will arrest him for violating hate speech laws. Freedom of Expression isn't absolute anywhere. Pretty much every country puts limits on it. If you start shouting in your town square, imploring people to kill all the Jews, your a$$ will be thrown in jail (unless you are in iran or Saudi Arabia, where they will just build a bigger stage for you). But you can't torture people for hate speech, nor does cheering for ISIS or Pakistani terrorists count as hate speech.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by commander View Post
                              So you are saying everything is black and white and tomorrow if a Jihadi preaches beheading in front of your house your police will not arrest him but rather sympathize with him? I understand every human has a right for expression but not at the cost of killing innocent men and women?
                              In the US at least, the police will not sympathize with the preacher, but they will protect him. The police in the US can force you to get a permit that defines when and where you can speak in public, but they cannot deny you the right to speak or tell you what you can or can't say.

                              As a result, we have some groups such as the Westboro Baptist Church, that take advantage of this to preach hate and intollerance. They are almost universally reviled, but the police protect their right to free speech as much as any other group.

                              There are a few exceptions, such as threatening the life of the president, or advocating the overthrow of the government, but outside of these specifically defined areas you can say whatever you want without fear of prosecution from the state.
                              Last edited by SteveDaPirate; 15 Dec 14,, 22:48.

                              Comment


                              • Guys I am not saying that someone who "expresses" his mind should be pounded and anal raped. All I am saying is if proven accomplice you have to face the music. Period. I have never said innocent men and women needs to be thrown in dungeon and given a daily dosage of craziness.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X