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The US 2020 Presidential Election & Attempts To Overturn It

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  • Originally posted by snapper View Post
    So now you agree that the RNC was hacked but argue they decided not to release it because it was not relevant?
    No, I do not agree that the RNC was hacked. The old domains were not actively protected and therefore, were of no value. Yeah, you broke into my old house but I no longer live there and it's empty and broken down.

    Originally posted by snapper View Post
    It is relevant... the people who Trump asked for help, helped him, whom he has never said a bad word about and you cannot put the dots together?
    It is YOU who cannot put the dots together. In fact, you're seeing spots where there are none. Obviously, you don't even read up on the situation. Trump has a ridiculus short attention span. If you don't keep hammering the point, he would not notice and forget. That is even obvious from his tweets that he don't know what he tweeted the day before and contradicts himself almost daily. Throughout ALL the reports, the bounty intel WAS NEVER hammered in.

    In any case, NOTHING TO DO WITH PUTIN PUTTING TRUMP IN THE WHITE HOUSE. RED HERRING!

    Also, has it occurred to you that Trump is too damned stupid to be Putin's agent?

    Originally posted by snapper View Post
    I am not saying that Trumpkin believed he would win - or that Putin did either for that matter. I am saying that neither you nor I can know what they thought. Putin may have to wished to just 'stir the water' but equally he acted to help Trump.
    Oh for Pete sakes, now, you're tap dancing. I know EXACTLY how Putin thought of the election. That Clinton will win. There is absolutely zero doubt about it. The intel allows for no other conclusion. I'm not trying to read if Putin thought of Trump sucking his dick or not. I'm stating outright that I know EXACTLY how Putin read that intel and the only conclusion he could have gotten.
    Last edited by Officer of Engineers; 04 Jul 20,, 18:03.
    Chimo

    Comment


    • Can Trump's anti-mail-voting crusade hurt him in key states?

      DES MOINES, Iowa (AP) — President Donald Trump's campaign and allies have blocked efforts to expand mail-in voting, forcing an awkward confrontation with top GOP election officials who are promoting the opposite in their states.

      The rare dissonance between Trump and other Republican elected officials also reflects another reality the president will not concede: Many in his party believe expanding mail-in voting could ultimately help him.

      Trump's campaign has intervened directly in Ohio, while allies have fired warning shots in Iowa and Georgia, aimed at blunting Republican secretaries of state in places that could be competitive in November.

      “There is a dimension to legislatures underfunding or undercutting election officials that could ironically backfire and hurt Republicans,” said Michael McDonald, a University of Florida professor and director of the nonpartisan United States Election Project.

      Action by these three secretaries of state, who are the top election officials in their states, was designed to make ballot access easier during the coronavirus pandemic. Trump has repeatedly made the unfounded claim that voting by mail could lead to fraud so extensive it could undermine the integrity of the presidential election.

      In Ohio last month, senior Trump campaign adviser Bob Paduchik weighed in on Secretary of State Frank LaRose's proposal, insisting to GOP legislative leaders that they drop a provision to allow voters to file absentee ballot applications online, according to Republican officials involved in the discussions. The GOP officials spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss internal communications regarding the legislation.

      Ohio already allows the secretary of state to send absentee ballot requests to every registered voter. The provision was aimed at allowing a faster processing option, while making mail-in application processing available.

      Paduchik, Trump's 2016 Iowa campaign director, insisted there be no substantive changes ahead of the November election in Ohio, which Trump won in 2016 by 8 percentage points under the existing rules, according to the GOP officials.

      Trump campaign aides did not respond to requests for comment.

      “This bill didn't do everything I wanted it to do. In fact, there's several things I wanted to get done that are not included in this bill," LaRose said in a video statement this month, promising to try ”to get some of those other changes made in the future."

      Trump has railed against expanding vote by mail, arguing without evidence that the practice, despite being the primary voting method in Colorado, Hawaii, Oregon, Washington and Utah, is ripe for widespread fraud.

      On Sunday, he renewed the criticism, tweeting “Mail-In Voting, on the other hand, will lead to the most corrupt Election is USA history. Bad things happen with Mail-Ins.”

