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08-15-2007, 10:53 AM
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#1 (permalink)
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Postmaster General
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Join Date: 08-20-03
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Indian identity is forged in diversity. Every one of us is in a minority
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Indian identity is forged in diversity. Every one of us is in a minority
The nation born 60 years ago today is built on a bold idea of difference - and an agreement that it's healthy to disagree
Shashi Tharoor
Wednesday August 15, 2007
The Guardian
When India celebrated the 49th anniversary of its independence from British rule in 1996, its then prime minister, HD Deve Gowda, stood at the ramparts of Delhi's Red Fort and delivered the traditional independence day address to the nation.Eight other prime ministers had done exactly the same thing 48 times before him, but what was unusual this time was that Deve Gowda, a southerner from the state of Karnataka, spoke to the country in a language of which he did not know a word. Tradition and politics required a speech in Hindi, so he gave one - the words having been written out for him in his native Kannada script, in which they made no sense.
Such an episode is almost inconceivable elsewhere, but it was a startling affirmation of Indian pluralism. For the simple fact is that we are all minorities in India. There has never been an archetypal Indian to stand alongside the archetypal German or Frenchman. A Hindi-speaking Hindu male from Uttar Pradesh may cherish the illusion he represents the "majority community". But he does not. As a Hindu, he belongs to the faith adhered to by four-fifths of the population. But a majority of the country does not speak Hindi. And, if he were visiting, say, my home state of Kerala, he may be surprised to realise that a majority there is not even male.
Worse, this stock Hindu male has only to mingle with the polyglot, multicoloured crowds - and I am referring not to the colours of their clothes but to the colours of their skins - thronging any of India's major railway stations to realise how much of a minority he really is. Even his Hinduism is no guarantee of his majorityhood, because caste divisions automatically put him in a minority. (If he is a Brahmin, for instance, 90% of his fellow Indians are not.)
If caste and language complicate the notion of Indian identity, ethnicity makes it worse. Most of the time, an Indian's name immediately reveals where he is from or what her mother-tongue is: when we introduce ourselves, we are advertising our origins. Despite some intermarriage at the elite levels in our cities, Indians are still largely endogamous, and a Bengali is easily distinguished from a Punjabi. The difference this reflects is often more apparent than the elements of commonality. A Karnataka Brahmin shares his Hindu faith with a Bihari Kurmi, but they share little identity with each other in respect of their dress, customs, appearance, taste, language or even, these days, their political objectives. At the same time, a Tamil Hindu would feel he has much more in common with a Tamil Christian or a Tamil Muslim than with, say, a Jat from the state of Haryana with whom he formally shares the Hindu religion.
What makes India, then, a nation? As the country celebrates the 60th anniversary of its independence today, we may well ask: What is an Indian's identity?
When an Italian nation was created in the second half of the 19th century out of a mosaic of principalities and statelets, one Italian nationalist wrote: "We have created Italy. Now all we need to do is to create Italians." It is striking that, a few decades later, no Indian nationalist succumbed to the temptation to express a similar thought. The prime exponent of modern Indian nationalism, Jawaharlal Nehru, would never have spoken of "creating Indians", because he believed that India and Indians had existed for millennia before he articulated their political aspirations in the 20th century.
None the less, the India that was born in 1947 was in a very real sense a new creation: a state that made fellow citizens of the Ladakhi and the Laccadivian, divided Punjabi from Punjabi and asked a Keralite peasant to feel allegiance to a Kashmiri Pandit ruling in Delhi, all for the first time.
So under Mahatma Gandhi and Prime Minister Nehru, Indian nationalism was not based on any of the conventional indices of national identity. Not language, since India's constitution now recognises 22 official languages, and as many as 35 languages spoken by more than a million people each. Not ethnicity, since the "Indian" accommodates a diversity of racial types in which many Indians (Punjabis and Bengalis, in particular) have more ethnically in common with foreigners than with their other compatriots. Not religion, since India is a secular pluralist state that is home to every religion known to mankind, with the possible exception of Shintoism. Not geography, since the natural geography of the subcontinent - framed by the mountains and the sea - was hacked by the partition of 1947. And not even territory, since, by law, anyone with one grandparent born in pre-partition India - outside the territorial boundaries of today's state - is eligible for citizenship. Indian nationalism has therefore always been the nationalism of an idea.
