Thread: Unusual Guns

Originally Posted by omon

this unusuall schwartzlose pistol was made in brooklyn, very unusuall auto system, barrel by friction of a bullet moves forward, and reloads the gun,

Omon it seems to have a GMBH Berlin mark

Originally Posted by dave lukins

Omon it seems to have a GMBH Berlin mark

this particular one does.
i'll try to dig other sources, but so far my book never misinformed me.

found it, but you were right, it wasn,t manufecured in brooklyn, i misread the article in the book. my fault

SCHWARZLOSE 1908, .32ACP:
ORIGIN - GERMANY
CALIBER - .32 ACP
WEIGHT - 20 OZ.
OVERALL LENGTH - 5.5"
LENGTH OF MAGAZINE - 3.38"
A.W. Schwarzlose of Berlin began marketing this pistol in 1909. The Warner Arms Co., of Brooklyn, N.Y. were the importers in the U.S. until the model was discontinued in 1911. Those sold by Warner in the U.S. are marked W.A.C. on the grips. Unusual blowforward design that was prone to jams as well as being uncomfortable to shoot. The grip safety was on the front of the grip frame so that it was squeezed by the fingers. Made for only a short time, a relatively scarce pistol.

Since we are on the subject: the first is the afore mentioned automatic revolver. The second is a Devel, a rare custom built S&W automatic. The last one is said to be Goring's Luger. He definately brought a new standard in pimping his gun.

Originally Posted by Triple C

The last one is said to be Goring's Luger.

Wow that is one beautiful gun!

Thank you. Though I do not have possess that Luger, I do own the pixels thereof.

these are knives-guns, have no idea who made these.

Originally Posted by Captain C

I believe it was during WWII, The Aussies converted an Enfield bolt action to full auto, and the Americans converted a Winchester ever action to full auto. Talk about ugly weapons!!!! Saw them a long time ago in my American Rifleman magazines....

I think you are one World War off. In WW I the American Springfield bolt action rifle was converted to accept an auto-loading mechanism with an external magazine. It fired a .30 caliber bullet loaded in a straight case (similar to WW II's Carbine round) rather than a larger bottleneck case. The secrecy of this modification was covered up by claiming we were developing a new kind of pistol. Congress balked at it saying our 1911 Colt .45 ACP was quite sufficient.

So, because lack of Congressional support (like Viet Nam) the Pederson Device never went into full production. But it worked and a Springfield rifle could fire like a machine gun.

As for Lever action conversions, only three types have ever been developed that still required manual working of the lever. The Henry's and Winchesters of the 19th Century used a tubular magazine under the barrel whereas the Spencers used a tubular magazine in the stock. The only other real departure was in the Model 99 Savage that used a rotary magazine inside the receiver.

The Johnson semi-auto rifle (that came in second to the Garand in the Army tests) also used a rotary magazine eliminating a manually operated bolt or lever. Some Johnson's were still issued to the Marine Corps but all were in semi-auto version and not full auto.

Ironically, designs were being done on the M-1 Garand to take a BAR magazine and make it selective fire between semi and full auto. That never got too far but after Beretta was given license to produce M-1 Garands after the war they came out with a semi-auto version called the BM-59 of which the M-14 is almost an exact copy.

By the way, just how long ago did you see those pics in the American Rifleman? I've been a life member since 1966 and don't recall anything like that. But that doesn't necessarily mean that my memory is that perfect either.