      That claim is part of a pattern. He also has incorrectly equated a secretary of state widely distributing absentee ballot requests with the ballots themselves in Michigan.

      Last week, after Iowa voters broke a 26-year-old statewide primary election turnout record, the Iowa Senate's GOP majority pressed to bar Secretary of State Paul Pate from sending absentee ballots to all 2 million registered voters this fall, as he did before the June 3 primary.

      Republican Gov. Kim Reynolds, a Trump ally, last week signed compromise legislation requiring Pate and his successors to seek approval from a partisan legislative council for similar future actions. The GOP-controlled council unanimously rejected Pate's request to widely send absentee ballot applications this fall.

      “My goal was to protect Iowa voters and poll workers while finding ways to conduct a clean and fair election," Pate said last month. “I stand by my decisions.”

      His Georgia counterpart, Brad Raffensperger, faced a similar fate after he, too, sent absentee ballot applications to nearly 7 million registered voters ahead of the state’s June primary. Although Raffensperger objected to proposed limits being put on his authority, legislation to do that died when the legislature adjourned and after he said he would not repeat the move this fall.

      Trump carried Georgia, Iowa and Ohio comfortably in 2016. To win again, he would likely need to match his sizable winning margins in their rural counties, home to many in his older, white base.

      Presumptive Democratic presidential nominee Joe Biden has backed mail-in voting, saying it would make it easier for people to vote this November amid the coronavirus pandemic.

      Some longtime GOP activists say expanded vote by mail is essential for older voters who are accustomed to voting in person but hesitant to during the pandemic and who are unfamiliar with the process.

      Ann Trimble Ray, a veteran Iowa GOP activist, voted in June by mail and says Pate made the right call, especially for the many older voters in her rural home in Sac County, which Trump carried with 72% of the 2016 vote.

      “Reducing their exposure by voting absentee, we think, was a considerate thing to do," she said. “I was grateful for Secretary of State Pate's mailing and encouragement for absentee voting."

      Consolidation of rural polling places, shrunken election staff and long lines may deter rural voters vital to Trump, said University of California Irvine professor Richard Hasen, chair of a committee of U.S. scholars that has recommended changes ahead of the 2020 elections.

      “The voters Trump is hurting are likely his own when he’s making these comments against mail-in balloting," said Hasen, “because it’s a safe and generally effective way to cast a ballot, especially in the midst of a pandemic."

      The check on ballot request steps in Iowa and Georgia also could threaten rural votes from being counted, based on McDonald's study.

      Though Ohio counts all mail-in ballots postmarked by Election Day, a number of absentee ballots came in late for the March 17 primary, including 4,000 in Greene County in southeast Ohio, a county where Trump won 60% of the vote.

      Understaffed election offices and longer processing time between rural areas and metro postal centers could leave some rural voters unable to mail their ballots on time, McDonald said.

      “I’m pretty convinced that ballot request step is hurting rural voters," McDonald said.

      ___

      He's so fucking stupid that the the person he'd hypothetically "shoot on 5th Avenue and not lose voters"....would be one of his own supporters.
      “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

      Comment


      • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
        Care to list all the news organizations in your opinion that are both left and right of center. As a control throw in a few in the center to get the needed baseline.

        I do hope you realize that the lead of MSN is interchangeable with another three letter word that rhymes with BOX.
        I missed this before, but the "centrist" news of note are effectively the newswires (Reuters/AP).
        Fox is a garbage network, along with most of talk radio. I watched O'Reilly back when I was in high school because I had a few friend that liked him, but it is just trash. The only exceptions I would make are Chris Wallace and Tucker Carlson (because the former is a pretty stand-up guy and the latter makes interesting unorthodox points), and that their news reporting isn't necessarily fictional (it's the editorial bent).

        My personal sources of news/editorializing are Twitter, AP, NPR, 538, Marginal Revolution, Vox, and a local paper. I'd read WSJ, FT, and NYT, but they are behind pay-walls.

        But the biggest issue are the social media networks, because they can easily lock you into an ideological echo chamber. It signal boosts certain stories, twists other ones, outright makes up crap, and does not report on anything that goes against the Hive Mind's narrative (because those stories don't get shared). It's pretty important to at least tap into the other bubbles so you aren't blind, and it's pretty important to listen with a sympathetic, open-mind, or else you obviously are just going to tune out.

