What a fighter need

[Captain Drunk]

I go with 'Fastest Fighter First'

As far as weapons / avionics go, even if an F/A-18 EF was armed with an AIM-54 Phoenix, it wouldn't be as good as a Phoenix mounted on an F-14 or an F-111, since at one point the USAF was considering the AIM-54 for the F-111. Both fighters highly faster than the F-18.

As far as manouverability goes, I think the only manouverability BVR fighters need is from the runway / tarmac into the hanger. Why would high profile interceptors like F-14, F-15, Mig-29, Mig-31, etc., need to dogfight when they're gonna engage with long range BVR missiles from far off boresight?

As far as stealth goes, newer Russian fighters like Su-47 with advanced IRST technology would be able to detect stealth aircraft and no one knows anything of Russian 'Plasma Stealth' at the moment, so stealths played out.

Hence, speed is the best factor for a Fighter. For that reason no Trisonic Recee Mig-25R that flies at Mach 3.2 'clean' has ever been shot down over enemy airspace and neither would an F-22 with all its avionics / weapons supercrusing at Mach 1.8 be able to intercept an SR-71 flying twice its speed at Mach 3.5

Speed is everything - that explains how a single Iraqi Foxbat-E eluded eight F-15s and two F-111s while F-15s got 'killed' by Mach 2+ Mig-21s in Cope India 2005.

[hello]

The only time I've seen speed being really useful is the SR-71 Blackbird. 4000 or more SAMs and a few A2A missiles have been fired at Blackbirds but they've all been outrun with no maneuvering whatsoever, but the blackbird is not a fighter.

[Captain Drunk]

The only time I've seen speed being really useful is the SR-71 Blackbird. 4000 or more SAMs and a few A2A missiles have been fired at Blackbirds but they've all been outrun with no maneuvering whatsoever, but the blackbird is not a fighter.

Exactly! I would firmly believe an SR-71 could never be shot down by even the F-22. I belong to the old school, where speed is everything Fighter pilots have a saying,`Speed is life'. The inability of an aircraft to detach from an engagement or to egress from a target area because of a speed disadvantage can be fatal. The fixed engine inlets of the Hornet, F-22 are a liability by limiting its ability to achieve those speeds necessary for survival. Variable engine inlets like those of the F-14, Mig-29 and Su-30 allow the flexibility to achieve higher airspeeds and increase survivability.

[hello]

Speed is a good backup if stealth doesn't work. As long as you havent been seen, there's no need to run. However, if u do get seen, and cant destroy the thing that's seen you, its best to run. Speed, medium stealth and almost-invincibility are probably whats kept 2 SR-71s in service, even after satellites have taken their roll. Maneverability is best for low-flying ground attack aircraft like the A-10, AH-64 or any strike aircraft, as its needed to dodge SAMs, triple-As and ground fire, drop munisions on them and escape. ;)

[Garry]

Read this thread. Gentlemen you put too many beliefs to the current capabilities of STEALTH technologies. Like I read here that steath somehow magicly help to avoid being detected and attacked by missile.

There is no data to prove that it was efficient or effective. The citations to wars in Iraq and Yugoslavia are not really proving anything. For example F-16 made much more sorties to Yugoslavia and not a single F-16 was lost in Yugolsavia or Iraq...... was it really stealty aircraft? To me it looks that in both Yugoslavia and Iraq the OVERWHELMING domination of US in air did serve a lot to reduce its losses.

Now somebody compare F-22 to a bee, bird, golf ball etc..... but all the data is classified and this statements are close to be results of non-quantitive propoganda. Somebody tell here that F-15 fighters could not detect F-22 circling around them yet nobody give details in what conditions it happened.

Most of these emotional and optimistic beliefs in capabilities of stealth are premature.

IT IS GOOD TO BE STEALTH BUT IT IS NOT YET CLEAR THAT IT IS POSSIBLE TO BE WITH CURRENT TECHNOLOGIES OF DETECTION

[Captain Drunk]

Read this thread. Gentlemen you put too many beliefs to the current capabilities of STEALTH technologies.

Exactly! Thats why I say Speed is # 1 !

Imagine it's 2039, advanced 'third generation' laser gun equipped F-22 variants are supercrusin' at Mach 1.7 below 50,000 ft in some hostile environment somewhere in the Middle East, with enemy Arab 'first generation' hypersonic Migs flying at Mach 5+ and 2,50,000 ft shooting satellite guided missiles to the earth below.....now which was better in the long run, speed or stealth ;) ?

[-{SpoonmaN}-]

It's pretty simple, everything. Speed, range, survivability, interoperability, advanced avionics, ease of maintainance, large payload capacity, long service life, upgradability, multi-role capability, maneuverability, the ability to operate in all weather from 'rough' airfields, and the lowest possible procurement and operations costs.
Everyone tries to give as much of all of these things as they possibly can to their Fighter design, for the best price possible.

Oh and a half-decent pilot is pretty important too.

[FiRepower]

SpoonmaN is right

[Big K]

a pilot at first??...i guess...

[glyn]

a pilot at first??...i guess...

The next generation of fighters could be unmanned.

[Jimmy]

Unlikely. Latency will continue to be an issue for a long time. Unless we come up with some seriously long-ranged systems to ensure that command latency poses no danger.

[FiRepower]

Or maybe they need a new tehnology that is yet to be invented !




INVISIBILITY!

[omeko3]

Unlikely. Latency will continue to be an issue for a long time. Unless we come up with some seriously long-ranged systems to ensure that command latency poses no danger.

AI? wouldn't that completely remove the latency problem?

[Jimmy]

Yeah pretty much. But I doubt we'll see anything like that in time for 6th generation fighters.

[omeko3]

Yes but from what I have heard we are looking at keeping the F-22 for something like 20-30 years at the least. I believe that we may be looking at AI within 10-20. I would guess with the military's budget DARPA would be the first to come up with it.