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    Senior Contributor DOR's Avatar
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    The US 2020 Presidential Election

    Let the Games Begin!
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    Senior Contributor DOR's Avatar
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    2020 Presidential Candidates

    The Declared and The "Interested"

    Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY)
    Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-HI)
    Sen. Kamala Harris (D-CA)
    Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA)
    Former HUD Secretary Julian Castro (D-TX)
    Rep. Johh Delaney (D-MD)
    State Senator Richard Ojeda (D-WV)
    Vice President Joe Biden (D-DE)
    Sen. Michael Bennet (D-CO)
    Sen Cory Booker (D-NJ)
    Mayor Bill deBlasio (D-NY)
    Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-NH)

    Sen. Bob Corker (R-TN)
    Former Sen. Jeff Flake (R-AZ)
    Gov. John Kasich (R-OH)
    Gov. Larry Hogan (R-MD)
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    Hopefully someone runs against Trump, and only one person against Trump. Last thing the GOP needs is another three-ring circus in the primaries. I'd say Kasich or Romney are the best positioned at the moment, though I like Kasich's general election chances better than Romney. I don't expect Trump to lose, but it's definitely worth a shot.

    On the Dem side, I'm looking more towards Harris/Booker with Gillibrand in the third place seat. I think Booker/Harris both have the possibility of picking up elite support and still appealing to most of the Millennial voters who are looking for the cool, new thing, at least enough to offset the people who will be turned off by some of their negatives while in office (liberals on my FB seem to have questions about Harris' prosecutorial practices, and Booker is a typical NJ senator with typical corporate baggage).

    I think Warren has enough steam in NH/Iowa to keep going, but I expect she'll run into disappointing results unless she has an all-star campaign. My feeling is that the money is more comfortable aligning behind someone less left-wing than her.
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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    So based on a 60 Minutes interview Howard Schultz of Starbucks fame is seriously thinking of running as an Independent or 3rd Party if you will. Ugh!!! With elections swinging on a few thousand votes in a handful of battleground states for the Electoral votes what is he thinking? He says we can't have more of Trump then turns around and says both parties have their issues. His entry pretty much guarantees that Trump wins. Not only that but he and his base will see it as a direct message from God reaffirming he is the only one who can save America from her moral depravity and being overrun by the Mongol hordes who rape, pillage and rob. Shades of 2000 all over again yet worse.

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    currently on the Dem side, Harris is the front-runner. don't think Booker will get too far; he has too much association as a "corporate Dem".

    Sanders predictably threw his hat in the ring. joy.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Probably right about Booker vis a vis the Progressive wing.

    To me I look upon Sanders and Warren as jokes. Neither of them could siphon off three Midwest states to deny Trump. LOL, probably do the opposite.

    Harris is a wait and see project.

    Klobuchar is interesting in that she is more willing to say "what is possible" versus "pie in the sky ideas." However, some on the Left feel that she needs to be eliminated ( a moderate) from the race because the energy is coming from the Left.

    The Left seems incredibly shortsighted when it comes to paying attention to the Electoral College. Getting progressives to turn out in large numbers in New York and California won't change a thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DOR View Post
    2020 Presidential Candidates

    The Declared and The "Interested"

    Sen. Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY)
    Rep. Tulsi Gabbard (D-HI)
    Sen. Kamala Harris (D-CA)
    Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA)
    Former HUD Secretary Julian Castro (D-TX)
    Rep. Johh Delaney (D-MD)
    State Senator Richard Ojeda (D-WV)
    Vice President Joe Biden (D-DE)
    Sen. Michael Bennet (D-CO)
    Sen Cory Booker (D-NJ)
    Mayor Bill deBlasio (D-NY)
    Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-NH)

    Sen. Bob Corker (R-TN)
    Former Sen. Jeff Flake (R-AZ)
    Gov. John Kasich (R-OH)
    Gov. Larry Hogan (R-MD)
    Perhaps should also included Bill Weld in the race.

    .
    .
    .