        Also, it's important to have a great big heaping teaspoon of intellectual humility re: "stuff we don't know" and "stuff I don't know." We've spent the last several decades chasing a dark matter theory that may not exist and might just come down to us STILL not understanding how gravity works despite having centuries to play around with that concept, with a lot of money and a lot of brilliant people and a lot of controlled experiments trying to figure it out....so I'm not sure why anyone is convinced they know what optimal tax policy is when we haven't even had an income tax for 100 years.
        "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

        Comment


        • Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
          No, I do not agree that the RNC was hacked. The old domains were not actively protected and therefore, were of no value. Yeah, you broke into my old house but I no longer live there and it's empty and broken down.
          So they were given the keys to your old house and ransacked it while you still owned it?

          Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
          It is YOU who cannot put the dots together. In fact, you're seeing spots where there are none. Obviously, you don't even read up on the situation. Trump has a ridiculus short attention span. If you don't keep hammering the point, he would not notice and forget. That is even obvious from his tweets that he don't know what he tweeted the day before and contradicts himself almost daily. Throughout ALL the reports, the bounty intel WAS NEVER hammered in.

          In any case, NOTHING TO DO WITH PUTIN PUTTING TRUMP IN THE WHITE HOUSE. RED HERRING!

          Also, has it occurred to you that Trump is too damned stupid to be Putin's agent?
          Ok let's say that Trumpkin did not believe Moscow would help him in the election although it was said clearly to his son by the Aglarov agent "Russia's support for your father" remember from the meeting with the Muscovite lawyer? The one that they said was about 'adoption'. Let's say Trumpkin was never 'briefed' on the 'bounties for US soldiers in Afghanistan' - well he has been now... Why has he done nothing about it? Is it like Helsinki where he consistently truly believes Putin over all US intelligence? I mean he genuinely just believes Putin every time? Do you believe that feasible?



          Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
          Oh for Pete sakes, now, you're tap dancing. I know EXACTLY how Putin thought of the election. That Clinton will win. There is absolutely zero doubt about it. The intel allows for no other conclusion. I'm not trying to read if Putin thought of Trump sucking his dick or not. I'm stating outright that I know EXACTLY how Putin read that intel and the only conclusion he could have gotten.
          I do not know how to tap dance. What I said was that your statement that Putin just wanted stir conflict withing the US system is conjecture. You CANNOT as a matter of epistemological logic 100% KNOW that to be a fact. You can argue that the known facts imply that but you cannot know what Putin was thinking. Why? Well if you could the 'person' (or being) thinking it would not be just a 'Putin'; you would be part of the entity thinking it so it would perhaps be an 'OOE-Putin' as opposed to being just a 'Putin'. You can argue the facts impy (as I do with regarding 'Muscovy supports Trumpkin - I mean Putin admitted it) but you cannot that you 100% know another persons thought. You did say you knew it and I merely dispute the possibility of such 'knowledge'. Pretty simple really...

          Comment


          • Kanye West announces he's running for US President

            Everybody's taking chances. Maybe I should consider running for PM in 2024. Who knows, I might even win, just like Sir Donald Trump.
            Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

            Comment


            • Trump still struggling to articulate his agenda for a second term

              During a Fox News town hall in Wisconsin late last month, President Trump was asked by host Sean Hannity to name his top priority items for a second term. Trump gave a meandering reply about now having the “experience” of being president and living in Washington, D.C. (“Now I know everybody,” he said), then quickly pivoted to the tell-all book by his former national security adviser John Bolton — all without laying out a single policy idea or plan.

              The answer frustrated Sen. Chuck Grassley, R-Iowa, who criticized Hannity for not making Trump focus.

              “I would blame Fox more than I blame the president, because the president, it’s easy for him to digress here and there, but Hannity — you assume Fox wants him to get reelected,” Grassley said. “Hannity should have got him back on the subject.”

              In an interview with Sinclair Broadcasting the following day, former Fox News host Eric Bolling gave Trump an opportunity for a do-over, asking what would be the “main focus” of his second term.

