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Old 01-30-2007, 03:02 AM   #106 (permalink)
Firral
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnut
It had stockpiles of chemical/biological agents, as certified by the world's intelligence community, including yours.
However it till now is not found.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gunnut
Al Queda showed Saddam on 9-11 how to deliver those weapons to a US population center.
Probably I not the rights, but circumstantial evidences have been found out only. Any direct proofs.
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Originally Posted by Stan187
You think I'm wrong? Did you live in the Soviet Union? I did. I ain't wrong about **** I've seen with own eyes.
I lived in the USSR in current of first ten years of the life. People are more senior than me lived there much more. I can tell that no racial discrimination as a matter of fact existed. In any republic two languages were studied: Russian - as the basic language of the country and national. At school the literature of all country (not only Russian) was studied.
On the contrary there were orders, at which to enter the institute to some nationalities (for example from Central Asia) it was easier than for example to Russian or Ukraine. It was created for that what to strengthen education in less developed republics of the country.
On the contrary: after 1985 nationalist groupings in republics have sharply amplified. After disintegration of the USSR, it is a lot of people (different not the basic nationalities) has left national republics what to rescue to itself a life. Most a vivid example the Chechen Republic, but it not a unique case.
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Old 01-30-2007, 09:00 AM   #107 (permalink)
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This is propoganda aimed at showing Russia as evil. Putin is bringing democracy. We should accept, respect and support that and therefore Russia.

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Old 01-30-2007, 14:17 PM   #108 (permalink)
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well I´m lived in former S.U. 14 of my first years and have still some memories - DEFINATELY there were problems on national /racial level. And of course officially all was clean and fine but underneath this whole Empire was one huge moral cesspool. As for nations , there were always ´the usual suspects´ - the jews-who-blabla,the tshurkas-who-as-we-all-know...,chuckchis-who..., pribaltiskie-fashisty-who-blah-blah...,ukrainians-who-stab-you-on-your-back ... etc,etc.,
Don´t see Russia getting any more tolerant and not more democratic, it´s consolidating powers and some of it on expense of democracy. but OTOH there is every goverment´s obligation to improve the living standards etc. of their country and this is happening finally - people get paid oin time etc. .
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Old 01-30-2007, 15:40 PM   #109 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by braindead View Post
well I´m lived in former S.U. 14 of my first years and have still some memories - DEFINATELY there were problems on national /racial level. And of course officially all was clean and fine but underneath this whole Empire was one huge moral cesspool. As for nations , there were always ´the usual suspects´ - the jews-who-blabla,the tshurkas-who-as-we-all-know...,chuckchis-who..., pribaltiskie-fashisty-who-blah-blah...,ukrainians-who-stab-you-on-your-back ... etc,etc.,
Don´t see Russia getting any more tolerant and not more democratic, it´s consolidating powers and some of it on expense of democracy. but OTOH there is every goverment´s obligation to improve the living standards etc. of their country and this is happening finally - people get paid oin time etc. .
We spoke about an official position of the government of the USSR and its internal national policy, not about a household level. In any society consisting more than from one nationality there are small national household problems.
You can name to me the multinational country where is not present any, even small national problems.
However after disintegration of the USSR, there were politicians who have made of small national problems - greater national problems, and due to it have come to power. So there were politicians (and you perfectly know them) with slogans of type: "... ans-go home ", " All our problems because of... ans " and so on. So there was a set of greater and small wars in territory of the former USSR. Badly that such politicians till now at authority in some countries.
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Old 01-30-2007, 16:01 PM   #110 (permalink)
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You are right - there is no multicultural country in world that has no national problems - but - quote - ´´So there were politicians (and you perfectly know them) with slogans of type: "... ans-go home ", " All our problems because of... ans " - no actually I can´t name you any of them - not at least here. .
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Old 01-30-2007, 16:10 PM   #111 (permalink)
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Actually I think the most powerful of them would be Zhirinovski and he is political clown , all the other loonies in former S.U. territory have not even 5% of his audience... And speaking of official position of gov. of USSR - well it was worlds most peaceloving, democratic (remember ´´99,999% of voters voting for ...!´´- some previously unknown steel-worker). It was many things , but tolerance was not one of them.
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Old 01-30-2007, 16:13 PM   #112 (permalink)
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And I´m not to whitewash my own country - we have way too much dumba$$es here as well . .
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Old 01-30-2007, 16:15 PM   #113 (permalink)
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You are right - there is no multicultural country in world that has no national problems - but - quote - ´´So there were politicians (and you perfectly know them) with slogans of type: "... ans-go home ", " All our problems because of... ans " - no actually I can´t name you any of them - not at least here. .
I do not love such politicians. They are everywhere though and not always they are at authority. They use low instincts of people to receive authority.
I shall give you the help: for example the leader of one of the southern countries, speaks the citizens, that in all of them problems ossets, Russian and Abkhasians are guilty...
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Old 01-30-2007, 16:55 PM   #114 (permalink)
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You think I'm wrong? Did you live in the Soviet Union? I did. I ain't wrong about **** I've seen with own eyes.
Tell us your private story about racism in USSR. May be I’ll be able to understand you. As I live in USSR/Russia since 1978...
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Old 01-30-2007, 19:13 PM   #115 (permalink)
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USSR internal policy was so tolerant, that Russians themselves were infringed. As Firral said, minorities had a lot of privilegies, while Russians didn't. If you're chukcha, you could enter university without any exams, if you're tungus, you could get apartment without waiting in line, e.t.c If you're Russian, you could get nothing. I do not say Russians were cold and hungry, but minorities had priority in all their needs and that was a problem.

