leib10

Yes that is a long, long way. Not possible with a rifle-caliber (.30 or so) SR, although some tripod-mounted GPMG's have an extreme range at about that distance, although it's usually a waste of ammo.

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Vadim

I personally own an SVD Tiger 2 sniper rifle and the thing is truly amazing. 10 round cartridge, semi auto with great reliability and simplicity, can shoot through railway track at 1 km range and maximum 5km death range, not to mention it uses the universal and easily obtainable 762 rounds. Easy to use with a very smooth trigger, upgradable and light enough to shoot accurately while standing up using the scope. Not the best rifle in the world I am 100% sure as I know of another Russian development that beats it at every range but never put into service because of it's price. I heard that the L96A1 is an excellent rifle.

Wardogg1990

The best Sniper Rifle in the world is the British/American Accuracy International.

Attached Images

Accuracy International.jpg (25.6 KB, 781 views)

winterheart

orginal AW(=arctic warfare) wasnt good enough for swedish military. they requested modified model. and accuracy international is the company that makes the rifles in case you didnt know.

i dont personally like arctic warfare(nor the magnum model in cal .338lm) that much. sako trg-22/42 are far better rifles. and cost like half of the ai rifles wich are terribly overpriced.

and if we start talking about top accuracy rifles in the world i have to mention walther wa2000(72 rifles were ever made and price of new in box condition rifle costs about 75k$) and unique alpine tpg-1. tpg-1 is heavy and clumsy but has superior accuracy when shooting prone(with good selfloaded ammo, good scope(ie. zeiss diavari V 6-24x56T ) and some skill you can easily put 5 shots trough same hole at 100m.)

sniping is all about preference. what you like. some can stand made in usa scopes(.ie leupold) that have terrible crosshair movement(if you move horizontal hair vertical moves with it and vica versa.). in my opinion zeiss and hensold scopes are the only good scopes for tactical sniping. 6.5*45 norma can be good sniper cal(its accurete for long distance) but the bullets are so light that wind effects them quite much. .338 lapua magnum doesnt suffer from wind and it has great penetration but the rifles are heavy, bolt movement is long(results slow recharge) and recoil is hard. its about purpose of the rifle.


edit. last time i cheked mcmillan is stock maker. ai uses mcmillan stocks and so does tac-ops for some of their rifles

Simullacrum

have you actually used and Artic Warfare, or are you one that just forms an opinion without actually using the weapon..??
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Extract
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n early 1980's British Army started the search for the replacement of the aging L42 Enfield sniper rifles. Main compettitors were british companies Parker-Hale with their model 82 bolt action rifle, and Accuracy International, with their PM rifle. Eventually, PM rifle won the competition and was accepted by British Army under the designation of L96
One of the most notorious features of the PM rifle was design of the stock. Instead of the solid polymer or wooden stock, PM/L96 used hollow polymer stock, made from two halves and assembled around aluminium bedding block, that extends to whole stock lenght. L96 also was equipped with backup iron sights.
In mid-1980s Sweden forces began their own quest for the new sniper rifle, that could survive heavy nordic environments. The AI again become the winner in this race with improved L96 design, named "Arctic warfare". In 1988 Swedish forces adopt AW rifle in 7.62mm NATO chambering under the designation of PSG.90. British Army, in its turn, also adopted this improved design under the designation of L96A1, as well as many other militaries and Law Enforcement agencies around the world. In 1998, the Bundeswehr (Germany Army) also adopted the AW Super Magnum rifle chambered in .300 Winchester magnum (germany designation 7.62x67mm) as Scharfschutzengewehre (sniper rifle - german) G22.

Built by Accuracy International of Portsmuth, England, this line of rifles is among the best in the World of sniper rifles today. This rifle can shot less than 2" (51mm) groups at the distances of 600 yards (550m), using boat-tail match ammunition. Arctic Warfare is a line of 5 rifles. Original Arctc Warfare was designed for the British military. It gained its designation by special anti-icing features, allowing sniping operations to be carried out under Arctic conditions as low as -40C (-104F)! Other models are Police (AWP), Suppressed (AWS), Folding (AWF) and Super Magnum (AW SM). Three first rifles designed for 7.62mm NATO ammunition, while Super Magnum can be chambered in .338 Lapua Magnum, .300 Winchester Magnum and 7mm Remington Magnum. AW has a 26" (660mm) barrel, AWP has 24" (609mm). AW SM barrels available in lentths from 24" (609mm) to 27" (686mm). The standart scopes supplied by Accuracy International are Smidt&Bender 3-12X variable or the Leupold Mark 4 fixed 10X scope.
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History

The Accuracy International PM (Precision Magazine) rifle was entered into a British competion in the early 1980s as a replacement for the Lee-Enfield derived sniper rifles then in use by the British Army (e.g. L42). Accuracy International's name for this rifle was the PM; the Army designated it as the L96. It was selected over the Parker-Hale Model 82 (M85).

