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Thread: Su-57 Will Not Be Mass Produced

  1. #31
    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    When those same mobile air defenses are alerted that B-1s have been spotted at standoff range for cruise missiles they're going to break camp and setup elsewhere.
    A textbook example of SEAD. Breaking down, moving , setting up they capability to shoot has been suppressed. Mission accomplished
    The F-35 can also provide interdiction or CAS despite the fact that some undiscovered TELs are still out there in the wild. In order for 4th gens to accomplish the same you have to field them in huge numbers for mutual support (Recon, Ewar, SEAD, and Air Cover just to support a few Strikers) which exponentially increases the number of refueling assets required, along with the C&C and logistics required to put that kind of package together. A few F-35s can handle the same job without all that support which means they can actually be responsive to immediate needs instead of waiting for HQ to draw up an elaborate battle plan.
    Maybe in the 1970s/80s. We don't do Alpha strikes anymore. F-18s have proven the capability to self escort and still drop bombs on deck. F-16s can do the same.
    As far as immediate needs we have used CAS stacks since Desert Storm.
    Immediate need fulfillment with just a call to the DASC
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  2. #32
    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    Maybe in the 1970s/80s. We don't do Alpha strikes anymore. F-18s have proven the capability to self escort and still drop bombs on deck. F-16s can do the same.
    As far as immediate needs we have used CAS stacks since Desert Storm.
    Immediate need fulfillment with just a call to the DASC
    That works just fine when the opposition has SA-2s and Shilkas that are mostly left to their own devices. I don't know of any way to avoid the Alpha strike model with 4th gen fighters against a modern and competent IADS.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    That works just fine when the opposition has SA-2s and Shilkas that are mostly left to their own devices. I don't know of any way to avoid the Alpha strike model with 4th gen fighters against a modern and competent IADS.
    The big selling point of the f-18 was with smarter airplanes and weapons you could do more damage (on target) with less aircraft than you could with a whole Vietnam- era airwing. The Alpha strike getting all those dissimilar aircraft in place on time took a lot of gas and effort. A pain in the ass is how two former USN aviator strike leaders descriped it.

  4. #34
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    China mulls to buy Russia's Su-57 stealth fighter jet

    Why would the PLAAF want to buy the Su-57, if the J-20 & J-31 are stealth fighters?
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Why would the PLAAF want to buy the Su-57, if the J-20 & J-31 are stealth fighters?
    Tech transfer. No one is impressed with the J-20 and J-31 or the Su-57 for that matter. They're stealth-like, not stealth. None of them solve have a solution to the infra-red problem.

  6. #36
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Tech transfer. No one is impressed with the J-20 and J-31 or the Su-57 for that matter. They're stealth-like, not stealth. None of them solve have a solution to the infra-red problem.
    Exactly. My point is why? China is a challenger to Russia too, so why would Russia sell the Su-57 to China? I mean, it's comparatively new, not like there have been a decade since Su-57 has started production. Maybe the Su-57 is better than the J-20/J-31, but not better enough not to sell to China and make some money, while they have something else coming up, better than the Su-57. For instance, the S-400 have been with the Russians since 2007, but only in 2018 the deliveries to China started, and Russia is planning to deploy the S-500 by 2020 in Moscow. Nobody sells their best equipments.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  7. #37
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    To keep the production line open. This also ensures that Russia remains in control of the technology, licensing it out instead of losing the expertise to the Chinese and the Indians. Russian design houses need to be paid also. If they can't find work in Russia, they will find work in China and India. Selling it to the Chinese means that there were be a Su-37B/C/D... instead of the Chinese using Russian design houses for II/III/IV of the Js.

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