It is the idea of an ever-ever land - emerging from an ancient civilisation, united by a shared history, sustained by pluralist democracy. India's democracy imposes no narrow conformities on its citizens. The whole point of Indian pluralism is you can be many things and one thing: you can be a good Muslim, a good Keralite and a good Indian all at once. The Indian idea is the opposite of what Freudians call "the narcissism of minor differences"; in India we celebrate the commonality of major differences. If America is a melting-pot, then to me India is a thali, a selection of sumptuous dishes in different bowls. Each tastes different, and does not necessarily mix with the next, but they belong together on the same plate, and they complement each other in making the meal a satisfying repast.
So the idea of India is of one land embracing many. It is the idea that a nation may endure differences of caste, creed, colour, conviction, culture, cuisine, costume and custom, and still rally around a consensus. And that consensus is around the simple idea that in a democracy you don't really need to agree - except on the ground rules of how you will disagree.
Geography helps, because it accustoms Indians to the idea of difference. India's national identity has long been built on the slogan "unity in diversity". The "Indian" comes in such varieties that a woman who is fair-skinned, sari-wearing and Italian-speaking, as Sonia Gandhi is, is not more foreign to my grandmother in Kerala than one who is "wheatish-complexioned", wears a salwar kameez and speaks Urdu. Our nation absorbs both these types of people; both are equally "foreign" to some of us, equally Indian to us all.
For now, the sectarian Hindu chauvinists have lost the battle over India's identity. The sight in May 2004 of a Roman Catholic political leader (Sonia Gandhi) making way for a Sikh (Manmohan Singh) to be sworn in as prime minister by a Muslim (President Abdul Kalam) - in a country 81% Hindu - caught the world's imagination. India's founding fathers wrote a constitution for their dreams; we have given passports to their ideals. That one simple moment of political change put to rest many of the arguments over Indian identity. India was never truer to itself than when celebrating its own diversity.
· Shashi Tharoor is the author of Nehru: The Invention of India, and former under secretary general of the United Nations
shashitharoor.com
Guardian Unlimited | Comment is free | Indian identity is forged in diversity. Every one of us is in a minority
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A nice article that should give an idea as to what is India and why it still chugs along the labyrinthine corridors of destiny!
__________________
"Some have learnt many Tricks of sly Evasion, Instead of Truth they use Equivocation, And eke it out with mental Reservation, Which is to good Men an Abomination."
I don't have to attend every argument I'm invited to.
HAKUNA MATATA
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08-15-2007, 11:30 AM
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#2 (permalink)
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Regular
Join Date: 08-08-07
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by ray
"The sight in May 2004 of a Roman Catholic political leader (Sonia Gandhi) making way for a Sikh (Manmohan Singh) to be sworn in as prime minister by a Muslim (President Abdul Kalam) - in a country 81% Hindu - caught the world's imagination."
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...which resulted in one of the worst administration ever, second only to VP Singh's. Just mixing and blending for the sake of symbolism will not work, Tharoorjee seems to juxtapose a vibrantly multi-cultural India with the social engineering mess that politicians seem to strive for. I guess old UN habits die hard... |
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08-15-2007, 11:35 AM
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#3 (permalink)
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Postmaster General
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You think that this administration is the worst?
I think it is the average one India has been experiencing!
Nothing extraordinary and nothing too bad, either.
The only thing that irks me is that it is Communist backed!
And it not being able to implement anything because the Communists will be going for their jugular.
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08-15-2007, 11:50 AM
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#4 (permalink)
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Regular
Join Date: 08-08-07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray
You think that this administration is the worst?
I think it is the average one India has been experiencing!
Nothing extraordinary and nothing too bad, either.
The only thing that irks me is that it is Communist backed!
And it not being able to implement anything because the Communists will be going for their jugular.
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Present day Indian economy is fortunate enough to absorb all these shocks and still land successfully, bumpy if not smooth. VP Singh was not so lucky to be gifted a roaring economy to mess with. The mess created by him could not get absorbed. Better an ineffectual guy than a destructive one.
