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Thread: Indian Defence News & Discussions

  1. #16
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    No, they'll just sell F-16-"EXTREME" based on the F-21 if someone else is willing to pay. It's just a friggin name. Changing it would get them out of that promise.
    F-21 = newer version of F-16.
    I don't think Lockheed will sell it to Pakistan, at the very least. The wordings, if the deal happens, will be structured as such. Among other things, F-21 doesn't reverberate cold war era politics between the 2 countries.
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  2. #17
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Because AT defences are vulnerable to artillery both air and ground based. They are static and must rely on earthworks for concealment and protection wheras armour are maneuver assets. Tanks can go around AT defences, not vice versa.
    I guess, air artillery means missiles fired from helis and jets. What do you mean when you say armour are maneuver assets? You meant tank, which can maneuver?

    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Tanks can race under howitzer ballistic arcs. Infantry can deny ground to tanks. And howitzers can pound infantry to hamburger.

    Each have their place.
    Bold - Gun laying, in non-military sense.

    How can infantry deny ground to tanks? Tank can take 1 accurate shot and pound infantry (men and vehicles).
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    F-21 = newer version of F-16.
    I don't think Lockheed will sell it to Pakistan, at the very least. The wordings, if the deal happens, will be structured as such. Among other things, F-21 doesn't reverberate cold war era politics between the 2 countries.
    Money talks. Bullshit walks.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    I guess, air artillery means missiles fired from helis and jets. What do you mean when you say armour are maneuver assets? You meant tank, which can maneuver?
    Armour also includes mechanized forces, such as armoured infantry vehicles. Maneuver in the modern sense is anything with 4+ wheels.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Bold - Gun laying, in non-military sense.
    High school physics. Howitzers and MLRS rely on arcs for their distance which takes time for the round to travel the distance. By that time, a moving target would have already "moved" and unless a smart round, there's no way to predict which way the target would have moved.

    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    How can infantry deny ground to tanks? Tank can take 1 accurate shot and pound infantry (men and vehicles).
    You're talking to an engineer. A simple trench or tiger traps would stop tanks cold, never mind mine fields would wreck them.

  4. #19
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

    Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain!

  5. #20
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

    Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain!

  6. #21
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    US: We’ll Pay Countries to Ditch Russian, Chinese Arms

    This is interesting, but this is not for India/SouthAsia.

    “It’s meant to incentivize partners and allies to put in their own funds to modernize their military and divest Russian legacy equipment,” the State Department official said. “The idea being, we can put in some U.S. grant military assistance. They would then put in some amount of partner military [funding].”
    We're neither a partner, nor an ally. What are we? Yeah, on our own. God help us.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

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  7. #22
    Military Professional Deltacamelately's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    US: We’ll Pay Countries to Ditch Russian, Chinese Arms

    This is interesting, but this is not for India/SouthAsia.



    We're neither a partner, nor an ally. What are we? Yeah, on our own. God help us.
    India is a "Major Defense Partner" ;-)
    And on the sixth day, God created the Field Artillery...

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post

    We're neither a partner, nor an ally. What are we? Yeah, on our own. God help us.
    "Country with deep pockets and urgent needs" ;-)
    Last edited by jlvfr; 20 May 19, at 19:27.

  9. #24
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Oh my aching hed : (

    Russian S-400 System Requires Friendly Aircraft Data To Identify Friend Or Foe | Defense world | May 16 2019

    S400 is a great anti-aircraft defense system, its just too bad it will also shoot down any western planes we get because it thinks they are foes.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Oh my aching hed : (

    Russian S-400 System Requires Friendly Aircraft Data To Identify Friend Or Foe | Defense world | May 16 2019

    S400 is a great anti-aircraft defense system, its just too bad it will also shoot down any western planes we get because it thinks they are foes.
    Is there an American system which is equal to or higher in capability than the S-400? No? Then India is going to buy it, US pressure notwithstanding. Unless US fixes Pak, Pakistani terrorism and Pakistani nukes or gives India the go-ahead, India will not move towards having a fully American arsenal. It's a very very very dangerous neighbourhood we live in.

    Quote Originally Posted by jlvfr View Post
    "Country with deep pockets and urgent needs" ;-)
    Funny you see it this way. We do have pressing need, but we don't have deep pockets. Unless you meant, our crooked politicians should fix the leakages in our social distribution system, and the billions of dollars saved being moved for defense purchases. It's more likely a mirage.
    P.S.: There are 6-8 hours of power outages everyday, and to think that BJP rules both Delhi and Assam. Nothing good can happen to this country, until we're ruled with an iron-grip by a military man. Fcuk democracy, embrace authoritarianism.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

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  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Funny you see it this way. We do have pressing need, but we don't have deep pockets. Unless you meant, our crooked politicians should fix the leakages in our social distribution system, and the billions of dollars saved being moved for defense purchases. It's more likely a mirage.
    From the outside, ie, the people who have gear to sell, what is seen is a country that wants to buy (up to) hundreds of fighters, is buying dozens of helicopters and upgrading their armour and artillery. All this translates into "has deep pockets". Hence the US rush to sell everything and anything.

  12. #27
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Is there an American system which is equal to or higher in capability than the S-400? No? Then India is going to buy it, US pressure notwithstanding. Unless US fixes Pak, Pakistani terrorism and Pakistani nukes or gives India the go-ahead, India will not move towards having a fully American arsenal. It's a very very very dangerous neighbourhood we live in.
    Is this article a ploy to make us not buy the S400 citing the inability to identify friend or foe ?

    He says the US won't sell F35 to Turkey because sensitive data about F35 has to be fed into S400 so it knows not to shoot it down. I don't know what to make of this statement. You'd think it would be able to do something this basic without revealing too much.

    In a paper titled titled "Understanding why the US doesn’t want India to buy the S400," he said Turkey, a NATO member state and India, which is America's "major defence partner," have signed Communications Compatibility and Security Agreement (COMCASA) with the US. This enables them to procure specialised equipment for encrypted communications for US origin military platforms like the C-17, C-130 and P-8Is; and likely for future platforms like the 24 MH-70 Romeo anti-submarine helicopters, the Sea Guardian drones, etc.

    "The threat of the compromise of data is large. The concern extends to the possibility of installation of malware on the S-400 for continued access of information," Mahajan wrote.
    I cannot find the aforementioned paper written by the Group Captain on google. And the underlined bit makes no sense whatsoever. installation of malware on the S400 ? then shouldn't the Russians be saying something. Or is there some grammatical error in there.

    What this article achieves very well is create FUD about S400 without enlightening the reader at all !!

    He does belong to the US - India strategic partnership forum so what does that make him ? a shill for the Americans ?!?

    Maybe something from a "Indo - Russian strategic forum", if such an org exists might clarify better.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 21 May 19, at 20:41.

  13. #28
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    ^ The Russians are not saying anything openly which makes this article look biased. Although I'd like to believe the Russians have guaranteed confidence of the system to the highest levels to the Government. USD 5 billion is not peanuts, and India is notorious for dragging its feet over money, has even cancelled many acquisitions. I think the US wants a way out. They don't want to sanction India, while sanctioning turkey, at the same time persuade India to move away from Russian arms.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

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  14. #29
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    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

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  15. #30
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    Amid Russia arms row, India plans mega deal for US military drones

    30 armed Sea Guardian drones. 10 each for the IA, IAF, IN.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles!

    Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain!

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