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01-25-2007, 15:11 PM
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#46 (permalink)
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Padishah Shahanshah
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 01-23-07
Location: Canada
Country: 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan187
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Stan, I suggest you take a look of what he said .... .Your point is because he has over 4.000 posts, I should take sh1t from him. I think not...
As far avatar, correct me if i am wrong, but the flag that is displayed is linked to your homecountry - as that is WHERE I WAS BORN. How is that my fault god knows. Never seen a case, where a flag flareup such animosity from people. But i guess it is the first time for everything. Regardless, I dont remember saying anything good or bad about Canada, so I dont see why i should critize or not-critize it in this unrelated thread.
Anyways i dont waste my time with people like that. |
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01-25-2007, 15:17 PM
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#47 (permalink)
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Padishah Shahanshah
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 01-23-07
Location: Canada
Country:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highsea
It may not fit your definition of what is illegal, but I will say this- It will certainly draw a response. The US doesn't like to have her soldiers in Iraq blown up by roadside bombs built in Iran. Iran can either back off, or face US strikes on Iranian targets in reprisal.
Call it legal, call it illegal. It won't change the outcome.
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illegal in a sene that has been done dozens of time by Western nations in their bid to control. US just happens to be on the receiving end of it in this war, therefore the case at hand.
If i am not mistaken, the US invasion of Iraq itself was a full-fledge interferance in Iraq's affair. If i am not mistaken, the US support for the Mujaheddin against the Dr. Najibullah's government in Kabul itself was a full-fledge interferance in Afghanistan affair.
That was my point ... that the most powerfull and the least powerfull nations (the whole spectrum) play that game when it is in their intrests. |
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01-25-2007, 15:17 PM
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#48 (permalink)
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WAB BOUNCER
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 11-24-06
Country: 
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[quote=xerxes;334835]That was Bremer's fault as he had a very simplistic appraoch. QUOTE]
Yup, Bremer and Rumsfeld's.
__________________
In Iran people belive pepsi stands for pay each penny save israel. -urmomma158
The Russian Navy is still a threat, but only to those unlucky enough to be Russian sailors.-highsea
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01-25-2007, 15:20 PM
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#49 (permalink)
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WAB BOUNCER
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 11-24-06
Country:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xerxes
Stan, I suggest you take a look of what he said .... .Your point is because he has over 4.000 posts, I should take sh1t from him. I think not...
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I'm saying you should be respectful. I can 99% guarantee you that Bluesman has a lot of more important stuff than you have. If you bait someone into responding by the manner with which you make your points, don't be surprised if they respond, know what I mean? |
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01-25-2007, 15:25 PM
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#50 (permalink)
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Padishah Shahanshah
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 01-23-07
Location: Canada
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^^^ point taken ,... the underlines pissed me off , and my underlined answer pissed him off
Originally Posted by Bluesman
Opening a dialogue with such as them? They would likely as not seize our people all over again, because that's what animals like that DO.
Originally Posted by Xerxes
Is insulting other's nationality is allowed on this forum? .... is this a white supermacy forum? ..... will I be banned if I say that the only Animals are the animals that lauched an unprovoked-invasion of another sovergien nation in 2003.
anyways i dont want to derail anyfurther
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01-25-2007, 15:38 PM
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#51 (permalink)
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Defense Professional
Join Date: 12-10-04
Location: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xerxes
That was my point ... that the most powerfull and the least powerfull nations (the whole spectrum) play that game when it is in their intrests.
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Indeed they do. And sometimes there is a price to be paid. If Iran chooses to play this game, she needs to be ready to face the consequences of that choice.
The US puts up with a lot of cr*p, but there is a limit. We didn't go after al-Qaeda until after 9/11. We didn't make the decision to take out Saddam until after 9/11. That was the breaking point. There were lots of provocations prior to that, but we held back.
Now Iran is flirting with some serious US reprisals by her interference in Iraq. We have known all along that Iran was meddling. But that interference has caused too many deaths, and now we have to put a stop to it- by whatever means necessary, including military action against Iran, if that's what it takes.
Pakistan was faced with this same situation with the Soviets in Afghanistan- after the mujahadeen started attacking targets in the USSR, the Sovs went to Pakistan and said 'back-off or else'. Pakistan wisely pulled the plug on those operations.
This is where Iran is today. Let's face it- she is antagonizing a superpower, and risks getting slapped down hard for her troubles.
__________________
My baby called me up. She said- Why don't you ever take me out? Pick me up in your brand new car....You shake the short change from the old fruit jar...
