Answer to NUS as regards the World Trade Centre destruction

[NUS]

The conspiracy theorists still rankle me big time. For any of those theories to even begin to be plausable (ignoring the basic physics) they have to involve thousands of government workers, military, firemen, police etc all willing to sacrifice not only their fellow Americans but also their co-workers and friends. The insult to those people is enormous and I find such beliefs despicable.

Pardon me for asking, but why do you think they have to involve thousands of people? According to official version, it was a dosen of unedicated terrorist. I dont know much 9/11 conspiracy theories, so can you explain this to me?

And can anyone tell me why in your opinoin this attack happend? Was there any rational reason for terrorists?

[Parihaka]

Pardon me for asking, but why do you think they have to involve thousands of people? According to official version, it was a dosen of unedicated terrorist. I dont know much 9/11 conspiracy theories, so can you explain this to me?

The standard conspiracy is that the WTC was demolished using demolition charges: that it was a missile that struck the pentagon: that Silverstein ordered the NYFD to 'pull" (demolish) WTC 7: that the planes which were observed to crash weren't the original passenger planes but specially adapted versions and that the passengers of hte original planes were disappeared in the same way as the passengers of flight 77.

So, some of the NYFD were in it because they 'pulled' WTC7: The port authority were in it because they ordered it: the buildings security personnel were in it because it takes weeks to prep any substantial building let alone the WTC complex: the military and CIA were in it because only they had the capabilities to fire a missile at the pentagon and substitute the planes as well as killing the original flights passengers: and of course the Bush administration were in it because they ordered it.
Here's a current list of the Administration and associated leaders and scientists all involved in the conspiracy
Who Did It? - Conspirators

and yes of course, it was the Jews wot dun it.

[NUS]

The standard conspiracy is that the WTC was demolished using demolition charges: that it was a missile that struck the pentagon: that Silverstein ordered the NYFD to 'pull" (demolish) WTC 7: that the planes which were observed to crash weren't the original passenger planes but specially adapted versions and that the passengers of hte original planes were disappeared in the same way as the passengers of flight 77.

Thank you for an answer. But without exotic variants like demolition charges, if we take an official version and replace AQ with any conspirators you want, does it requires thousands of people?

And thank you for creation of separate thread. Original thread was not the best place for such discussion.

[Parihaka]

Thank you for an answer. But without exotic variants like demolition charges, if we take an official version and replace AQ with any conspirators you want, does it requires thousands of people?

You mean what happened is as it seemed but it wasn't the named terrorists or AQ that did it?

And thank you for creation of separate thread. Original thread was not the best place for such discussion.

No worries

[NUS]

You mean what happened is as it seemed but it wasn't the named terrorists or AQ that did it?

Yes, something like this. Let's look at this as an exercise in logic. You've said any conspiracy theory requires a lot of people to act together. My question is - can this be done with a small force, like in offical version of events, but with another lidership?

[Mihais]

Look,you obviously imply it can.I saw this line of thought,because we're in the same neighborhood and share the same distrust of everything official,in the end .And I think you're absolutely right.Yes some other leadership could have done it,just as it's possible some intel agencies learned about it and kept quiet(or even interceded in the chain of command).

The big question is :does it matter who did it?I'd say the result matters more.
Another more relevant question would be cui prodest?In this case I 'd say everyone gains more than the Americans from their decade long muddling in the ME.The Israelis gain a decade of relative peace,and Saddam being dead.The late Osama gets the Americans where he wanted.The Arab potentates got another decade of reign.The Chinese got the Americans distracted from their area.
Compared with those,even the presumed gains the American oil companies had in Iraq(which to be fair,weren't at all what was expected,since the Russians,Chinese etc...got a bigger share) don't justify the Americans to do it.

[Chogy]

The difference is simple...

The 9-11 events, as they actually took place, could be done with 25 people.

In huge contrast, if 9-11 had been executed as the favored conspiracy theories say it did, it would have required probably thousands.

Thus, the more likely scenario is the published scenario... OBL, al Quaeda, and a handful of suicide hijackers pulled it off. Not hundreds of firemen, ATC people, airline personnel, dozens of tons of high explosives, etc.

[USSWisconsin]

George H.W. Bush — Bush crime family Don; Skull and Bones; CIA operative involved in JFK assassination; former head of CIA; son of friend shot Reagan when he was VP; war profiteer

Who Did It? - Conspirators

I see - now it is clear - the webmaster has stopped taking his meds ...

[ArmchairGeneral]

The difference is simple...

The 9-11 events, as they actually took place, could be done with 25 people.

In huge contrast, if 9-11 had been executed as the favored conspiracy theories say it did, it would have required probably thousands.

Thus, the more likely scenario is the published scenario... OBL, al Quaeda, and a handful of suicide hijackers pulled it off. Not hundreds of firemen, ATC people, airline personnel, dozens of tons of high explosives, etc.

NUS is proposing a third scenario, however, which does not require thousands of people, because it is identical to the published scenario, only with different players. Which certainly takes care of the 'thousands of people' objection, but introduces plenty of other problems.

[Parihaka]

Yes, something like this. Let's look at this as an exercise in logic. You've said any conspiracy theory requires a lot of people to act together. My question is - can this be done with a small force, like in offical version of events, but with another lidership?

No I've said the standard conspiracy theories I outlined above require thousands of people. As regards your scenario, yes it can but in real life still requires the willful compliance of thousands of intelligence officers post event. To get a large group of those intelligence personnel to continue barking up the wrong tree would be no mean feat in itself.

[JAD_333]

Anyone really interested in how the US connected AQ to the 9/11 attack ought to read a new book out by the FBI interrogator who established the connection. The book is called Black Banners It's written by former FBI agent Ali Soufan, a Lebanese-American who also connected AQ to the Cole bombing. I just bought the book and can't wait to read it.

An Interrogator Writes 'The Inside Story Of 9/11' : NPR

Here is a fascinating story about Soufan and his work at the FBI. This will blow any doubts that AQ masterminded the 9/11 attack and why.

A Reporter at Large: The Agent : The New Yorker

[Repatriated Canuck]

Yes, something like this. Let's look at this as an exercise in logic. You've said any conspiracy theory requires a lot of people to act together. My question is - can this be done with a small force, like in offical version of events, but with another lidership?

There are documentary/reality shows on TV now about explosive demolition. Watch one and you will see why hiding that process would be flat out impossible.

[Doktor]

I remember watching one on Discovery where they postponed demolition because of the bad weather. Plus, it took them 2 months to plant all the charges right in an empty building without electricity.