What if: Western Allies vs Russia- 1945

[zraver]

Zraver,

If all that you say is true then why did Eisenhower do everything possible to appease Stalin and the Red Army when Churchill, Patton and Montgomery were urging Eishenhower to take Berlin, Prague, and Vienna?

Becuase Eisenhower wasn't the man calling the shots. While Churchhill was a national leader, in truth he had little to offer and was force dby the situation to walk in lock step with the Americans, something he freely admitted. The real man calling the shots was FDR and then Truman. If the US President had said go, we would have gone.

[stasha]

Should Russia pay compensation for their victims?

I found this "Russia Today" news hard to believe, putting Israel down for how compensation money is/has been spent. My question is when Russia will be held responsable for the victims they created?

One more note, "Holocaust" implys Jewish victims, the victims were also Roman/ Greek Catholic's and yes Jewish. We must include all Poles (as this was the real victim)or rename Holocaust where 50% are not left out.


January 27, 2008, 10:52
Israel's shame as Holocaust victims die in poverty
About 80,000 Holocaust survivors emigrated to Israel after WW2. Instead of finding ease and opportunity, many discovered only loneliness and grinding poverty. They accuse Israel of failing to give them the compensation paid by Germany. They say millions of dollars that was meant for them has been used to build the country instead.

RussiaToday : Features : Israel's shame as Holocaust victims die in poverty

[foxhound_nn]

do you want to say that there are more Russia's victims than America's (taking into the account not only Iraq, Afganistan and Balkan wars, but also Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Guantanoma and even racial segregation of the XX. In one word, taking into the account all the possible) or than Britain's (with their colonization) or ... ?

It's very disputable question. There is no any saint country in the world.

ps. this theme is completely off-topic in this thread.

[zraver]

do you want to say that there are more Russia's victims than America's (taking into the account not only Iraq, Afganistan and Balkan wars, but also Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Guantanoma and even racial segregation of the XX. In one word, taking into the account all the possible) or than Britain's (with their colonization) or ... ?

It's very disputable question. There is no any saint country in the world.

ps. this theme is completely off-topic in this thread.

What are you trying to say? If you are trying to white wash Russia's imperial and communist past it won't work. Just like you cannot whitewash any major powers past power is always built with the bones of the defeated and washed with the blood of innocents.

[stasha]

do you want to say that there are more Russia's victims than America's (taking into the account not only Iraq, Afganistan and Balkan wars, but also Hiroshima and Nagasaki, Guantanoma and even racial segregation of the XX. In one word, taking into the account all the possible) or than Britain's (with their colonization) or ... ?

It's very disputable question. There is no any saint country in the world.

ps. this theme is completely off-topic in this thread.

The date is 1945, that takes us to WW2. I am saying the "Russian's" should have to compensate the families that lost their homes. In eastern Poland the families were taken from their property and sent to Siberia to slave and die, Poland is giving the compensation (deadline is 12/2008) for family to place a claim. My question is why Russia is not paying this tab?

[foxhound_nn]

What are you trying to say? If you are trying to white wash Russia's imperial and communist past it won't work.

Did i say that Russia has not victims? no. try to read post again. Moreover i didn't say anything about Russia's imperial and communist past

any major powers past power is always built with the bones of the defeated and washed with the blood of innocents.

agree

The date is 1945, that takes us to WW2. I am saying the "Russian's" should have to compensate the families that lost their homes. In eastern Poland the families were taken from their property and sent to Siberia to slave and die, Poland is giving the compensation (deadline is 12/2008) for family to place a claim. My question is why Russia is not paying this tab?

I can't understand, why do you think that these are the only people that should get compensation? why Iraqi, Afghan, Balkan peoples, Hiroshima and Nagasaki (+btw Dresden) citizens, Huantanoma prisoners and so on shouldn't?

[reve893]

The allies would had definitely won. They had a technological lead in everything, better forces, and you have to face it they didn't suffer as much as the Soviet Union. They would had probably rallied the Germans together, to attack the Soviet Union. This was what many German Military commanders wished for.

[Sinister]

Impossible , completly impossible , it would never happen , just imagine the huge losses when INVADING something sheer sized as soviet union , the allies would never do something like that , and right after a major war as the WW2? No chance , and if they did well they did have most advantagas back then Soviet union was exhausted , they would probably have alot of edge but then again I never say anything for 100% when it comes too soviet union no matter the facts , Napoleon and Hitler both thought they would win easly and look what happened , so even if I would give a big edge too west I still can't say that they would definatly win.

[reve893]

this is all hypothetical, of course that many of the scenarios that we discuss would be impossible. But I agree with you it would never had happened. It has always appeared that the Soviet Union has an indefinite source of manpower to take bullets.

[clackers]

this is all hypothetical, of course that many of the scenarios that we discuss would be impossible. But I agree with you it would never had happened. It has always appeared that the Soviet Union has an indefinite source of manpower to take bullets.

As Montgomery once told the House of Lords, Reve: "Rule 1, on page 1 of the book of war, is: "Do not march on Moscow". Various people have tried it ..."

[zraver]

this is all hypothetical, of course that many of the scenarios that we discuss would be impossible. But I agree with you it would never had happened. It has always appeared that the Soviet Union has an indefinite source of manpower to take bullets.

Not in May 1945 they didn't. Germany had finally bled the Russian's white, but not before running out of men herself. By mid 44 the Russian's were facing a situation simialr to the Brits. They had to call off the war with Finland and increasingly substituted fire for men. if you believe the doctors plot Stalin was planning to wage war in 54. Thats a 9 year recovery from ww2.

[dark-alias]

The US and its Allies would of have Russia on its knees begging for peace by 47, Russia would of been left with no infrastructure, no Nat. Res., and cut off from the rest of the world

[Officer of Engineers]

This point has been raised before. In 1945, Stalin had the Manchurian and Korean factories ... and if need be, Korean and Chinese armies.

[dark-alias]

I respectfully disagree. If it were our (the west) intentions to take the motherland, we would of set events and "mark's" in motion to make sure we would be succesful in neutralizing those assets. side-note. you have got to love that we have the pacific and atlantic to fall back on eyyy ol boy.

[omon]

If it were our (the west) intentions to take the motherland, we would of set events and "mark's" in motion to make sure we would be succesful in neutralizing those assets. .

such as?????????