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01-25-2007, 15:44 PM
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#52 (permalink)
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Padishah Shahanshah
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 01-23-07
Location: Canada
Country:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highsea
Indeed they do. And sometimes there is a price to be paid. If Iran chooses to play this game, she needs to be ready to face the consequences of that choice.
The US puts up with a lot of cr*p, but there is a limit. We didn't go after al-Qaeda until after 9/11. We didn't make the decision to take out Saddam until after 9/11. That was the breaking point. There were lots of provocations prior to that, but we held back.
Now Iran is flirting with some serious US reprisals by her interference in Iraq. We have known all along that Iran was meddling. But that interference has caused too many deaths, and now we have to put a stop to it- by whatever means necessary, including military action against Iran, if that's what it takes.
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agreed ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by highsea
Pakistan was faced with this same situation with the Soviets in Afghanistan- after the mujahadeen started attacking targets in the USSR, the Sovs went to Pakistan and said 'back-off or else'. Pakistan wisely pulled the plug on those operations.
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could you please give a date on this claim .... ^^^
the part that " Soviets went to Pakistan and said 'back-off or else'" and the part that " Pakistan wisely pulled the plug on those operations." |
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01-25-2007, 16:33 PM
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#53 (permalink)
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Defense Professional
Join Date: 12-10-04
Location: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xerxes
...could you please give a date on this claim .... ^^^
the part that "Soviets went to Pakistan and said 'back-off or else'" and the part that "Pakistan wisely pulled the plug on those operations."
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From "The Bear Trap" by Mohammed Yousaf.
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In this instance we highlighted the facilities in Nizhniy Pyandzh (the blank area just north of the bridge), emphasizing that so long as the rocket launcher was located within the 7-kilometre circle he would be certain to be in range of the targets in the Soviet Union. The Commander was given complete discretion as to which target he engaged, from which firing position, and when he carried out his attacks. For example, we might ask that he did so once a week for two months, but nothing more specific. Within six weeks of our briefing the Commander at Peshawar, rockets started to rain down on Nizhniy Pyandzh.
These cross-border strikes were at their peak during 1986. Scores of attacks were made across the Amu from Jozjan to Badakshan Provinces. Sometimes Soviet citizens joined in these operations, or came back into Afghanistan to join the Mujahideen. As I have mentioned above, in at least one instance some Soviet soldiers deserted to us. That we were hitting a sore spot was confirmed by the ferocity of the Soviets’ reaction. Virtually every incursion provoked massive aerial bombing and gunship attacks on all villages south of the river in the vicinity of our strike. These were punitive missions, with no other purpose than razing houses, killing people and forcing the survivors to flee, thus creating a belt of ‘scorched earth’ along the Amu, from which it would hopefully prove impossible for the Mujahideen to operate. Their aim was sufficiently to demoralize the population to halt our incursions.
In so far as destroying villages, killing women and children and driving survivors into Pakistani refugee camps were concerned, the Soviets succeeded. But if stopping our attacks or weakening the Mujahideen resolve were their objectives, they failed. We continued to bait the bear until April, 1987, when Soviet diplomatic reaction rather than military, sufficiently frightened Pakistani politicians into ordering us to stop. Perhaps our April attacks were just that much over-ambitious and represented too deep a cut in the Soviet anatomy.
During late 1986 we made tentative plans to continue operations inside the Soviet Union the following spring. With this in mind Commanders were trained, briefed and supplied with the necessary weapons and ammunition before winter set in. In April we hoped to start the offensive with three slightly more ambitious attacks. The first involved a heavy rocket attack on an airfield called Shurob East, some 25 kilometres NW of Termez, near the Soviet village of Gilyambor. It was not a major airfield, but it was in use, and lay only 3 kilometres north of the river, so the firing positions could be in Afghanistan. In early April this bombardment was successfully completed, with the airstrip being engaged several times over a period of ten days.
The second attack involved a party of twenty men armed with RPGs and anti-tank mines, tasked with ambushing the frontier road east of Termez, between that town and the Tajikistan border. They were to lay the mines between two security posts, wait for some vehicles to hit the mines, then open fire and withdraw. In the event three soft-skinned Soviet vehicles drove along the road at night, one hit a mine and the two others were destroyed by RPG rounds. Several Soviet soldiers were reported killed or injured, the nearby post opened up with mortar and machine-gun fire, and the Mujahideen pulled back over the Amu. This was followed by the third, and most ambitious, mission which penetrated some 20 kilometres north of the Amu, and struck an industrial target close to the airfield at Voroshilovabad (see Map 21). This was Wali Beg’s operation.