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    essentially true. but even more serious than all of this is that it's gotten to the point where any major legislation that can't/doesn't involve end-runs like reconciliation is effectively DOA unless one party has ridiculously immense political power.

    this applies to both sides, btw. the GOP in 2016 was probably in its most commanding state since the 1920s and the only major thing that was passed was a tax cut bill.

    https://www.vox.com/policy-and-polit...ft-brad-delong

    Barack Obama rolls into office with Mitt Romney’s health care policy, with John McCain’s climate policy, with Bill Clinton’s tax policy, and George H.W. Bush’s foreign policy. He’s all these things not because the technocrats in his administration think they’re the best possible policies, but because [White House adviser] David Axelrod and company say they poll well.

    And [Chief of Staff] Rahm Emanuel and company say we’ve got to build bridges to the Republicans. We’ve got to let Republicans amend cap and trade up the wazoo, we’ve got to let Republicans amend the [Affordable Care Act] up the wazoo before it comes up to a final vote, we’ve got to tread very lightly with finance on Dodd-Frank, we have to do a very premature pivot away from recession recovery to “entitlement reform.”

    All of these with the idea that you would then collect a broad political coalition behind what is, indeed, Mitt Romney’s health care policy and John McCain’s climate policy and George H.W. Bush’s foreign policy.

    And did George H.W. Bush, did Mitt Romney, did John McCain say a single good word about anything Barack Obama ever did over the course of eight solid years?

    No, they fucking did not. No allegiance to truth on anything other than the belief that John Boehner, Paul Ryan, and Mitch McConnell are the leaders of the Republican Party, and since they’ve decided on scorched earth, we’re to back them to the hilt. So the politics were completely wrong, and we saw this starting back in the Clinton administration.

    Today, there’s literally nobody on the right between those frantically accommodating Donald Trump, on the one hand, and us on the other. Except for our brave friends in exile from the Cato Institute now trying to build something in the ruins at the [centrist] Niskanen Center. There’s simply no political place for neoliberals to lead with good policies that make a concession to right-wing concerns.
    Last edited by astralis; 05 Mar 19, at 15:05.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    Trump continues to destroy the US reputation with the rest of the world and for that reason the US will suffer even more if Trump is given 4 more years.

    This at a time when China benefits hugely with the world turning against the US because of Trump and his renegade actions against so many countries, including the US's allies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JRT View Post
    Perhaps should also included Bill Weld in the race.

    That Julian Castro guy might be the anti-establishment candidate that's so sorely needed. He sounds a bit like Bernie Sanders with his ideas but he's likely smart enough to keep his 'social responsibility' cards close to his chest. If the Dems get any notion that he's a socialist then he will be toast.

    Reminds of Obama who was promoting social responsibility but became toast because of the Repubs and the extreme right's demonizing campaign. And to some extent of the Dems' establishment not being ready for him and his ideas.

    And the rest of the Dems so far are just the same old, same old.

    Or does anybody see a flash in the pan in any of those candidates?

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    Looks like the left's favourite media (MSNBC) is being a bit proactive on it's suspicions of Biden crashing and burning.

    They're starting to say some good things about Bernie Sanders now! It seems that they are coming to the realization that if Joe does crash and burn, the next choice of the huge majority of the left is going to be Bernie. (Joe will crash and burn.)

    Then they showed a buch of charts to prove that the Dem party has indeed moved quite far left. And so all the Dem also-ran candidates are starting to talk social policy, or what a lot of the US right calls socialism.

    prediction: By Monday the also-rans will be trying to trump Bernie on Bernie-ism.
    eg. socialism.

    What a mess for the Dems! The most leftist of the lot is going to be the sweetheart for a while. He/she is going to have to out-Bernie, Bernie.
    Last edited by montgomery; 06 Apr 19, at 18:30.

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    The latest from Trump:

    Trump wants Barr to investigate the 'collusion' and 'obstruction' accusations as an attempted coup.

    Anybody, ya think?

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    Sleepy Joe gets a free run in Iowa

    The Iowa caucuses are happening in a little over two weeks, and they’re on a collision course with a certain event that’s expected to keep several top candidates stuck in Washington: President Donald Trump’s impeachment trial.

