Tronic

The Chinese incursions are now becoming far too common; yet the government continues to play them down. I think it is about time we take some major steps to check up on our Northern and Eastern border; we should even base some units in Bhutan and Nepal; what say?

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Nabha Sparasham Deeptam
-Touch The Sky With Glory

Officer of Engineers

This really sounds like a p!ssing contest. We're talking incursions of at most by 200 men on BOTH sides of the border (the Chinese have complaints too) and only when the other side ain't looking (I have this image of soldiers needing to pee real bad just waiting for the other guy to leave his toilet).

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Chimo

Ray

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Bhutan is located in the eastern Himalayas bordered by India in the south, east and west and by the Tibetan Autonomous Region of China in the north. It has an area of 46,500 Sq. Km. between latitudes 26 45 0 North and 28 10 0 North and between longitudes 88 45 0 east and 92 10 0 east. At its longest east-west dimension, Bhutan stretches around 300 kilometres and it measures 170 kilometre at its maximum north-south dimension. Bhutan shares about 1075 km of land boundaries with its neighbours - China 470 km, India 605 km.



A sandwiched Bhutan, is geo-strategically located between two giant nations of Asia - China in the north and India in the south. Bhutan maintains an excellent and friendly relationship with India. Both countries maintain diplomatic establishment at each others’ capital. Bhutan’s foreign relation is overtly ‘Indo-centric’.



Contrary to it, Bhutan does not have any diplomatic ties with the People’s Republic of China, despite sharing a contiguous northern boundary of 470 Kilometres. Bhutan never had an 'equi-proximity' or 'equi-distance' foreign policy towards its giant neighbour. Bhutan’s relationship with China can be described as ‘indifferent’. However, in recent years, exchange of visits at various levels between the two have significantly increased. This new interactions can be largely ascribed to the on-going border talks between Bhutan and China started since 1984. Bhutan’s border with China is largely un-demarcated, or remains unresolved. Bhutan is eager to resolve its boundary disputes with China quietly and amicably. Thus, Bhutan’s China relation is centred around the resolution of border disputes.



Until seventies, Bhutan’s border issues with China were incorporated with in the scope of Sino-Indian border discussions. Later China and Bhutan started direct bilateral border talk in early eighties. The Sino-Bhutan direct border talk was held first time in Beijing in 1984.



Bhutan had traditional trade relation with Tibet. However, Bhutan closed its northern borders with China after the influx of Tibetan refugees in 1960. With that the age old cross-border trade came to a halt. Since then, there has been no official trade or business relation between Bhutan and China.



Bhutan voted in favor of restoring China's seat in the United Nations in 1971. Bhutan invited Chinese Ambassador to India, to attend the coronation ceremony of His Majesty KIng Jigme Singye Wangchuk in 1974. Chinese Foreign Minister Wu Xueqian and Bhutanese Foreign Minister Dawa Tsering held consultations on developing bilateral relations in New York in 1983.



Bhutan also supported China in the United Nations Human Rights Conference. Bhutan opposed Taiwan's bid to host the 2002 Asian Games. Bhutan was Vice-Chairman of the 55th UN General Assembly Meeting. It voted against the draft on Taiwan's participation in the UN.





BHUTAN-CHINA AGREEMENT



Bhutan and China signed an Agreement to Maintain Peace and Tranquillity on the Bhutan-China Border in 1998 during the Twelfth round of bilateral border talk. This could be the first Sino-Bhutanese agreement or treaty till today. The Agreement “reiterates its position to fully respect the independence, sovereignty and territorial integrity of Bhutan”. In comparison, Indo-Bhutan Treaty 1949 does not mention anything about the sovereignty of Bhutan.





