This may sound like a stupid question, but what would have happened if Hitler had come clean with the British and French regarding his invasion of Poland so that he could have a common boarder with the USSR? Would they have supported his invasion of Russia or would have things still have turned out as they historically did?
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Originally posted by Rimsey View PostThis may sound like a stupid question, but what would have happened if Hitler had come clean with the British and French regarding his invasion of Poland so that he could have a common boarder with the USSR? Would they have supported his invasion of Russia or would have things still have turned out as they historically did?To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato
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Originally posted by Minskaya View PostHitler's decision to invade Poland was made in May of 1939, months before the summer/autumn ultimatums to Poland. Ergo, Poland's response to the Danzig ultimatums was a moot point.
In fact, on the day before the invasion Hitler thru his foreign minister offered to scrap the invasion if Poland would agree to give up Danzig and hold a plebiscite in the Polish Corridor.
I've read opinions that say Hitler did not really want to mount a full scale invasion because the cost in men and material could crimp his plans for invading the USSR. Another opinion is that Hitler didn't want to provoke France and Britain into a war until he had subjugated the USSR. He also had visions, or should I say, fantasies, of a Europe dominated by Germany and Britain.
But back to the what-if, if Poland had no promise from France and Britain to come to its aid, it's reasonable to entertain the theory that Poland would have given in on the Danzig ultimatum and lived on as an independent, though weakened state for a while, perhaps indefinitely.To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato
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If Britain and France had acted more forcefully over Abyssinia, Spain, Rhineland, Austria, Munich, Anglo-German naval agreement and Romania its entirely possible that Hitler could have been stopped. Western indulgence encouraged him to reckless and ultimately doomed abandon.
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Originally posted by JAD_333 View PostAnd the date for the invasion was set for Sept 1. However in the meantime, various proposals (ultimatums) were issued and rejected by Poland. Hitler seemed to be looking for a way to avoid an invasion.sigpic
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Originally posted by Officer of Engineers View PostI would love to have seen the Invasion of the Sudetenland moved forward.To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato
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Originally posted by Minskaya View PostThe Hitler ultimatums concerning Danzig contained demands (population transfers), concessions (loss of sea access), and restrictions (plebiscite voting) that Poland could not possibly have accepted. In addition, Poland well knew what had happened to Czechoslovakia (March 1939) after its concession of the Sudetenland (October 1938).To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato
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Originally posted by Minskaya View PostBoth Britain and France had signed a mutual defense pact with Poland. Hitler well knew and understood the consequences of 1 September 1939.
People also forget that it wasn't the Wehrmacht that brought Poland down.It was the Red Army.Without the Soviets,the Poles can hold on for a long time.
The Germans were in dire need for an operational pause,while the Poles were getting,finally ,into some defensible positions,and were in the process of rebuilding their force.Yeah,they lost big,but all was not lost.Those who know don't speak
He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
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Originally posted by Mihais View PostNo,he didn't.He always presumed things will turn out as previously.When it came to war he hoped to limit it in Poland.Only when it became clear the show's for real they started to plan the invasion of the West.They were forced to escalate in that sense.While the Allies had put themselves into a corner by their previous indecisions. People also forget that it wasn't the Wehrmacht that brought Poland down.It was the Red Army.Without the Soviets,the Poles can hold on for a long time. The Germans were in dire need for an operational pause,while the Poles were getting,finally ,into some defensible positions,and were in the process of rebuilding their force.Yeah,they lost big,but all was not lost.
Poland could have held the Wehrmacht at bay for a long time? C'mon Mihais. Are you serious?sigpic
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Well,too bad Churchill became PM 8 months after the war started.
What I said is strictly related to how the Germans viewed the situation at the time.They were not hell bent on starting WW2 and taking over the world.
As for Poland,if you actually study the operations,you'll come to some very surprising conclusions.They took a beating at the border,but much of their reserves came from the Eastern part of Poland and were in the process of getting into defensive positions.Moreover,their strategy revolved around getting supplies from the West through the Romanian Corridor.They also built a large merchant fleet,planned to transport said supplies from the West to Constanta,and then up to Lvov by rail.Poland was in no way decisevely defeated at the time of Soviet invasion.Those who know don't speak
He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36
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"...They also built a large merchant fleet,planned to transport said supplies from the West to Constanta,and then up to Lvov by rail.Poland was in no way decisevely defeated at the time of Soviet invasion."
I know nothing of this but, if true (and it easily could be), as events proved it remains nothing more than a distraction. Unless the vessels were loaded and inbound on Sept. 1st, there's no way the end-user would benefit from their largesse before the Germans put paid to their objectives.
This was going to be a rapidly done deal with or without the Soviet Union piling on. Polish heroics aside, "the correlation of forces" were decidedly unfavorable for Poland."This aggression will not stand, man!" Jeff Lebowski
"The only true currency in this bankrupt world is what you share with someone else when you're uncool." Lester Bangs
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Originally posted by S2 View Post
This was going to be a rapidly done deal with or without the Soviet Union piling on. Polish heroics aside, "the correlation of forces" were decidedly unfavorable for Poland.
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