    Three of the candidates polling in the top five in Iowa are sitting US senators — Bernie Sanders (I-VT), Elizabeth Warren (D-MA), and Amy Klobuchar (D-MN). And all three plus the lower-polling Sen. Michael Bennet (D-CO) will have to substantially curb their time on the campaign trail starting Tuesday, January 21.
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    Trump May Skip Debates, or Seek New Host, if Process Isn't 'Fair'

    WASHINGTON — President Donald Trump’s campaign is considering only participating in general election debates if an outside firm serves as the host, and his advisers recently sat down with the nonprofit Commission on Presidential Debates to complain about the debates it hosted in 2016.

    The Dec. 19 meeting between Frank Fahrenkopf, a prominent Republican and co-chairman of the commission; Brad Parscale, campaign manager for Trump’s reelection effort; and another political adviser, Michael Glassner, came soon after Trump posted on Twitter that the 2016 debates had been “biased.”

    Fahrenkopf said the meeting was cordial but that Parscale essentially reiterated Trump’s complaints.

    Parscale said “that the president wanted to debate, but they had concerns about whether or not to do it with the commission,” Fahrenkopf said, including worries about “whether or not the commission would be fair.”

    Trump’s advisers asserted that the debate commission included “anti-Trumpers.” They also complained about previous moderators, Fahrenkopf said.

    Fahrenkopf, in turn, insisted that the debate commission did not include any anti-Trump bias, and he said he walked Parscale through the guidelines for commission board members that require their neutrality.

    He also said that with one exception, the commission did not think any of the moderators chosen over several decades had exhibited concerning behavior during the debates.

    The one moderator he agreed was problematic was Candy Crowley, who was at CNN in 2012 when she moderated a debate between Mitt Romney, the Republican nominee, and President Barack Obama.

    Crowley fact-checked Romney when he wrongly claimed it took Obama 14 days to call an attack in Benghazi, Libya, an “act of terror.”

    The meeting between Parscale and Fahrenkopf ended after 45 minutes with no resolution.

    Since then, Parscale has told people that he was investigating other options for hosting the debates. It is not clear which outside firms he or other officials are talking to, and the campaign declined to provide any details.

    “We want to have debates that are fair and are more geared toward informing the American people than to boosting the careers of the moderators,” Tim Murtaugh, a spokesman for Trump’s campaign, said of the meeting.

    The commission has scheduled three presidential debates, to be held on college campuses in late September and October, as well as one vice-presidential debate.

    Trump has been discussing the possibility of sitting out the general election debates for months. He has harbored bad feelings about the debate commission since the 2016 election, when he accused them of putting him at a disadvantage “on purpose” by giving him a “defective mic” at the first debate. (Trump was clearly audible to television viewers, but the commission said a technical malfunction affected the volume of his voice in the debate hall.)

    After The New York Times reported that Trump had discussed the possibility of sitting the debates out, he wrote on Twitter that he wanted to face off against his eventual Democratic opponent. But he said that “the problem is that the so-called Commission on Presidential Debates is stacked with Trump Haters & Never Trumpers.”

    He added that “there are many options, including doing them directly & avoiding the nasty politics of this very biased Commission. I will make a decision at an appropriate time but in the meantime, the Commission on Presidential Debates is NOT authorized to speak for me (or R’s)!”

    Most people close to the president said his advisers are likely using a debate around debates to work with the commission, which was established in 1987 and has attempted to maintain its independence through every presidential cycle since then.

    Representatives from both major presidential campaigns typically begin to approach the commission well before the party conventions, as Parscale did, and the commission spends months working with advisers and campaign lawyers to hammer out the specifics.

    People close to the president also believe he has a slim window to try to affect who the moderators are, since there may be a presumptive Democratic nominee as soon as mid-March, and that person might push back against Trump’s attempts to influence the choice.
    ________________

    Ah here we go again. President Snowflake whining like a little bitch about "unfairness".... In reality he's rigging the goalposts for travel. I'll be shocked if Trump actually attends a debate, regardless of the circumstances.
    TwentyFiveFortyFive

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