<snip details>
Wali’s attack had caused considerable damage and inflicted a number of Soviet casualties, although I was never able to establish exactly how many. The smoke rockets had started a fire which had consumed several buildings, but it was the suddenness, the ferocity and the distance (about 20 kilometres) inside the Soviet Union that was so galling to the enemy. It was the third successful attack within three weeks, and the Soviet Ambassador had been instructed by Moscow to use whatever language necessary to get future attacks halted immediately.
Our Foreign Minister, Sahibzada Yaqoob, was left in no doubt that if any further operation was conducted in the Soviet Union the consequences for the security and integrity of Pakistan would be dire. It was a threat of outright attack by the Soviet military. That they used this threat was itself confirmation that our raids were hurting. They were concerned, not so much with the actual damage caused, but by the effect they were having on the local Muslim population. If the attacks were to continue unchecked it might not be long before they had a general uprising on their hands. There was panic in our Foreign Office. The Prime Minister was informed that Pakistan might be on the brink of war, so he at once ordered General Gul, who had recently replaced General Akhtar at ISI, to cease all such operations at once.
The Bear Trap (Afghanistan’s Untold Story)
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01-25-2007, 16:59 PM
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#54 (permalink)
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Padishah Shahanshah
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 01-23-07
Location: Canada
Country:
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wow .. thanks ... almost eight years from the original invasion date of '79. My guess is it by then Gorbachov hinted to US and Ziad at a complete Soviet withdraw, though they always kept saying the samething sense 1980. That gesture combined with the realthreat forced pakistant to relax its aid. Funny, that the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan was carbon copy of the invasion of Albania. A max three week operation.
Have you read that entire (Afghanistan’s Untold Story) .. i think i will start reading it tonight.
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01-25-2007, 17:02 PM
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#55 (permalink)
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Defense Professional
Join Date: 12-10-04
Location: Seattle, WA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xerxes
...Have you read that entire (Afghanistan’s Untold Story) .. i think i will start reading it tonight.
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I have. It was first recommended to me by Brig. Ray. It's a pretty a good read. |
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01-25-2007, 17:06 PM
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#56 (permalink)
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Moderator
Join Date: 11-10-04
Location: Te Ika a Maui
Country: 
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Bluesman, Xerxes debate the topic not each other please Gentlemen 
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01-25-2007, 17:41 PM
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#57 (permalink)
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WAB Bartender
Defense Professional
Military Professional
Join Date: 11-24-04
Location: Vacaville, CA.
Country:
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He's disrespectful of an entire group of people - MY people. He gets no slack for that. I'll give him the back of my hand everytime, and same goes for everybody else, too.
I'm sick of the smug, sniffy, snide and dismissive attitudes of trash like him. You want examples?
Coming up...
__________________
"The quickest way of ending a war is to lose it, and if one finds the prospect of a long war intolerable, it is natural to disbelieve in the possibility of victory."
- George Orwell
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01-25-2007, 18:45 PM
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#58 (permalink)
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WAB Bartender
Defense Professional
Military Professional
Join Date: 11-24-04
Location: Vacaville, CA.
Country:
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I despise anti-Americanism and this punk is another one. It's bigotry, pure and simple, and toads like him ALWAYS have to find a target for their petty little hatreds.
Usually, guys like this are racists. I imagine he is one of those too, hinting darkly about the Americans' best friend Ariel Sharon and our Zionist press, blahblahblah. But he's combined his racist antipathy with a big helping of anti-American spew. I loathe a creature like this, and everybody else, should, too.
To take as an example ONE of his posts:
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Carter administartion gave the green light to saddam to invade Iran .. hoping that the turmoil or revolution and wat will somehow weaken the new anti-american government in Iran. You are correct in assuming that US did not provide weapons to Iraq: but UK, France and USSR did quite a bit.
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But TheChosenOne's point, explicity made, was that the US armed Saddam. We didn't, and that's what I said.
Furthermore, the Carter administration, feckless as it was, didn't 'green light' Saddam to invade Iran, which, it should be remembered, was a thug regime that had committed one of the worst examples of uncivilized behavior at the international level: they had seized American personnel and property during their crime, and stop that fukkin' tap-dance about the CIA restoring the Shah, because that's totally irrelevant.
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But believe me that US did its bid and quite bid to support Iraq in everyway they could. Not only that most of Iraqi intelligence was performed via US satellites and I might even add that US did took a side in 1987-88, or I should say Saddam achieved what he wanted when he started attacking Iranian oil shipments, knowing that it would force Iran to strike back which inturn would bring in the superpowers in.