A few years later, the Swedish military were also on the hunt for a new rifle, and Accuracy International entered an upgraded version of the PM, now known as the AW or Arctic Warfare. This was the start of the Arctic Warfare name, which would become the primary name of the rifle family despite its earlier names.

The rifle now featured special de-icing features allowing it to be used effectively at temperatures as low as -40 °C (-40 °F). The stockhole, bolt, magazine release and trigger guard on the AW are large enough to facilitate use with heavy arctic mittens. This version was accepted into use by the Swedes in 1988 as the PSG-90, and the improved version was also adopted by the British as the L96A1.

It has since spawned an entire family using the Arctic Warfare name, and has been adopted by a number of other countries, including Australia, Belgium, Germany, The Netherlands, and Singapore. Other AI rifles decended from the L96 include the AI AE, and the AI AS50 (see variants below).
[edit]

Design

The AW is almost unique in being a purpose-designed sniper rifle, rather than an accurized version of an existing, general-purpose rifle. Rather than a traditional wooden or polymer rifle stock, the AW has an aluminium bedding block bolted directly to the action, and which extends the entire length of the stock. Two hollow polymer "half stocks", usually green, are in turn bolted to the bedding block, creating a remarkably rugged, yet light, weapon.

The AW's distinctive green thumbhole/pistol-grip stock, unique design and reliability in adverse weather conditions have made it a popular, if expensive, weapon. The rifle is extremely accurate (about 0.5 MOA), and its maximum effective range with a Schmidt & Bender 6 x 24 scope is around 600m. The AW is usually equipped with an integrated bipod and it also has a monopod in the butt.

Most Arctic Warfare rifles are chambered for 7.62 mm NATO rounds, but can also be fitted for the 5.56 mm rounds. It is mounted with a standard scope and a muzzle brake to cut down on recoil. Currently it is in service with many countries, including the United Kingdom, Australia, Germany, The Netherlands, Singapore, and Sweden. The L96A1 is the British designation given by the British Army to their version of the Accuracy Arctic Warfare (AW).

Each country's rifles differ slightly. The Swedish PSG-90 for example, uses a different scope to that of the L96A1, and also uses sabot rounds. The German Bundeswehr adopted a folding-stock Magnum version of the AW chambered in .300 Winchester magnum (7.62x67 mm) as the Scharfschützengewehr 22 (G22).
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jhenthorne_3

my vote would be for the m82a1 560 cal sniper rifle...i would not want to be on the reciveing end of that gun...lol

Anon

You would not want to have to hump one either, i'm sure.

The heavy specialty sniper systems definitely DO NOT qualify among the 'best' sniper rifles in the world.

Anything bigger than about .338 Lapua is impractical because of it's excessive size and weight, and is therefore relegated to a specialty niche type role.

I'd take an M-21 over an M-107/M-82 for 95% of all sniping duties.

Terran empire

I still have to ask you snip do you perfer bolt action of gas semiauto?



what I made a post? OMG! I am alive!!

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Rifleman

What do you want to do with it and what are you calling a sniper?

When you say "sniper" are to talking about someone who operates semi-independently at battalion level and gets their orders from the S-2/S-3?

Are you talking about someone who walks with a rifle platoon and is employed sort of like a crew served weapon? You know, the lead squad is in contact and the call goes out "sniper up, sniper up! Then you bust caps in the proper direction.

Will you be engaged in hostage rescue, often at ranges under 100 yards?

For the first scenario use an M24 or M40 and have the spotter carry a match grade M-14 with open sights. Yeah, you'll hear plenty of arguments about having the spotter armed with everything from an M-203 to an MP-5 in case the team is compromised. I'd say keep it simple. Go with the M-14 for ammo commonality and rely on your radio to get you out of hairy situations. As in "Adjust fire, over!"

For the second scenario the platoon sharpshooter, designated marksman, or whatever the term of the week is, a semi-auto makes more sense but a bolt gun isn't out of the question.

For the third scenario use something like the Remington 700 Light Tactical Rifle for both team members. It isn't the best choice for 1000 yard shooting, but the one in the back of my patrol unit is as accurate at 600 yards (the limit of our gun club range) as the heavier M700 Police Sniper Systems my fellow officers have.

When you say "sniper" there's not one right answer.

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Anon

Bolt gives greater absolute range and precision at the cost of capacity and rapid fire capability. I definitely prefer semi-auto for the vast majority of situations, but that's not usually up to the sniper, who will typically not have a choice between the two. (Obviously SOCOM types would have much greater weapons selection flexibility, and so would cops)

My spotter carried a Colt Commando Carbine(precursor to the M4) with an M203 and Aimpoint1000 electronic sight.(he ditched the carry-handle m203 peep sight and relied solely on the fold up leaf for aiming the 40mm. He was pretty good with the 40mm smoke sims.) When i was a spotter i carried an M-16A2 for a while, and then an M-16A2 w/M203 for a while once we got more of them in the unit. Our unit only used M-14s for D&C back then.