BHUTAN-CHINA AGREEMENT ON MAINTENANCE OF PEACE AND TRANQUILITY ALONG THE SINO-BHUTANESE BORDER AREAS, 1998



Agreement between the Government of the people's Republic of China and the Government of the Kingdom of Bhutan on the Maintenance of Peace and Tranquillity Along the Sino-Bhutanese Border Areas


The Government of the People's Republic of China and the Government of the Kingdom of Bhutan, in accordance with the five principles of mutual respect for each other's sovereignty and territorial integrity, mutual non-aggression, mutual non-interference in each other's internal affairs and peaceful co-existence and for the purpose of maintaining peace and tranquility along the Sino-Bhutanese border, have reached the following agreements:



Article 1


Both sides hold the view that all countries big or small, strong or weak are equal and should respect one another. The Chinese side reaffirmed that it completely respects the independence, sovereignty and territorial integrity of Bhutan. Both sides stand ready to develop their good-neighborly and friendly cooperative relations on the basis of the Five Principles of Peaceful Co-Existence.


Article 2


Both sides are of the view that during the ten rounds of talks that have been held so far, they have reached consensus on the guiding principles on the settlement of the boundary issues and narrowed their differences on the boundary issues in the spirit of mutual accommodation, mutual trust and cooperation and through friendly consultations. The mutual understanding and traditional friendship between the two countries have been deepened. Both sides stand ready to adhere to the above-mentioned spirit and make joint efforts for an early and fair solution of the boundary issues between the two countries.


Article 3



Both sides agreed that prior to the ultimate solution of the boundary issues, peace and tranquillity along the border should be maintained and the status quo of the boundary prior to March 1959 should be upheld, and not to resort to unilateral action to alter the status quo of the border.


Article 4



Both sides reviewed the progress made after ten rounds of border talks. As both sides have already expounded each other's stand on the disputed areas, both sides agreed to settle this issue through friendly consultations.


Article 5


This agreement will come into force on the date of signing.


This agreement was signed on December 8, 1998 in Beijing, done in two copies in the Chinese, Bhutanese and English languages, all three languages are authentic. If differences arise, the English text will be the standard text.





Tang Jiaxuan Jigme Thinley

(Signed) (Signed)
Representative of the Representative of the of the

of the People 's Government of the Kingdom of Bhutan

Republic of China



Agreement between the Government of the people's Republic of China and the Government of the Kingdom of Bhutan on the Maintenance of Peace and Tranquility Along the Sino-Bhutanese Border Areas(2001-11-06)

BORDER TALKS



Bhutan shares boundary of 470 Kilometers with China in the north. It has unresolved border dispute with China in the north. In September,1959 Chinese Premier Mr. Chou-En-Lai wrote to Indian Prime Minister Mr. Jawaharlal Nehru expressing desire for a direct bilateral border talk with Bhutan. He wished to take the boundary question between Bhutan and China out of the scope of Sino-Indian border talks. Bhutan for the first time went alone for border talks with China in 1980. This was a major foreign policy initiative for Bhutan. China also showed interest in establishing residential diplomatic mission in Bhutan. China conveyed its desire first in 1974 during the coronation of His Majesty King Jigme Singye Wangchuck . Thereafter, China has been pushing this proposals in every Sino-Bhutanese border talk since the first in Beijing in 1984.

Articles on Bhutan .



In the past, China had offered a package to Bhutan which included the resolution of border dispute with the establishment of diplomatic missions and trade relationship with Bhutan. On 27 June, 1997 during the question-answers session in the National Assembly (Parliament) of Bhutan Lyonpo Om Pradhan, Minister for Trade and Industry , who headed the first Sino-Bhutan border talk, informed that the Chinese government had made proposals that the border negotiations be based on the establishment of bilateral trade and diplomatic relations. Articles on Bhutan



The Tenth round of Bhutan-China border talk was held in Beijing, in November, 1996. China proposed to exchange 495 sq km area of Pasamlung and Jakarlung valleys in the northern borders of central Bhutan (which China claims) for Sinchulumpa, Dramana and Shakhtoe with an area of 269 sq km in the north-west Bhutan. Bhutan in principle accepted the proposals as also reported by the BBC on July13,1997. Sinchulumpa shares borders with Indian state of Sikkim, close to Chumbi valley. Articles on Bhutan .



The Eleventh border talk was held in Thimphu in August 1997. There was no final decision on the exchange of territories as discussed in Tenth Talk. Articles on Bhutan .