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Well, I dam' well hope we would have supported Iraq against Iran, because the Iranian delaration of war against the US means that there are CONSEQUENCES for such a rash act. Nothing for any American or any unbiased observer to be ashamed about there.
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Wha ... ?? the grossest violation was when CIA toppled a democratically elected government in 1953 and install a dictator. The Iranian revolution was a 'blow back' of that operation.
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Absolutely. But do NOT try to sell the Iranian Revolution as the inheritors of that government that was deposed; they're not. So cry me a river about it, but it is NO EXCUSE for behaving like jungle creatures 25 years on.
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incorrect ... the Prime Minister of iran in that time was Dr. Bazargan a 70 year old engineer who had served in the Free French during WWII. He resigned almost immediatly after the hostage taking.
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No, dumbass, I meant Iran's CURRENT President. He was one of the 'student leaders' (read: thug) that stormed the US Embassy in one of the most outrageous acts imaginable. We oew him a debt of honor that I hope one day will be paid back in the only currency he understands.
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I am not sure if the concept of revolution and the chaos that usually causes is familiar to you Americans. But believe or not things like this do happen.
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NOW we see your rank chauvanism on display. Yeah, we know a bit about revolution ourselves, so knock off the smarmy superiority act, you greasy little wog bastard.
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But if you feel like using that to strength your anti-iranian stance .. feel free to do so.
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And I do NOT need your permission to bring up one or another topic to strengthen ANY point I care to make, either, so you can cram that up your ass.
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Infact it was only after the hostage were taken that Khomeini realized of the importance and therefore kept the hostages and made demands.
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In fact, that's as clear an admission as I've ever seen that you think it was the right thing to do, seizing an embassy and it's diplomats in order to 'make demands'.
You're no different from the howling mob of rank criminals that committed the act in the first place, if you support it, even now, even as you live in the West, where, by the way, we don't DO things like that, nor send to their deaths children and the retarded and pregnant women and anybody else that can be gulled into killing masses of innocent people for your horrible god.
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very funny ... the sunni insurgenncy is financed primarly by Saudi Arabia and Jordan ,, Iran does finances the Shia factions. I believe most of the killings is done by the sunni insurgenncy that is against the Shia-led majority.
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I was speaking about the unending flow of IEDs and EFPs that come in over the Iranian border, with full knowledge of the criminally insane leadership in Iran. I continue to lose part of my military family to those indisciminate weapons every day, so don't you DARE try to minimize Iranian involvement with it, or so help me, I will fly to Canada and beat you down, you filthy insect.
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since when waging proxy wars has not been on purpose ??? .. and like i said before Iran is on the side Shia not the sunni insuregency. Ofcourse you Americans or so into your FOX news that the concept of Saudi financing of sunni insurgency is too alien for you. How could it be??? they are our allies??
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Us Americans and our Fox News...again, I just have to say you can suck my dick, you shitty little viper. I understand this conflict FAR better than you EVER will, and the Iranians are the Bad Guys. WE, the United States of America, are the Good Guys. You want to denigrate us; you want to defend them. That makes you an enemy, too.
Which is why I despise you. Not because you're Iranian, I don't care about that, which I expect is an alien concept to you, bigot that YOU are. But you dislike Americans simply BECAUSE we're Americans, and you make all sorts of unfounded claims about us. Well, I'm calling you out on it, punk.
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Is insulting other's nationality is allowed on this forum? .... is this a white supermacy forum? ..... will I be banned if I say that the only Animals are the animals that lauched an unprovoked-invasion of another sovergien nation in 2003.
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You missed the point, idiot. I was saying anybody that would do what was done to our embassy, or anybody that supports it (which apparently includes YOU) is an animal.
As for your claim the Iraq liberation was unprovoked, well, it would fit nicely in YOUR worldview, but that happens to be 180 degrees out from reality. There was LOTS of provocation. You're just not up on your history, that's all.
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no the war started in 1953 ... but ofcourse you - an American - see things from a bigoted and superior point of view.
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Fuk you, dickhead. I'm not taking your crap, and nobody else's either. Just as racism isn't tolerated anymore, I'm not putting up with this throw-away, drive-by slap at an entire country - MY country - because you're a hateful little rat. It is no different from racism, and while you're NEVER going to be able to reason this out on your own, you're no better than what you accused me of being when you failed to comprehend that I was saying.
I cannot stand people like you, and I won't tolerate them any more.
Don't bother replying; you're on 'Ignore'.