              Trump replied with the slogan of his 2016 presidential campaign.

              “It’s very simple: We’re gonna make America great again,” he said, before ticking off accomplishments such as his trade deals with China, Canada and Mexico, and a push to manufacture products in America.

              “We’re doing it — whether it’s trade, whether it’s military — all made in the USA. It’s so important. Made in the USA,” Trump said. “We’ve got to bring back our manufacturing, and I’ve brought it back very big. But we have to make our own pharmaceutical products, our own drugs, prescription drugs, we have to make our own things. We’re doing it now with steel, we’re doing it now with a lot of different products. I’ve done that. But we can do it with a lot more. We want to build our own ships. We don’t want to send out to other countries to build ships. So we have a lot of things we can do. We’ve done a lot, but we have a lot of things we can do.”

              On Thursday, Hannity gave Trump yet another chance to lay out his agenda.

              “I asked you a question in Wisconsin and you got criticized for the answer,” Hannity told Trump. “I want to ask you again. You are now asking America in 117 days to give you a second term as president of the United States. Let’s — what is your second-term agenda?”

              This was Trump’s reply:

              "First of all, I didn’t know it was criticized for that answer because it’s a simple question. First of all, we’re going to defeat the invisible enemy, and we are well on our way. And again, I told you, the mortality rate is tenfold down. We’re going to rebuild the economy, we’re going to bring back jobs from all of these foreign lands that have stolen our jobs on horrible trade deals. We are going to continue to make great trade deals.

              We’re going to finish rebuilding our wall. We’re going to finish, we’re going to have that — it’s going to be almost complete by the end of this year, shortly thereafter it’s finished. It’s made a tremendous difference. You see, we’re doing record numbers on the border. Very few people are able to get through. We’re rebuilding with our military. We’ve rebuilt the military. $2.5 trillion. We are fixing up the VA for our vets. The job we’ve done there, between choice and accountability.

              We have choice, where they go out and get a doctor. If they are sick, they don’t have to wait for five weeks, six weeks, two weeks. So we are doing great with the vets, and the vets are loving Trump. We are protecting our Second Amendment, so. We need more judges and more justices. You see that now with the Supreme Court more than ever. And the next president, I’ve had two, the next president is going to be able to pick two or three or one or whatever, but a lot of justices. And that means everything, whether it’s for life or other things, I mean it means so much.

              But protecting the Second Amendment, getting more judges. All of the things that we’ve done, nobody’s done what this administration has done in the first three and a half years. Nobody’s even come close. When you look at everything that we’re doing. Now what we’re doing is working on lowering drug prices and knocking out special interests, because it’s not easy. We’re fighting for choice. We did it for the veterans and now we are doing it for school too. One choice in school so a parent can take their child to a school of their choice, and that’s happening — very good, very, very well.

              And we have many things we are doing and many things that we have already completed, and you can’t do more than what we’ve done. I think we’ve set records. We actually set a record on judges. We are going to be, by the time of the end of this year, we will be up to almost 300 federal judges, and that’s a record."


              Trump’s struggle to deliver a concise argument for his reelection has alarmed Republicans, particularly because he has fallen behind former Vice President Joe Biden in the polls, as voters have panned his handling of both the coronavirus pandemic and protests in the wake of George Floyd’s killing.

              After the president’s rally in Tulsa, Okla., last month, the Wall Street Journal’s editorial board warned that Trump “still has no second term message beyond his own grievances” — and without one, he could be heading for “an historic repudiation” in November.

              “An agenda to revive the economy after the pandemic, and restore the gains for workers of his first three years, would appeal to millions,” the paper said. “Perhaps Mr. Trump lacks the self-awareness and discipline to make this case. He may be so thrown off by his falling polls that he simply can’t do it.”
              ____________

              Um, wow. And that's after Hannity dumbed down his question to a 3rd grade level.

