remains of 4 pre-term infants found

[astralis]

all over the local news today. almost lost my breakfast reading this, and it's not for the faint of heart.

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Remains of 4 Pre-Term Infants Found - TIME

Remains of 4 Pre-Term Infants Found

Tuesday, Jul. 31, 2007 By AP/KRISTEN WYATT Article (OCEAN CITY, Md.) — The remains of four pre-term infants found in and around a modest home in this resort town were being examined to see whether the woman charged with murdering one of the babies is the mother of all four.

The grisly discoveries came to light after Christy Freeman was admitted to a hospital with bleeding last week. Doctors found that she'd recently given birth, but had no baby. An investigation has uncovered four tiny sets of remains.

Bulldozers on Tuesday were to resume digging in a vacant lot next to Freeman's apartment. Ocean City Police Spokesman Barry Neeb said cadaver dogs led police to believe there may be more remains in the yard, but none had been found.

"To this time right now, we have not found any additional remains," Ocean City Police Chief Bernadette DiPino said Monday evening.

Freeman, the mother of four living children, was charged with murder and manslaughter and denied bond Monday. She was being held in the Worcester County jail awaiting an Aug. 27 preliminary hearing.

A search of Freeman's home revealed the first 26-week-old boy. Investigators say the remains were wrapped in a bloodied towel and hidden under a bathroom vanity.

While searching for the boy, authorities also uncovered two more sets of fetal remains, plus some matter that appeared to be a placenta, wrapped in plastic in a trunk in Freeman's bedroom.

Police say Freeman's interview also led them to a Winnebago parked in her yard, where a fourth set of remains was found.

In her bond hearing, Freeman, a taxicab company owner, professed her innocence but did not offer any clues about what happened. "I want to clear my name in this case," she said.

Freeman's longtime boyfriend and the father of their four children, Raymond W. Godman Jr., has not been charged, and their children were in his custody. "At this point, he is not a suspect, but we are not ruling anyone out," DiPino said.

According to prosecutors, Godman said he found his girlfriend bleeding in the bathroom last Thursday. When rescuers arrived, Freeman told them she was not and had not recently been pregnant, according to prosecutors.

Later she told police she had delivered a deformed baby and that she had flushed the remains down the toilet. According to prosecutors, though, the baby was viable, with hands, feet and facial features.

Authorities offered few details to explain why they thought the pre-term infants belonged to Freeman or why they think she murdered at least one. Murder charges were filed before a medical examiner's report was complete.

Prosecutors also would not say how old the other pre-term infants were when they died, although none was thought to be a full-term baby.

"We don't know how much time lapsed between the time they were delivered and the time they were discovered," DiPino said.

[ArmchairGeneral]

Peter Singer, eat your heart out.

[Kansas Bear]

Saw it on the news channel.............

[glyn]

What a wicked world we live in. These people don't deserve to be known as sentient creatures.

[gunnut]

I think I saw in the news that said the police has determined the fetuses to be hers. My question is how did she get 4 fetuses out of her, and then stash them around the house?

[pdf27]

Ummm... before I stick my head above the parapet here, I'd like to make it clear I don't approve of this sort of thing, but...

How is this different from legal abortion? From the news article it appears that the babies were pre-term and hence could legally be killed - in that the mother could have an abortion. If, as seems likely, she carried out some sort of abortion on herself then the only person likely to be injured apart from the baby (which remember is legal in law, whatever I may think about the morality of it) is the woman herself. As IIRC self-harm is not a crime, how has she done anything wrong in law?

[dave lukins]

Originally Posted by gunnut

I think I saw in the news that said the police has determined the fetuses to be hers. My question is how did she get 4 fetuses out of her, and then stash them around the house?

Stillborns over a period of years could be an answer. Can't understand why the Father hasn't been charged..unless she hid the pregnancies from him. A sad case which may have a suprise ending.

[gunnut]

Originally Posted by pdf27

Ummm... before I stick my head above the parapet here, I'd like to make it clear I don't approve of this sort of thing, but...

How is this different from legal abortion? From the news article it appears that the babies were pre-term and hence could legally be killed - in that the mother could have an abortion. If, as seems likely, she carried out some sort of abortion on herself then the only person likely to be injured apart from the baby (which remember is legal in law, whatever I may think about the morality of it) is the woman herself. As IIRC self-harm is not a crime, how has she done anything wrong in law?

Aha, she's not licensed to perform abortions on herself.

I think we can get her on operating without a license.

Or maybe she had the abortions and then asked the doctor to keep her fetus as a...trophy, momento...whatever.

That's a very good point you raised, pdf27. How is killing a fetus in a clinic acceptable but abortion anywhere else is murder?

We had a huge thread not long ago discussing the legal and ethical facet of abortion.

Basically, if abortion is legal, then why is killing a pregnant mother count as committing 2 murders?

Why is beating your own girlfriend, with her consent no less, to abort the child, a murder? This is a true story by the way. The teen father is facing murder charges for performing an abortion without license.

[astralis]

gunnut,

How is killing a fetus in a clinic acceptable but abortion anywhere else is murder?

why is vigilante hanging of a criminal bad, and court-ordered hanging of a criminal good?

okay, okay, that's all i'm going to say about THIS one, before i help start another conflagration of a thread on WAB.

[dave lukins]

Originally Posted by astralis

gunnut,



why is vigilante hanging of a criminal bad, and court-ordered hanging of a criminal good?

okay, okay, that's all i'm going to say about THIS one, before i help start another conflagration of a thread on WAB.

Process of the Law..trial by peers..Innocent 'til proven otherwise ..Punishment Different States/Countries different punishment

Astralis,if we all agreed to each others points, the WAB would be boring. Your views and comments,provided there is an element of "research" are as valid as the next persons.

[pdf27]

Originally Posted by gunnut

Aha, she's not licensed to perform abortions on herself.
I think we can get her on operating without a license.

Doesn't matter - the legal position in the US which permits Abortion is as I understand it that a foetus is part of a woman's body. Thus, she wouldn't need a license - instead she would be operating in the same category as those who self-harm. Unless they are prosecuted in the US for carrying out operations without a license when they cut themselves, again the law would be inconsistent if it could be held against her.

[gunnut]

Originally Posted by pdf27

Doesn't matter - the legal position in the US which permits Abortion is as I understand it that a foetus is part of a woman's body. Thus, she wouldn't need a license - instead she would be operating in the same category as those who self-harm. Unless they are prosecuted in the US for carrying out operations without a license when they cut themselves, again the law would be inconsistent if it could be held against her.

I completely agree with you. Our laws are inconsistant at best, outright lunacy at worst.

Now that you've mentioned it, I think I'll donate to her legal defense fund just to piss off the pro-abortion crowd.

[sappersgt]

Originally Posted by dave lukins

Stillborns over a period of years could be an answer. Can't understand why the Father hasn't been charged..unless she hid the pregnancies from him. A sad case which may have a suprise ending.

Giving birth to stillborn children is not a crime. She might be guilty of not reporting a death, which might or might not be construed as obstruction of justice. What waits to be seen is whether the children were born alive or not which will determine any further charges. A sad case no matter what the outcome.

[gunnut]

Originally Posted by sappersgt

Giving birth to stillborn children is not a crime. She might be guilty of not reporting a death, which might or might not be construed as obstruction of justice. What waits to be seen is whether the children were born alive or not which will determine any further charges. A sad case no matter what the outcome.

Early reports suggests these fetuses were definitely viable.