If Germany had won WWI

**Speedy** · 15 Jun 05, 19:23

Originally Posted by bigross86

I think there would have been an Israeli state eventually, even though WWII would never have happened.

Hitler roes to power because of the German people's unsatisfaction with the current regime, the economic failure and meltdown, and the loss of WWI. If Germany won WWI, then the Jews would not have een seen in such an unfavorable light, Hitler would never have risen to power, and the Zionist movement was already gathering steam in the Post-WWI days. Granted, the state might have come in the 1950-60's instead of 1948, but Israel would have a lot more international support aside from the US, UK and France. Plus, the Arabs would not have been such an issue, because the Soviet Revolution would also be affected by the German victory, and they would not have become a superpower, by extension not supplying the Arab nations with cheap weaopnry.

Why would the Ottomans give up their territory?

**Felix** · 16 Jun 05, 11:02

For a little money or other support I think they would.

And you should keep in mind that the ottoman empire was well in decline at the turn of the century, thus there is the question how long it would have stayed a unified nation even after a victorious WW1. The large ethnic differences and problems would eventually lead to a civil war and thus destroy the empire.

**lwarmonger** · 17 Jun 05, 02:46

Originally Posted by Felix

For a little money or other support I think they would.

And you should keep in mind that the ottoman empire was well in decline at the turn of the century, thus there is the question how long it would have stayed a unified nation even after a victorious WW1. The large ethnic differences and problems would eventually lead to a civil war and thus destroy the empire.

And if Germany decided to prop up the Ottoman government? I bet they would, just like they would help to prop up the Austro-Hungarians.

**Felix** · 17 Jun 05, 11:19

The problem is that it was already much too late to do that.
The ottoman empire started to fall apart with the independance of the blakan states, there would have been no chance to stop an ongoing decay except by a strong turn of internal politics, whihc is very unlikely to happen.

**lwarmonger** · 18 Jun 05, 02:24

Originally Posted by Felix

The problem is that it was already much too late to do that.
The ottoman empire started to fall apart with the independance of the blakan states, there would have been no chance to stop an ongoing decay except by a strong turn of internal politics, whihc is very unlikely to happen.

Who said anything about stopping it? The Ottoman Empire was an anachronism at that point in history, and was just as doomed as the Austro-Hungarian Empire. However, Germany could have propped it up for decades, simply by showing support. If they were willing to intervene militarily.....? Eventually it would have come apart, probably during a WWII situation (quite a bit different from historical WWII) when Germany was distracted, but as it was having problems, I doubt it would surrender any of it's territory willingly. Collapsing entities feel a greater need to retain territory than most, simply because if they don't, then those who are restless under their rule will see it as a sign of weakness and revolt.

**Speedy** · 18 Jun 05, 03:30

Another point is how long would the balkan states such as Serbia stay independant without support from Russia?

**The Chap** · 04 Nov 05, 07:14

Long story short ...

Anyone with a surname containing:
berg
blum
gold
green
cohen
etc.

would be most unhappy.

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