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Thread: Operation Varsity: books?

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    Operation Varsity: books?

    Hello folks

    I've recently thought about buying some refence book(s) on Operation Varsity. My usuall supplier being Osprey, I checked their site.

    Shock, horror. They have no books on the largest airborne opp in history. Shame!

    So, I went to the net... and found dozens of books :(

    Can anyone point me to a good book about Operation Varsity, that includes both the US and UK parts? I'm not looking for a full scale, all out, squad-by-squad description. The fact that I usually buy Osprey should tell you what I prefer...
    Last edited by jlvfr; 08 Jun 09, at 11:50.

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    I don't know of any books but the movie just came out on dvd and is well worth buying especially for the 40 minute documentary. I found it for a great price on amazon. I would also be interested in renting/buying other documentaries on Operation Valkyrie if they exist. Does anyone know of any?

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    Lord High Hullabalooster Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
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    Varsity, not Valkyrie. Operation Varsity was an Allied airborne push over the Rhine. It's best-known for being questioned at the time and ever since as perhaps an unnecessary "showcase" battle, since the Rhine had already been crossed in multiple places by the time the curtain went up.

    Operation Varsity.

    -dale

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    Quote Originally Posted by dalem View Post
    Varsity, not Valkyrie. Operation Varsity was an Allied airborne push over the Rhine. It's best-known for being questioned at the time and ever since as perhaps an unnecessary "showcase" battle, since the Rhine had already been crossed in multiple places by the time the curtain went up.

    Operation Varsity.

    -dale
    Yep, that's the one.

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    Wow, I obviously didn't have enough coffee yesterday. My mistake. But regardless, Valkyrie is a great flick.

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    Lord High Hullabalooster Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
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    Hard to see how heroifying a pack of Nazi scumbags is a good idea.

    -dale

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    Senior Contributor clackers's Avatar
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    I'm sure you're not the sort of tiresome drunk who mouths off without serious facts behind their opinions, Dale, so maybe you can tell us which of the participants in Operation Valkyrie was a Nazi scumbag?

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    Lord High Hullabalooster Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clackers View Post
    I'm sure you're not the sort of tiresome drunk who mouths off without serious facts behind their opinions, Dale, so maybe you can tell us which of the participants in Operation Valkyrie was a Nazi scumbag?
    Oh, I don't know, maybe I'd hazard a guess that the actual NAZIS that planned and (partially) executed the plot were all Nazi scumbags? You know, the guys with the leather boots and the German-sounding names and the blood of millions of soldiers and civilians on their hands? Those guys?

    -dale

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    Senior Contributor clackers's Avatar
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    Ah, I remember you now from another thread!

    You're a climate change denier! You think it's impossible for the presence of CO2 molecules to cause a rise in the surrounding temperature!

    Well, it seems your knowledge of the Third Reich matches your knowledge of physical science.

    Let's see.

    Wasn't the idea of the Valkyrie conspirators to remove from power or even kill the 'Nazi scumbags' you're talking about?

    And the argument contained in your 'reply' seems to be based on two definitions.

    If so, which of the conspirators were 'ACTUAL' (your capitalized word) members of the Nazi Party?

    And which of the supposed scumbags faced charges after the war at Nuremberg for having innocent blood on their hands (or would have, if they had survived)?

    Looking forward to hearing from you!
    Last edited by clackers; 11 Jun 09, at 13:48.

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    And all I wanted was a book on Varsity... :(

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    Lord High Hullabalooster Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
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    Well, I don't know how many of them were card-carrying members of the Nazi Party, but they carried their water for them, fought their battles for them, did their dirtywork for them, and swore an oath to the chief one, so they are equivalent. I'm perfectly comfortable with slinging the epithet "Nazi scumbag" around under the above conditions.

    -dale

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    Senior Contributor clackers's Avatar
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    Disgraceful.

    Millions of Germans served in the war effort who weren't Nazi scumbags.

    Here's a list of those who suffered after the Plot.

    They aren't just the frightened military men like Stieff, in the minority amongst a whole bunch of assenting colleagues. Amongst your 'Nazi scumbags' didn't you know there were also the headmistress of a boarding school, a prominent Catholic theologian, union leaders, councillors and lawyers?

    List of members of the 20 July plot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    You need something like Joachim Fest's Plotting Hitler's Death: The German Resistance to Hitler, 1933–1945 if you only know as much about Germany and its people as you do physics.

  13. #13
    Lord High Hullabalooster Senior Contributor dalem's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by clackers View Post
    Disgraceful.

    Millions of Germans served in the war effort who weren't Nazi scumbags.

    Here's a list of those who suffered after the Plot.

    They aren't just the frightened military men like Stieff, in the minority amongst a whole bunch of assenting colleagues. Amongst your 'Nazi scumbags' didn't you know there were also the headmistress of a boarding school, a prominent Catholic theologian, union leaders, councillors and lawyers?

    List of members of the 20 July plot - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    You need something like Joachim Fest's Plotting Hitler's Death: The German Resistance to Hitler, 19331945 if you only know as much about Germany and its people as you do physics.
    a) Sorry I peed on your religion. But is it relevant here?

    b) Maybe they should of done something about it then. Something effective. I have no sympathy for the conscript Wehrmacht landser or the jackbooted card-carrying Nazi colonel - they both served the same end.

    -dale

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    Senior Contributor clackers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dalem View Post
    a) Sorry I peed on your religion. But is it relevant here?
    Well, I did see why concepts like infrared radiation and dipole moment must actually seem like mysticism to you, Dale.

    And yes, your superficial, boorish comment about the members of the German Resistance comes from the same uneducated place.

    Quote Originally Posted by dalem View Post
    b) Maybe they should of done something about it then.
    Absolutely staggering, Dale.

    People are watching you dig yourself deeper and deeper into your hole.

    You do realise the movie is about people who died trying to do exactly that?


    Quote Originally Posted by dalem View Post
    Something effective. I have no sympathy for the conscript Wehrmacht landser or the jackbooted card-carrying Nazi colonel - they both served the same end.
    This is veering very close to racial villification, Dale, which is not a good look for an international web forum.

    If you really blame an entire population directly for the crimes of the Nazi leaders, I wish you well on your next visit to Germany ... I'm sure any German readers of this forum will be rapt to meet you. Best of luck with that.

    I won't hold my breath about you actually doing something about your lack of knowledge on the subject, and say, reading the Fest book on the Resistance.

    After all, he's a Kraut, you know!

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    Quote Originally Posted by clackers View Post
    I won't hold my breath about you actually doing something about your lack of knowledge on the subject, and say, reading the Fest book on the Resistance.

    After all, he's a Kraut, you know!
    clackers

    I think that, what dalem is trying to say is, that the people who planned and executed Valkyrie, only took direct action against Hitler when Germany already lost the war.
    Last edited by gabriel; 17 Jun 09, at 09:41.

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