Let's not forget, that rise of nationalism in late 1980s happened in Russia (RSFSR) also. And USSR died not because some republics left it, but because Russia that was core of USSR left it on 12th June 1990. The end of USSR was result of Soviet national policy, that interpreted "equality" way too wrong.

Russia in 1991 without USSR was still multinational country, but we had chance to reorganize national policy on new basis. That hadn't happened. Autonomies that were quite nominal got a lot of rights, dropped some onligations and under weak and drunk central power, became de facto independent countries within Russia. That continued until recently. Finally something is done in this field and from tolerance meaning infinging of most numerous nation in Russia we're going to true equality.

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Old 01-30-2007, 22:08 PM   #116 (permalink)
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"I can not stand rickusn's “China threatening” theory."

First of all its no theory. Its just a fact.

Of course you "can not stand" it because when the Russians finally wise up the jig will be up for China. LOL

China has fooled the world for centuries but not me. LOL

"inscrutable" my butt.

LOL What a world!!!!
Could you please give me some education on the “China threatening” fact?

Russians are wise people. They know who is threatening them.

"China has fooled the world for centuries but not me."

Wow, this is almost equal to that famous saying of Napoleon about China and even more shocking. Well said
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Old 01-31-2007, 08:02 AM   #117 (permalink)
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Could you please give me some education on the “China threatening” fact?
The sources of possible conflict

First off China and Russia have a long standing dispute over parts of Mongolia and Siberia.

Secondly is the fact that the PRC is an expansionist regime having fought 4 wars on forgien soil since is creation as an agressor state

Thirdly is massive population pressure

Fourth is massive Chinese imigrant incursions into Russia.

Fifth China has a huge demand for resources it does not hav ein enough quantity to be self suffieicent, Russia has them.

These and other factors can combine in a multitude of ways to spark a conflict.

The Threat

10-1 population advantage

better technology in many areas including things like computers and information management

Rapidly increasing domestic advanced heavy industry with new tanks and planes on par with Russia's.

stronger economic footing and massive cash reserves

Has most of the Russian goodies and technology to study

Nuclear weapons

bigger defence budget

All of the above sitting right next door to Russia not hundreds or thousands of Km away like NATO or the US
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Old 01-31-2007, 16:30 PM   #118 (permalink)
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Well don´t know about the rest of S.U., but in Baltics the locals were in many ways lower in pecking order - the new apartments went to people who literally had got off the train at train station 2-3 hrs. ago (and just not specialists but untrained workforce as well), locals were evicted from some places for example like coastal areas, serious russification attempts etc. : I repeat again - things were not like it appeared OFFICIALLY. Oh well , bygones

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Old 01-31-2007, 18:38 PM   #119 (permalink)
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First off China and Russia have a long standing dispute over parts of Mongolia and Siberia.
Oh really? I think there were some disputes over a few Amur islands and they were generally resolved and border was demarcated. The fact we have some disputes with China over any part of Mongolia (?!) is need to be cheked.

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Fourth is massive Chinese imigrant incursions into Russia.
It's hardly "massive" as it looks from here, Far East, the part of Russia bordering China.

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Fifth China has a huge demand for resources it does not hav ein enough quantity to be self suffieicent, Russia has them.
Considering current state of Chinese economy, it's easier to buy resources than to go war for them and then mine them from Siberian icy soil.

I wonder why Chinese haven't colonized Siberia and Far East before Russians came there. In 17 century Russian population here was no bigger than a few thousand people (not even ten thousand), while Chinese was near and were quite numerous even back then.

Quote:
Originally Posted by braindead
Well don´t know about the rest of S.U., but in Baltics the locals were in many ways lower in pecking order - the new apartments went to people who literally had got off the train at train station 2-3 hrs. ago (and just not specialists but untrained workforce as well), locals were evicted from some places for example like coastal areas, serious russification attempts etc. : I repeat again - things were not like it appeared OFFICIALLY. Oh well , bygones
Baltic is different case, territory that was alien even to Russian Empire not to say about Soviet Union, but it needed to be colonized. The only addition is that masses of people moved there by Soviet Power weren't only Russians, there were all soviet nationalities. There're still all nationalities, but they're mostly Russian-speaking.

The main point: Russians were the same toy in hands of Soviet regime, as people of any other nationality. And Soviet Power never was created by Russians as ethnos, never served Russian interests, and Russians suffered from communism no less than others, and in many aspects more.

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Old 01-31-2007, 20:59 PM   #120 (permalink)
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Tell us your private story about racism in USSR. May be I’ll be able to understand you. As I live in USSR/Russia since 1978...
In first grade, a kid came up to me and said "You kinda look like a Jew, are you?" I was like, "Yeah, I am" and he said "Oh, my mom told me not to play with you people".

My dad was a premier student who got into to the equivalent of MIT (Moscow Polytechnic) with perfect scores. For some reason, he had to retake the tests when he got in. The same tests. And suddenly, after he walked in and they say his face, his nose, and his last name, he failed all of those exams across the board. Interesting.

Not to mention both Russians and Moldovans blaming us for the war in Prednistrovye. Russian hooligans caught destroying a Jewish cemetary during USSR times still where many from my family were buried, only to get any punishment written off.

That's what I can type right this second, I'm in a hurry. But if you want more, there are plenty of these stories. Also note, that I lived in an one of the republics, Moldova to be exact. If you lived in Russia itself, there is a pretty slim chance that you would have seen Russification, no?
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