Twelfth round of bilateral border talk was held in Beijing on 12 December 1998. The discussion were also held on the establishment of diplomatic relations and trade relations between two countries. Bhutan and China signed an Agreement to Maintain Peace and Tranquillity on the Bhutan-China border in 1998. This could be the first Sino-Bhutanese agreement or treaty till today. There was no final decision on the exchange of territories as discussed in Tenth Talk. Peoples' review



The Thirteenth round of boundary talk was held in Thimphu in 1999.



The Fourteenth round of boundary talk was held in Beijing, China in November 2000. Chinese Premier Zhu Rongji said that China and Bhutan are good-neighbourly countries, and the two countries had close contacts in the past, adding that Sino-Bhutanese relations have developed steadily since the two countries signed an agreement on the maintenance of peace and tranquillity in the border area in 1998. People Daily China .



During this round of talk, Bhutan had extended the claim line of the border beyond what the Chinese government had offered. Bhutan had also proposed technical discussions, using maps, between experts from the two sides. His Majesty the King told the National Assembly of Bhutan on 14 July, 2001 that the proposed extension of the border along the three sectors under discussion were in Doglam, Sinchulumba, and Dramana areas. His Majesty expressed his confidence that, Bhutan being a small country and China being a very large and friendly neighbour, the demarcation of the boundary would be completed successfully in the near future. Kuenselonline



The Fifteenth round of boundary negotiations was held in Thimphu, Bhutan on the last week of November 2001. Chinese delegation was led by Vice Foreign Minister, Mr. Wang Yi.. Bhutan’s foreign minister, Lyonpo Jigmi Thinley, led the Bhutanese delegation in the talks, which was the 15th round since it began in 1984. The talk focused on the international boundary between the two countries. The border talks have been alternating between the two capitals, Thimphu and Beijing.



The Chinese Vice Foreign Minister, Mr. Wang Yi. Said, “ As China and Bhutan are neighbouring countries, with shared mountains and rivers, we should first of all achieve mutual understanding and, on the basis of mutual understanding, we can achieve mutual support and mutual confidence and mutual assistance. We have made a lot of achievements in this regard. We will work on this basis to make further progress.” He added. “It is my view that what counts most is that we must continue the process and, during this process, enhance the mutual understanding so we can work together to remove the outstanding relatively minor issues.” Kuenselonline.



His Majesty King Jigme Singye Wangchuck of Bhutan and visiting Chinese Vice Foreign Minister Wang Yi held talks on bilateral ties. While praising the improvement of Bhutan-China relations over the past few years, His Majesty the King said he hoped that the two countries would increase their exchanges in various fields and create sound conditions for an eventual resolution of the border issue. People Daily China .



On 04 July 2002, the Bhutanese foreign minister informed the National Assembly of Bhutan that the Chinese claimed to have documentary evidence on the ownership of the disputed tracts of land. When Bhutan asked them to be generous with a small neighbour like Bhutan they said that, as a nation which shared its border with 25 other countries they could not afford to be generous with one particular neighbour. The Chinese government had also identified three aims for the successful resolution of this problem: to understand each other’s interests and come to a decision that would best benefit both countries; to trust each other; to seek solutions that had long-term benefits. So far the biggest success of the Sino-Bhutan discussions had been the signing of an “interim agreement”, the first between the two countries, to build trust and confidence. The agreement, between two independent and sovereign nations which shared mutual respect and understanding, was signed to help solve the border issue in an atmosphere of friendship and understanding. The foreign minister said that, after the agreement was signed, the Chinese government had responded immediately to the problem of the mule track and timber extraction in Pasamlum. The agreement also helped settle the complaints that Tibetans crossing into Bhutan searching for the medicinal herb, Yartsa Guenbub, were given severe and unwarranted punishment at Pasamlum by the Bhutanese border security. The two countries had agreed on most issues until the 14th and 15th meetings. The foreign minister said that the Chinese government, including their prime minister, were unhappy and questioned why Bhutan was raising new issues after many years of boundary talks. “It was agreed, therefore, that we bring in the technical experts to decide which part of the territory was ours and which part was theirs and to depict the claims on a map,” said the foreign minister. “We also agreed to use the common names of the disputed areas to avoid confusion.”