India is a natural when it comes to multi-culturalism. She doesn't need tinkering on that count. I hope the social engineers make way for real engineers. |
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08-15-2007, 12:24 PM
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#5 (permalink)
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Postmaster General
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VP Singh is too much of a fool for anyone to even give him bandwidth recognition!
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08-15-2007, 13:44 PM
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#6 (permalink)
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Banished
Join Date: 08-14-07
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India constitutes a great secular society with strong foundations in the caste system. The Kshatriya (blue blood), Brahman (presits), Viashya (Professionals, business people) and the Sudra (lowly workers with body odor) designate each person a place in society per his/her caste ranking. The unfortunate byproduct of this rather noble caste system is that most shudras (toilet cleaners) become Muslims and Christians. These Muslims have a great resentment towards the Hindu upper classes and these are the Muslims who become terrorists. Since all Indian Muslims were at one time lavatory cleaners, all Indian Muslims espouse terrorsim. It is time the ruling Hindu class starts formulating caste based divisions amongst the Indian Muslims and Christians. This will coerce a much needed social intercourse between the upper echelons of the Hindus, Christians and Muslims. As a token of goodwill gesture the Hindu upper classes should allow non-Hindus of the upper class an entry into their home during Diwalui and other important Hindu occasions. The Muslims and Christians in gratitude will remain willing subsurvient classes to the Hindus and will also maintain a little suppressive force on their lower classes thereby suppressing terrorist thoughts. What I am citing is very lofty and intellectual so most forum and panel members here will not understand what I espouse so they will criticize me. But I have big shoulders.
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08-15-2007, 14:45 PM
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#7 (permalink)
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Banished
Join Date: 07-29-05
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baconullah
India constitutes a great secular society with strong foundations in the caste system. The Kshatriya (blue blood), Brahman (presits), Viashya (Professionals, business people) and the Sudra (lowly workers with body odor) designate each person a place in society per his/her caste ranking. The unfortunate byproduct of this rather noble caste system is that most shudras (toilet cleaners) become Muslims and Christians. These Muslims have a great resentment towards the Hindu upper classes and these are the Muslims who become terrorists. Since all Indian Muslims were at one time lavatory cleaners, all Indian Muslims espouse terrorsim. It is time the ruling Hindu class starts formulating caste based divisions amongst the Indian Muslims and Christians. This will coerce a much needed social intercourse between the upper echelons of the Hindus, Christians and Muslims. As a token of goodwill gesture the Hindu upper classes should allow non-Hindus of the upper class an entry into their home during Diwalui and other important Hindu occasions. The Muslims and Christians in gratitude will remain willing subsurvient classes to the Hindus and will also maintain a little suppressive force on their lower classes thereby suppressing terrorist thoughts. What I am citing is very lofty and intellectual so most forum and panel members here will not understand what I espouse so they will criticize me. But I have big shoulders.
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Can i say , that i resent the tone and the way you have your content mannered as utterly disrepectfula and disgusting. A fairly well hid-flame bait, I am a lower class Hindu, and I run a business in which I employ a lot of this so called upper class.. and I fire them and I also work along side, . you are so far from the truth and reality. You have a point somewhere in your post, but then again, the rest of your gibberish hid that dang thing.
I am from the same state as the author of the article.
Last edited by Adux : 08-15-2007 at 14:48 PM.
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08-15-2007, 15:25 PM
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#8 (permalink)
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Contributor
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baconullah
But I have big shoulders.
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And no intelligence to speak of.
__________________
"Of all the manifestations of power, restraint impresses men the most." - Thucydides
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08-15-2007, 15:26 PM
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#9 (permalink)
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Postmaster General
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Join Date: 08-20-03
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Keralite are you?
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08-15-2007, 15:27 PM
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#10 (permalink)
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Postmaster General
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Bacon, are you serious?
Even though a large majority of Indian Moslem are of the lower echelons, one could state it so, if indeed you felt so strongly about it, in more refined terms.
Indian Christians are not all from the castes you have mentioned. There are many who were of the higher strata eg. the renowned poet Madhusudan Dutt, or the Governor of Bengal, Harendra Coomar Mookerjee.
