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Thread: COVID-2019 in America, effect on politics and economy

  1. #736
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Think you missed the point. Most of those leaving Wuhan wasn't going to Beijing or Shanghai. This was CNY when families come together at home. The ones leaving home are the ones who can afford to travel during the Holidays, ie overseas. Wuhan would have been experiencing an influx, not an exodos, same as Beijing and Shanghai.
    Hang on a minute, here is what the Wuhan mayor said

    About 5 million residents left Wuhan before the lockdown because of the deadly coronavirus epidemic and the Spring Festival holiday, mayor Zhou Xianwang revealed on Sunday, as health officials *warned the virus’ *ability to spread was *getting *stronger.

    There were about 9 million people remaining in the city after the lockdown, Zhou told a press conference.
    So they left for CNY a well as a fear of the virus.

    5 million left Wuhan before lockdown, 1,000 new coronavirus cases expected in city | SCMP | Jan 26 2020

    And this

    Where did they go? Millions left city before quarantine | AP | Feb 09 2020

    A lot of interactive graphics in that article but my hunch was right.

    Bulk went back to Hubei (hence the high case load there) and the rest to the neighbouring provinces with some trickling further out.

    Have i still misunderstood what you said ??
    Last edited by Double Edge; 12 Apr 20, at 03:34.

  2. #737
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbm3fan View Post
    Not quite as it was pointed out there were limitations. Now it was just announced that NIH is going to begin a trial to test the drugs. This will be a by the book clinical trial by the NIH. I participated in a NIH research study regarding the retina and diabetes back in 1979-81 and when I left it wasn't done yet.

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKCN21R2OM
    WHO is conducting a study on HCQ called Solidarity

    Results out in six weeks time

  3. #738
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Closing their borders? This is the Ugandan-Rwandan Border.

    You don't need to be a soldier to see how incredibly easy to have massive leakage.

    Both those countries rank high on the govt stringency index as of March end

    Name:  govt stringency.jpg
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    click the graph to get an interactive one you can hover over and see when they clamped up

    Threw Canada in there for reference.

    More in this BBC article

    Coronavirus: The world in lockdown in maps and charts | BBC | Apt 07 2020

    Name:  africa.jpg
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    Rwanda, Mauritius & Djibouti all seemed to have clamped down fairly soon after the first case.

    Rwanda earlier than Uganda.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 12 Apr 20, at 06:56.

  4. #739
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Have i still misunderstood what you said ??
    You're right. I stand corrected.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Both those countries rank high on the govt stringency index as of March end
    Decrees and effective enforcement are two different things, especially outside the cities. If you think the criminal/rebel elements are going to obey the lockdowns, especially wtih 2 guards armed with 1 AK47, then San Francisco is for sale - cheap.

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    Senior Contributor surfgun's Avatar
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  6. #741
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    You're right. I stand corrected.
    The question no one asks ? when are those five million returning or how many will return to Wuhan.

    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Decrees and effective enforcement are two different things, especially outside the cities. If you think the criminal/rebel elements are going to obey the lockdowns, especially wtih 2 guards armed with 1 AK47, then San Francisco is for sale - cheap.
    Now I'm curious as to why you picked the border of those two particular countries to make your point about all of Africa ?

    Out of any border in the entire continent you picked the one of whose countries have the highest stringency on the continent. Is the point that if it does not work here then the rest of the continent is gone ?

    Looking at those indexes i'd expect these two countries to do better than others in Africa where data is missing.

    What are criminals to do ? people are at home so can't do break ins and the streets are empty so who do you mug, heh

    What surprises me as i look around various countries is the degree of voluntary compliance from the public. There's always exceptions but on the whole i see cities quite barren of people.

    Rebels are going to have to deal with soldiers. If they are deployed.

    No civvies around, no collateral damage,right ?

    Even if this happens unless these two types hold mass gatherings the virus isn't getting going in either of the two countries you mentioned. If they hold gatherings among themselves then they will take them selves out.

    How much meaningful leakage can rebels & criminals cause if the public complies on the whole ?
    Last edited by Double Edge; 13 Apr 20, at 00:41.

  7. #742
    Senior Contributor Bigfella's Avatar
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    As expected, Trump is starting to publicly turn on Fauci. The very worst thing you can do around this President is openly speak a truth he refuses to accept. Hopefully Fauci will be allowed to continue his job, though expect criticism of him to be firmly in the 'mainstream' of right wing commentary (which is to say the far right).


    Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

  8. #743
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfella View Post
    As expected, Trump is starting to publicly turn on Fauci. The very worst thing you can do around this President is openly speak a truth he refuses to accept.
    Authoritarians like Trump rarely - if ever - want to hear the unvarnished truth. Speaking it out loud is usually suicidal, in one form or another. Here in our supposedly civilized society, it's just career suicide. Of course, this is the Age of Trump, and therefore....

    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfella View Post
    Hopefully Fauci will be allowed to continue his job, though expect criticism of him to be firmly in the 'mainstream' of right wing commentary (which is to say the far right).
    ...the far right continues to call for his head, literally in some cases. They also think it's fully justified that he's been forbidden to go on CNN by Pence.
    TwentyFiveFortyFive

  9. #744
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfella View Post
    Hopefully Fauci will be allowed to continue his job, though expect criticism of him to be firmly in the 'mainstream' of right wing
    commentary (which is to say the far right).
    Not far right just right, already posted one by a commentator here and that's from Mar 23

    Why is this surprising ? CEO president let's people go as he likes now for a while.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 13 Apr 20, at 05:04.

  10. #745
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    first sailor from TR has passed from COVID.

    almost 600 sailors infected.

    just a reminder, f*ck Modly.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

  11. #746
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    first sailor from TR has passed from COVID.

    almost 600 sailors infected.

    just a reminder, f*ck Modly.
    There are a lot of folks with stars on their shoulders between Crozier & Modly need to get fucked.
    “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
    Mark Twain

  12. #747
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Why is this surprising ? CEO president let's people go as he likes now for a while.
    It's not surprising. We keep trying to rationalize irrationality: "Maybe this time Trump will see the seriousness of the situation and not allow his malignant narcissism to overrule what is clearly a life-or-death choice"

    This of course is utter foolishness on our part. Trump's malignant narcissism will always win out, and his rage-filled followers will obediently act on his dog whistles.

    I spent 5 years working for a man exactly like Trump, by all indications a textbook case of Narcissistic Personality Disorder.. I never once stopped trying to rationalize his irrational self-destructive behaviors....even though I knew damn good and well that I was pissing into the wind.

    "CEO" president lol. Yeah, sure.
    TwentyFiveFortyFive

  13. #748
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Trump claims he has the power to open the states and not the governors. Says there are many good reasons why but doesn't list them nor say where the power comes from. Well, of course not...

    I highlighted the punch lines

    President Donald Trump declared Monday that he has the power to “open up” states and relax social-distancing practices adopted to combat the coronavirus outbreak, not governors.

    He didn’t elaborate on how he reached his conclusion. The Trump administration issued guidance March 16 recommending Americans isolate themselves from one another to curb the spread of the virus, days after many governors, municipal leaders, businesses and families had already adopted the practices themselves.

    It isn’t clear if the country would comply should Trump demand people return to work and school, particularly if the outbreak hasn’t yet abated.

    For the purpose of creating conflict and confusion, some in the Fake News Media are saying that it is the Governors decision to open up the states, not that of the President of the United States & the Federal Government. Let it be fully understood that this is incorrect....

    — Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) April 13, 2020

    “It is the decision of the president, for many good reasons,” Trump said in a subsequent tweet. He didn’t list any.

    Trump said he would make a decision “soon” on re-opening, “in
    conjunction with the governors and input from others.” He said last week he plans to name a panel of doctors and business people on Tuesday to advise him on restoring the U.S. economy following the outbreak.

    But the president’s relationship with governors during the outbreak has been complicated and oftentimes prickly. He has insisted that governors, not the federal government, bear primary responsibility for keeping their hospitals supplied and staving off the coronavirus. And he’s declined to criticize governors who have refused to issue “stay-at-home” orders to their citizens to curb the spread of the virus.

    We have a thing called the Constitution, which I cherish, number one,” Trump said on April 4, when asked about the holdout governors, who are all Republicans. “Number two, those governors -- I know every one of them -- they’re doing a great job. They’re being very, very successful in what they’re doing. And as you know, I want the governors to be running things.”

    Governors have complained they’ve been forced to bid against the Federal Emergency Management Agency for supplies, and Democratic governors who have faulted the federal government’s response to the outbreak have suffered Trump’s wrath, enduring personal insults and criticism on Twitter and in his daily news conferences.
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...-not-governors

  14. #749
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    A separate Trump adviser tried to explain Trump's weekend retweet, saying the President often retweets posts on Twitter without reading the entire tweet.

    "You guys assume he reads tweets before he retweets," the adviser said. "He doesn't."
    There it is in a nutshell. Well, duh!!!

  15. #750
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    "You guys assume he reads," the adviser said. "He doesn't."
    Fixed it.
    TwentyFiveFortyFive

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