His Majesty the King explained to the members of National Assembly that there were, basically, four disputed areas between Bhutan and China. Starting from Doklam in the west the border goes along the ridges from Gamochen to Batangla, Sinchela, and down to the Amo Chhu. The disputed area in Doklam covered 89 square kilometers. The disputed areas in Sinchulumpa and Gieu covered about 180 sq. km. The boundary line in this area starts from Langmarpo Zam and goes along the stream up to Docherimchang and up the ridge to Gomla from where it goes along the ridge to Pangkala and then down to the Dramana stream. From Dramana the boundary goes up to Zingula and then follows the ridge line down to Gieu Chhu from where it goes to Lungkala. In the middle sector in Pasamlum, the boundary goes along the ridge to Dompala and to Neula. From Neula the boundary follows the ridge line to Kurichhu Tshozam, and then follows the ridge line to Genla from where it goes to Mela and onwards to the east. Kuenselonline .



The Sixteenth round of China-Bhutan boundary talks were held in Beijing, China on 12 October, 2002. Bhutanese Foreign Minister Lyonpo Jigme Yoeser Thinley met Chinese Premier Zhu Rongji. Chinese Premier said that China and Bhutan are resolving their boundary issues through mutual understanding and reconciliation and the 16 rounds of talks to date had achieved successes. He said that China-Bhutan relations had developed smoothly in recent years and the border areas had remained peaceful. He further said that China appreciated the Bhutanese government's support on the issues like Taiwan and human rights, and hoped to develop cooperative relations based on the principle of equality, mutual benefit and non-interference in each other's internal affairs.



Thinley said Bhutan and China should further promote mutual understanding between the two peoples. Thinley reiterated Bhutan's consistent stand on the issues of Taiwan and human rights and emphasized that Bhutan would continue to firmly support China on the issues. Before the meeting, Chinese Foreign Minister Tang Jiaxuan held talks with Thinley on bilateral relations and other international and regional issues of common concern. Wang Yi, Vice-Minister of Foreign Affairs, held official talks with Thinley on boundary issues. Xinhuanet, 14 Oct 2002 .



The 16th round of boundary discussions between Bhutan and China have taken the two countries yet another step towards a permanent solution, according to the foreign minister, Lyonpo Jigmi Thinley, who returned on October 23, 2002 after a 10-day visit to China.



The seven-member Bhutanese delegation, which included the home secretary, Dasho Pema Wangchuk, and the Surveyor General, Sithar Namgyel, was received in Beijing by the minister for foreign affairs, Mr. Tang Jiaxuan. Lyonpo Jigmi Thinley also called on the Chinese premier, Mr. Zhu Rongji. The official talks were held with vice minister for foreign affairs, Mr. Wang Yi. The Bhutanese delegation also visited places of historical and cultural interest in China, including the autonomous region of Tibet. Kuenselonline Oct 25/2002



BILATERAL VISITS



The Speaker of National Assembly of Bhutan, Dasho Ugen Dorjee led an official delegation to Tibet Autonomous Region on 22-25 April, 2002. He held discussion with Chairman Raidi of the Standing Committee of the People's Congress of the Tibet Autonomous Region. People Daily China .



On June 10-13, 2002, Bhutanese home secretary led the expert team to China for the first meeting of the expert group.



Bhutan’s Foreign Secretary Dasho Ugyen Tshering, led an official delegation to China from July18 to 25 2001. The delegation comprised officials from the ministry of trade and industry, ministry of communications, ministry of agriculture and the ministry of foreign affairs. The delegation held discussion with Chinese Foreign Minister Mr. Tang Jiaxuan, and the Vice Minister of foreign affairs Mr. Wang Yi. The delegation discussed Bhutan-China border and other issues of mutual interest. The Chinese government assured Bhutan that it treats all nations equally irrespective of the differences in their size, strength or wealth. Kuenselonline .