Last edited by Ray : 08-15-2007 at 15:35 PM.
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08-15-2007, 17:45 PM
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#11 (permalink)
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Military Enthusiast
Senior Contributor
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Quote:
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For now, the sectarian Hindu chauvinists have lost the battle over India's identity.
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This is the part that rankles me. Does he not know that many of these people were responsible for many social reforms?? Looks like he is short on being educated on some parts of Indian history. He falls into the trap of an western world sucking up intellectual. I was never for him as UN General Secretary as he comes across as shades of Nehru, with a nose up in the air supremacy attitude over the Indian masses and sucking up to westerners. |
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08-15-2007, 19:41 PM
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#12 (permalink)
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Patron
Join Date: 07-11-07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blademaster
This is the part that rankles me. Does he not know that many of these people were responsible for many social reforms?? Looks like he is short on being educated on some parts of Indian history. He falls into the trap of an western world sucking up intellectual. I was never for him as UN General Secretary as he comes across as shades of Nehru, with a nose up in the air supremacy attitude over the Indian masses and sucking up to westerners.
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Oh he's the guy?
I read one of his articles and was wondering who is this 'I am above all these petty things and can see more than others of my kind can' kind of junk journalist.
Is the UN election over? Hope the US objects to him. Dont want such characters to represent my country. Either have someone worthy and pragmatic or not have someone at all. Symbolism at this stage for India is completely a waste, though many old school thoughts and some politicians might not agree.
Agree with every line of ur post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by indus creed
Present day Indian economy is fortunate
India is a natural when it comes to multi-culturalism. She doesn't need tinkering on that count. I hope the social engineers make way for real engineers.
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Very true. Maybe Mayavati the last one needed to mess up the whole stuff for all the other parties and all traditional power vielding lobbies and old mindsets. After that no more.
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since India is a secular pluralist state that is home to every religion known to mankind, with the possible exception of Shintoism
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Now we need some Japanese to immigrate to India. That should complete the whole package. Might be tough to get some Japanese to immigrate though.
Last edited by FullTank : 08-15-2007 at 20:52 PM.
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08-15-2007, 19:57 PM
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#13 (permalink)
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Moderator
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baconullah
Since all Indian Muslims were at one time lavatory cleaners, all Indian Muslims espouse terrorsim.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parihaka
Is what the right way to eliminate terrorism?
my opinion? I think you are a troll. Prove me wrong, but do it quickly.
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Thank you for confirming my opinion.
__________________
In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.
Gottfried Wilhelm Leibniz
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08-15-2007, 20:51 PM
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#14 (permalink)
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Contributor
Join Date: 01-16-07
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Sorry for the silly questions:
For a country of 81% Hindu, in recent years, India got a Sikh prime minister, a Muslim President and now a female President.
What is this all about? afformtive action to appease different religions and genders? or those people are really the most competent ones for their job?
Did India have non Hindu people took those top positions before Manmohan Singh and Abdul Kalam?
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I am here for exchanging opinions.
Last edited by Zeng : 08-15-2007 at 21:01 PM.
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08-15-2007, 21:07 PM
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#15 (permalink)
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Patron
Join Date: 07-11-07
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeng_xinren
Sorry for the silly questions:
For a country of 81% Hindu, in recent years, India got a Sikh prime minister, a Muslim President and now a female President.
What is this all about? afformtive action to appease different religions and genders? or those people are really the most competent ones for their job?
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Other than the Prime Minsiter(a fine person but maybe not the best for PM post by his nature), who has proven as a excellent finance minster earlier and who was pushed to the post due to earlier muslim president objection to a European becomming the PM, others are pretty average fellows and got their post due to vote bank and puppet politics. The earlier Muslim president(a fantastic guy and probably one of the best leaders India ever had if not the best) by the way got kicked out by the European for his correct interpretation of the constitution, so that the European may have her way the next time if so wished or will invite the current ruling party to form the govt when the next elections occur as political pundits predict another fractured verdict.
Minority appeasement is in fashion these days.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeng_xinren
Did India have non Hindu people took those top positions before Manmohan Singh and Abdul Kalam?
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Yes.
Last edited by FullTank : 08-15-2007 at 21:21 PM.
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