The M-24/M-14 combo can very much leave you desperately wanting for firepower when you're trying to execute a 2 man break contact bound and overwatch drill or when you're operating as part of a squad or scout section in an SDM role. The M-24 is a tremendously accurate rifle, but i definitely prefer the basic M-1 platform over any bolt action design. Sometimes things go wrong and the enemy can get real close, and in those cases a 5rd bolt action rifle with a fixed 10x mag is about as useful as a wet fart in a space suit. Another isssue is target saturation, where you get into a situation where there are several targets exposed in a short time period. In those instances the edge again shifts to the semi-automatic weapon.

Two eyes open at it's 3x setting an M-14/21/25 is still a VERY effective battle rifle at closer ranges, and it's more than enough out past 800 meters. Dismissing the caliber, the M-1/14/21/25 are very hard weapons to beat for a very wide variety of roles, and sniping is among them.

If only they made them in .300 magnum.

As far as police sniping, i've never really put much thought into it. That's probably a mission where your heavier caliber weapons firing specialty ammo could really excel.

Rifleman

True enough, but proper employment techniques can minimize the need for the spotter to carry a lot of firepower. I'm not saying the risk can ever be eliminated, but, then again, sniper employment in and of itself is a calculated risk.

I've read Vietnam era sniper employment SOP's for both the 9th Infantry Division and the 3rd Marine Division. Both recommended that the sniper team normally be employed within the artillery fan, and secured by a fire team to squad sized element in most situations. Not that the security element always occupied the same hide site, as I'm sure you know, but that they were within range to provide fire support if the sniper team had to bound back.

The Marine Corps SOP for teams was a bolt rifle/M-14 combo and they turned in some impressive results. I've not read of a compromsed Marine Corps sniper team that was wiped out for any reason, much less because of their weapons SOP.

The 9th Division teams usually had both sniper and spotter armed with M-21's, since they didn't have bolt rifles in the TOE. I suspect they sometimes had their M-21's configured differently based on mission requirements though, such as one with an ART I and one with open sights, one with an ART I and one with a starlight scope, one silenced and one not, etc.

Anon

There's really no one best fit, but it would be really hard to go wrong with two M-14/21/25s with 3x9x50mm optics for the vast majority of situations. It really depends on what each individual Bn's armory has, because it's definitely not the same from unit to unit, and some chains of command are far more flexible than others.

WRT employment, when operating independently of the main body of forces we would typically use APERS mines to secure our flanks/rear, though there were times when we'd get a fire team for security. We worked a lot with the HHC FIST-V team too. Most of the time we were kept with the scouts to give LR precision fire and additional spotting capability, and a lot of times as the scouts rolled out and pulled back we'd remain behind to provide continuous intel, and/or harass the REDFOR LOCs with arty and direct fires.

The key is to switch it up and not become predictible. A predictible sniper team usually ends up as a dead sniper team.

As far as marine snipers being killed, a large contingent of them was wiped out in Iraq about a year ago while moving in the open to their their firing position. Six man team....all armed with M-40s IIRC.

"BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Six sniper team members were among seven Marines whose deaths in northwestern Iraq were announced Tuesday by U.S. commanders, bringing the number of American troops killed in the war to more than 1,800."
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/meast/...cnn_topstories

There was another incident where a couple US Army snipers fell asleep in their hide and got executed too, that was probably about two years ago.

It's a dangerous business.

Rifleman

I can't really dispute the first paragraph. A soldier named Adelbert F. Waldron III proved that it's a winning combination. Of course Waldron would have been dangerous with a bolt rifle too.

I also heard about the Marine Corps loosing the snipers in Iraq, but I didn't know the details. I meant that I wasn't aware of a Marine Corps sniper team being lost in Vietnam due to lack of firepower in the bolt rifle/M-14 combo that was SOP for most of the war.

Anon

SSG Waldron was the top ranked sniper of the vietnam war with 109 confirmeds(Hathcock had almost double the probables though). I've mentioned him here on this board in the past....good call by you.

Rifleman

Marine Corps sniper Chuck Mawhinney also had a lot more probables than confirmed. He is usually credited with 216 probables, in addition to his 103 confirmed, over an extended tour (18 months?). Hathcock also had about one and a half tours, I think he was several months into his second tour when he was injured.

I've never heard or read anything that suggests that Waldron has the high numbers of probables that Mawhinney and Hathcock have, so in all probability they both actually exceed Waldron; but, in fairness to Waldron, he was quite impressive in some other ways.

First, the 9th Infantry Division started to train snipers in November of 1968. The division started to withdraw from Vietnam in the summer of 1969. That means that Waldron made his 109 kills in something like six months, give or take a little.

Second, there is an SSG Adelbert F. Waldron III buried in the Riverside National Cemetary in Riverside, California. The dates listed are March 14, 1933 - October 18, 1995. If it's the man were talking about, and that would seem likely, then Waldron was 38 years old during the peak of his combat effectivness.

While that doesn't mean he was better, or not better, than any other sniper, it has to say something! No wonder he was awarded two DSC's!