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Reply With QuoteColonel, from what I could read the Big E, was shadowed by Soviet sub(s) and left the Bay in a matter of week(s).Originally Posted by Officer of Engineers
Maybe she was departing to Vietnam when IA cancelled the operation?
The US was probably at one of its lowest points as far as feeling like 1 nation. Hippies v squares, Republican v Democrat, black v white, man v woman it was a very divided time.
Colonel, from what I could read the Big E, was shadowed by Soviet sub(s) and left the Bay in a matter of week(s).
Maybe she was departing to Vietnam when IA cancelled the operation?
No such thing as a good tax - Churchill
To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.
No one knew outside of India (even very few in India) knew of this op until a few years ago.
Chimo
Sir , is there any official or unofficial source for this that I can refer to ??
The only source I know is the son of a member of the ambulance that took part. He is our very own respected WAB's Lemontree, a retired Captain of the Indian Army and he told us all we know.
We filled a few blanks here and there, ie this was a brigade sized op and that the initial entry force was only hours away from jumping, mainly due to experience on what's needed and the timing of such an op.
Chimo
As Z has pointed out the US was very divided at the end of the 1960s. We were roiling from the vocal anti-war movement which gained great momentum the previous year over the the Cambodian Invasion coupled with campus protest which culminated in the Kent State shootings. While the civil rights movement had been succesful in the previous decade in getting some legislation passed there was still some wide divides in our society.
The government was trying to wind down the Viet Nam war and DOD was already studying how to do away with conscription.
Drug use was rampant in civil society as well as in the military....and that is not just illegal drug use. Alcohol consumption was very high.
Most Americans could not tell you back then about East and West Pakistan and India other than places which appeared in fundraising ads for CARE, UNICEF and a host of other aid organizations.
Nixon realized that the country would not follow him into a war on the subcontinent of Asia.
Remember that it is the Actions and not the Commission that make the Officer and that there is More expected from him than the title. GEORGE WASHINGTON
But getting the Big E away from attacking the InN and rescuing one of their own would accomplish the same.
Chimo
Yes and it would give the necessary ammunition to Nixon to galvanize the nation and follow him into another war and against India. Sure the operation would work, but it would be sheer national suicide. USSR would not save India despite the friendship pact.
Hitesh,
The historic fact was that the decision to launch that op was taken. It was countermanded later. It can only mean that the facts available to make that decision were considered.
Chimo
Hitesh,
Read my post at #51.
America was not about to get involved in another war in Asia as it was trying to get out of the one it was already involved in South East Asia. Congress would not have appropriated the long term funding.
And the US did nto yet see that area as key to our vital interests. Our focus had shifted to Europe and the very real problem that due to the Viet Nam war and friction with France NATO had fallen into disrepair. The US had to focus its resources on NATO and how to get our land forces out of Viet Nam.
Nixon and the JCS knew the Army, and to some extent the Marines, was broken and could not afford a fight with India while trying to start the long, hard slog to get NATO back to where it could be a deterrent. If NATO had been stronger I don't know that there could have been a Prague 68.
Remember that it is the Actions and not the Commission that make the Officer and that there is More expected from him than the title. GEORGE WASHINGTON
the US would HAVE to respond if the indians attacked the Big E or Diego Garcia, though.
wonder what the response would have been.
There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov
Depends, what if the target was DG, but the goal was to get the Big E out of the BoB until the InA concluded its operations. The InA lands, seizes the seebees, the Big E responds retakin the island, India has a few dwad a bunch of POWs, the US has a few dead and a bunch of feed prisoners and Pakistan is broken in two.
What did the InN have at sea,
how much of the InAF interceptor capability was in the East
Could the Phantom's escort the B-52's to India
How many carriers were on Yankee Station.
Did the Soviet Union pressure India to begin the moves to draw pressure off of Vietnam?
Doesn't matter. India attacked a US territory or base and it demands a military response. Never has been in the history of United states history did US fail to respond with overwhelming or disproportionate response or with fury to a military attack no mater how dire the economic or social situation was.
The majority of the public including Congress would be sufficiently galvanized to give Nixon free license to punish India by authorizing air raids in support of Pakistan. US would be carpet bombing left and right on Indian cities and military bases and forces until India cries mommy and accede to Pakistan's demands, including loss of massive territory such as complete handover of Kashmir, several key areas around East Bengal (Pakistan) and Pakistan would have crushed the fledgling independence movement with USAF and USN's help. Nixon would not go for ground troops but he sure can aid Pakistan tremendously with unlimited material support and monetary aid.
The only way I could see to avoid that is to seize Diego Garcia and wait for the Big E to shift course and steam forward to counter attack DG. When the Indians see the Americans coming, they skeedadle out of the way by heading for Mauritania or other islands in the Indian ocean perhaps using American seebees as hostages only to release them in return for safe passage. Big E has no choice but to proceed ahead and secure the island and secure the captured Americans or hostages. India apologizes profusely and attempt to diffuse the situation with diplomatic means saying it was a rogue operation or such. End result? No US naval presence in BoB for a couple days allowing the Soviets to set up a defensive screen and prevent further US naval forces from interfering with Indian operations and little Indian or American casualties.
Last edited by Blademaster; 20 Mar 12, at 17:30.
Marines Barracks Beirut, Lebanon. USAF housing, Dubai, Saudi Arabia.
Chimo
Hitesh,
And you come to that conclusion how? I lived through those times. I remember watching Cronkite and Chancellor every night.
We didn't care.
It wasn't until the entire Indian Ocean area went to hell in a hand basket over then next 5 - 8 years that the US got involved seriously. When the flow of oil was threatened then you got America's attention.
But frankly, by the mid 1970s we all just wanted to get drunk and get laid and forget about the 1960s.
So if the Indians attack Diego Garcia (a British Territory, BTW, not US) there may be a proportional response from the US with the Enterprise CBG....but an overwhelming response and war with India? Nope...
Remember that it is the Actions and not the Commission that make the Officer and that there is More expected from him than the title. GEORGE WASHINGTON
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