              I question how Donald Trump is able to order a Big Mac at McDonald's without thoroughly confusing the cashier.
              “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

              Comment


              • Joe, they could have stopped writing the article after the fifth word of the title....
                “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                Mark Twain

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                  Joe, they could have stopped writing the article after the fifth word of the title....
                  Agreed. It's almost like he's getting worse....
                  “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                  Comment


                  • The polling numbers still appear dodgy. All of them are rooting for Biden, which is fine by me, but I remember how accurate they were the last time. Honestly, I think Biden will make matters worse for America.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by DeHare View Post
                      The polling numbers still appear dodgy. All of them are rooting for Biden, which is fine by me, but I remember how accurate they were the last time. Honestly, I think Biden will make matters worse for America.
                      Welcome to the board, head on over to the Introduction thread and tell us more about yourself!


                      Couple things about your comment above:
                      • The Election is still 100+ days off, which might has well be 100 years off. Trump has plenty of time to turn things around.
                      • Literally anything can happen in those 100+ days, up to and including Trump and/or Biden dying. They're both in their 70s and Trump's health and diet in particular are atrocious
                      • The 2016 polls were very accurate: They predicted a Clinton popular vote win by 3%, and she won by 2.8%
                      • The 2016 polls weren't without their problems, which has prompted a great deal of examination into their methodology by pollsters
                      • Trump's margin of victory in 2016 rested on a razor-thin 77,000 votes in a handful of swing states. He can't afford to lose many votes in those states in 2020.


                      Finally, speaking as a center-right independent, I daresay that Biden could simply do nothing at all and it would be an improvement on the current dumpster fire in the White House.

                      For starters, Biden would be more concerned about COVID-19 and less about what his ratings are.
                      “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                      Comment


                      • Trumps cognitive functions in one paragraph among other foibles of his...

                        "Asked on Monday what he thought about New York and Los Angeles delaying the start of a new school year and the death of an Arizona teacher who died from Covid-19 after teaching at summer school, Trump replied: "Yeah. Schools should be opened. Schools should be opened. ... You're losing a lot of lives by keeping things closed."

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by DeHare View Post
                          The polling numbers still appear dodgy. All of them are rooting for Biden, which is fine by me, but I remember how accurate they were the last time. Honestly, I think Biden will make matters worse for America.
                          One improvement would be that the rule of law will not be subordinated to one man as is tried now. The Presidency will be about the country rather than one man's all absorbing ego. I don't know how long it will take many of his lower income and middle income white supporters to realize they have been scammed by this snake oil salesman. He just wants their applause, their admiration, and their vote but once that stops he will turn his back on you in an instant.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by TopHatter View Post
                            Welcome to the board, head on over to the Introduction thread and tell us more about yourself!


                            Couple things about your comment above:
                            • The Election is still 100+ days off, which might has well be 100 years off. Trump has plenty of time to turn things around.
                            • Literally anything can happen in those 100+ days, up to and including Trump and/or Biden dying. They're both in their 70s and Trump's health and diet in particular are atrocious
                            • The 2016 polls were very accurate: They predicted a Clinton popular vote win by 3%, and she won by 2.8%
                            • The 2016 polls weren't without their problems, which has prompted a great deal of examination into their methodology by pollsters
                            • Trump's margin of victory in 2016 rested on a razor-thin 77,000 votes in a handful of swing states. He can't afford to lose many votes in those states in 2020.

                            .
                            Thats a good summary. Iam actually surprised that shy-voter evidence hasnt emerged. Humans arent great with statistics, if i say something has a 90% chance of occuring and it doesnt people will come back and say hey, you got it wrong, but in fact I also said there ia a 10% chance it doesnt.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by tantalus View Post
                              Thats a good summary. Iam actually surprised that shy-voter evidence hasnt emerged. Humans arent great with statistics, if i say something has a 90% chance of occuring and it doesnt people will come back and say hey, you got it wrong, but in fact I also said there ia a 10% chance it doesnt.
                              Thanks! People want an infallible crystal ball and a single silver bullet when it comes to predictions and explanations, but as you alluded to...in real life, things aren't quite that simple.
                              “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by TopHatter View Post
                                Trump still struggling to articulate his agenda for a second term
                                Reminds me of Lukashenka in Belarus ('election' next month) and Putin's recent 'referendum' on constitutional change (allowing him to stay in power until 2036). Idea? Nothing... economies stagnating, population declining... no agenda nothing.

                                Comment

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