Bhutan's Foreign Minister Lyonpo Jigme Yoeser Thinley who visited Tibet on 19-22, October 2002 said that Bhutan and China have enjoyed a long-term friendship, adding that he was deeply impressed by the great changes taking place in Tibet. He further said, " I appreciate China's efforts in the restoration and protection of religious sites." People Daily China, October 22, 2002
and Xinuhanet October 21, 2002



China’s Ambassador to India, Mr Hua Junduo visited Bhutan on April 13 to 16, 2003. He received an audience with His Majesty the King on April 14. He met with the prime minister, Lyonpo Kinzang Dorji, and the foreign minister, Lyonpo Jigmi Y Thinley. The Ambassador said that, given the proximity between China and Bhutan, there was great potential in the field of trade and economic cooperation and as well as in the political field. Source: Kuensel



The former vice foreign minister of the People’s Republic of China, Liu Shuqing, led a seven-member delegation to Bhutan, from September 14 to 18, 2003. Liu Shuqing said that the main purpose of his visit was to “find ways to reinforce mutual exchanges and cooperation”. “We would like to see more visits by Bhutanese friends to China whether for business, travel, study, or for exchanges with Buddhists and religious practitioners in China,” Liu Shuqing said. His Majesty the King and the Bhutanese Foreign Ministers were on an official visit to India during the period of September 14-18, 2003.

Bhutan-China Relations: Bhutannewsonline.com

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"Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."

I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.

HAKUNA MATATA

lemontree

A whole brigade is moving up, and this is winter - so hostilities are not eminent. The summer of next year will be very interesting.

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Cheers!...on the rocks!!

Sumku

Why is India so afraid of China all the times. We keep reading stories about China's Military capabilities as being above/superior than India's. But is it really so ?.

Except for the fact that China has far more soldiers than India, I would hold India to be having a massive edge over China in Military Superiority especially if India is fighting a defensive war in areas Close to Indian Borders like Bhutan, Himalayas or at Nepals Northern Border[Terrain more favourable to India than China]. Its time a Platoon level company Ingress in Tibet[where it hurts most] from Ladakh region. Never from Bhutan's side.

Also if the war starts, the First thing that India needs to do is take out every single Bridge[or atleast all the major ones and thus making sure that repairing would take a lot of time, atleast till such time the hostilities are going, the bridges should not be allowed to be repaired] that dots KKH[Karakoram Highway], thereby not allowing Chinese to Open Second Front via Pakistan.

The Major Objective of China investing so much in KKH, is not to enhance trade with Pakistan/having strategic depth with Pakistan etc[which is popular Opinion] but to be able to quickly open a second front from Pakistan's side.

The Only Chance that China has if it were to be able to defeat India in conditions favourable to India is if and Only If, it can quickly open a Second Front from the Pakistan's side.

There are so many stories going around about China having invested 'bout $3.5 Billion in road networks connecting China with Tibet, but in my Opinion the real motive it to move millions Chinese Hans Tribe and settle them in Tibet and thereby reducing Tibetans a minority in their Homelands. It no doubt would give strategic depth to Chinese Forces vis-a-vis India, but I guess the Roadnetwork give Chinese depth more towards the Bhutan and Arunanchal Pradesh side than Tibet. Thats the reason I mentioned Open Front from Ladakh's side and not Bhutan.

Well am not a Military genuis, and would love to hear from more knowledgeable people here.





Sumit Kumar
Never Underestimate the Power of Stupid People in Large Groups

Tronic

Sumku, what gives you the idea that India is afraid of China? Indian army has proven more then once it is up to the task. Look up the the 1967 Chola incident when the two armies clashed in Sikkim; or the speed at which the Indian army mobilized during Operation Falcon in 1987. It is our wimpish politicians which we fear, not China!

Sumku

My Mistake, I should have made my Point Clear. Will you get afraid of a Chinese? I guess not. Same with me. What I meant was that rather than sitting comfortable in our house and ingore the Incursions, its time to take some appropriate action. No one is afraid of Chinese, but I guess you would agree with me that we are far too much complacent even in Situations concerning National Security

KENT

I think article is dates back to december, from that point of time to till now, IA has taken lots of precautionery measures in order to get rid of Incursion. IA is in the process of raising a special force comprise of 15,000 men to deploy around uneven terrain of Northeast, they are gona be equipped with cutting edge electronic equipment and communication system. Recently IA also has floated tender for 155mm light howizter gun which could be easily air lifted and comptiable to the dense jungles of north east.