Low-rent moron.  |
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01-25-2007, 18:57 PM
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#59 (permalink)
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Padishah Shahanshah
Senior Contributor
Join Date: 01-23-07
Location: Canada
Country:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluesman
I despise anti-Americanism and this punk is another one. It's bigotry, pure and simple, and toads like him ALWAYS have to find a target for their petty little hatreds.
Usually, guys like this are racists. I imagine he is one of those too, hinting darkly about the Americans' best friend Ariel Sharon and our Zionist press, blahblahblah. But he's combined his racist antipathy with a big helping of anti-American spew. I loathe a creature like this, and everybody else, should, too.
where did i mention Zionist
To take as an example ONE of his posts:
But TheChosenOne's point, explicity made, was that the US armed Saddam. We didn't, and that's what I said.
Furthermore, the Carter administration, feckless as it was, didn't 'green light' Saddam to invade Iran, which, it should be remembered, was a thug regime that had committed one of the worst examples of uncivilized behavior at the international level: they had seized American personnel and property during their crime, and stop that fukkin' tap-dance about the CIA restoring the Shah, because that's totally irrelevant.
Well, I dam' well hope we would have supported Iraq against Iran, because the Iranian delaration of war against the US means that there are CONSEQUENCES for such a rash act. Nothing for any American or any unbiased observer to be ashamed about there.
Absolutely. But do NOT try to sell the Iranian Revolution as the inheritors of that government that was deposed; they're not. So cry me a river about it, but it is NO EXCUSE for behaving like jungle creatures 25 years on.
No, dumbass, I meant Iran's CURRENT President. He was one of the 'student leaders' (read: thug) that stormed the US Embassy in one of the most outrageous acts imaginable. We oew him a debt of honor that I hope one day will be paid back in the only currency he understands.
NOW we see your rank chauvanism on display. Yeah, we know a bit about revolution ourselves, so knock off the smarmy superiority act, you greasy little wog bastard.
And I do NOT need your permission to bring up one or another topic to strengthen ANY point I care to make, either, so you can cram that up your ass.
In fact, that's as clear an admission as I've ever seen that you think it was the right thing to do, seizing an embassy and it's diplomats in order to 'make demands'.
You're no different from the howling mob of rank criminals that committed the act in the first place, if you support it, even now, even as you live in the West, where, by the way, we don't DO things like that, nor send to their deaths children and the retarded and pregnant women and anybody else that can be gulled into killing masses of innocent people for your horrible god.
I was speaking about the unending flow of IEDs and EFPs that come in over the Iranian border, with full knowledge of the criminally insane leadership in Iran. I continue to lose part of my military family to those indisciminate weapons every day, so don't you DARE try to minimize Iranian involvement with it, or so help me, I will fly to Canada and beat you down, you filthy insect.
Us Americans and our Fox News...again, I just have to say you can suck my dick, you shitty little viper. I understand this conflict FAR better than you EVER will, and the Iranians are the Bad Guys. WE, the United States of America, are the Good Guys. You want to denigrate us; you want to defend them. That makes you an enemy, too.
Which is why I despise you. Not because you're Iranian, I don't care about that, which I expect is an alien concept to you, bigot that YOU are. But you dislike Americans simply BECAUSE we're Americans, and you make all sorts of unfounded claims about us. Well, I'm calling you out on it, punk.
You missed the point, idiot. I was saying anybody that would do what was done to our embassy, or anybody that supports it (which apparently includes YOU) is an animal.
As for your claim the Iraq liberation was unprovoked, well, it would fit nicely in YOUR worldview, but that happens to be 180 degrees out from reality. There was LOTS of provocation. You're just not up on your history, that's all.
Fuk you, dickhead. I'm not taking your crap, and nobody else's either. Just as racism isn't tolerated anymore, I'm not putting up with this throw-away, drive-by slap at an entire country - MY country - because you're a hateful little rat. It is no different from racism, and while you're NEVER going to be able to reason this out on your own, you're no better than what you accused me of being when you failed to comprehend that I was saying.
I cannot stand people like you, and I won't tolerate them any more.
Don't bother replying; you're on 'Ignore'.
Low-rent moron. |
Good read ... I was wondering how low you will bring yourself this time ...
you could have actually said these things before you made your nice speech and comments about Iranians and what kid of Iranian I am ... |
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01-25-2007, 19:02 PM
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#60 (permalink)
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Military Professional
Moderator
Scotch taster
Join Date: 08-06-03
Country: 
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MSgt,
If you are coming to Canada, make sure to drop by my place. I will have a 16 year old Lugavullen waiting.
__________________
Chimo
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