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Thread: 2018 Toronto Van Murders

  1. #196
    Senior Contributor GVChamp's Avatar
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    There's no more evidence that physics is a real science than sociology, and Schrodinger's Cat is the evidence for it. Physicists have no idea what they are describing at a fundamental level.
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

  2. #197
    Senior Contributor Red Team's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GVChamp View Post
    There's no more evidence that physics is a real science than sociology, and Schrodinger's Cat is the evidence for it. Physicists have no idea what they are describing at a fundamental level.
    I'm no expert, but isn't this also true with Quantum Physics? Classical Newtonian Physics is a fairly concrete theory of physics for practicality's sake, but also limited in scope when you look at all the phenomena out there that defies its principles.
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  3. #198
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    Schrodinger's Cat is Quantum Physics and sure there is uncertainty involved in it due to Heisenburg's uncertainty principle but the cat is either alive or not.

  4. #199
    Senior Contributor Versus's Avatar
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    Incel uses terminology that is widely used in MGTOW community in order to describe and define certain behaviors that are not accepted officially by neither sociology and psychology.

    First of them is hypergamy.

    Hypergamy is an instinct that propels woman to seek a man of higher status value than her and to chose him to be her mate. Common wording for this is "marrying up". Women never date or marry down, they always date or marry a man that has equal or higher "value" than them. Modern, educated woman, with the six figure salary will never marry or date a plumber, yet she will seek the guy from same social status or higher. If she can't find someone that has higher status value, she will marry the guy from the same social value strata, but she will never be contented with the relationship and on a first occasion will dump him in favor of higher status male. Men on the other hand are willing to "date down". The word hypergamy is taken from an Indian culture and in essence means the tendency of a woman to marry a guy from a higher cast.

    Solapsism.

    Woman's mind is solapsistic. However, her solapsism is often confused with vanity or narcissism but its not. Due to long history of harsh treatment by men, women's brain has been developed differently. It is not "wired" to be attached to a man, yet it is wired to be attached to her own survival and to her child. Men as men, are not important, only thing that is important is the service and the resources that he can provide. Women therefore don't fall in love in particular man, they fall in love in a man "ideal" and seek the man that fulfills that preconceived picture. They have an idealized picture that serves as a frame in which image of a real man is placed. The more he fits the frame, the more she is "in love" with him. Woman's mind, when it recognizes that man, takes a "snapshot" of that man and fits it into the frame. The fact that real man lives outside her mind, is irrelevant to her. In cases when the real man, changes (which is inevitable due to aging or life circumstances) her mind will recognize that the snapshot no longer conforms to the real man and than she will "fall out of love". When a woman "falls out of love" and falling out of love is an unique female trait, she completely erases every memory of that man. He virtually ceases to exist in her mind. Her solapsistic process than goes something like this. If she went on seeking a man of her dreams in 2010 and found him in 2011, the snapshot was taken in 2011. As the relationship progresses she is in love and everything is fine and dandy. However, the man changes and in 2025 he is no longer the same as the man in 2011. Her brain than concludes that he is not the same and not her choice. He is not the man that she fell in love in, yet a complete stranger. Her brain than creates cognitive dissonance, which says that if she doesn't love him now, in 2025 she never loved him and the reason why she "wasted" all these years with him is because he tricked her into believing that he is something that she loves. Than she begins to resent him and hate him and finally abandoned him, erasing every memory of him from 2011 till 2025. The man, desperately tries to rekindles the love, but the more he tries, the more resentful she is toward him, because he is not "the one" yet someone that harasses her and endangers her by making her feel threaten.

    The Pareto distribution or 80/20 rule.

    Woman's desire to find a man with the superior genetic material and traits, compels her to look only at 20% of men, located at the top of social hierarchy. She ignores 80% of men by default so her zero is at the 80%. That is her starting point for mate selection. This means that top 20% of males will get 80% of females, and those 20% of males are Chads, Tyrons etc. Since male hiearchy is based on dominance, the top men are most dominant and most violent, often with psychopathic traits and narcissism traits. That is why serial killers, felons and criminals maker her V jingle because they represent men whom will stop at nothing to get what they want and are not bound by social norms. Criminal is an ideal man for a woman, because he combines high testosterone, brutality and is prone to violence, which gives her assurance that she will be constantly and instantly protected and can acquire any resource that she wants by stealing it. She is not concerned with the morality as long as she gets what she wants.

    The ideal world if it is constructed by women, would be a mxture of concentration camp and the arena, where chads would fight till death and than the winner, yes ONE MAN would copulate with all the women, and beta providers would be slaves and work in concentration camps. Incels and other bottom men would be permanently expelled from the society. This reminds me of a story of this bull we have in Serbia. Virtually one bull has created all the cows we have here. That is the story of an alpha chad male and that logic is perfectly normal for a female.

    All the stories, living happily ever after, you will find someone, you deserve someone, are delusions and that is the essence of a black pill that incel swallow. The realization that they will NEVER find anyone and that they will be forever alone.
    I mean, Muslims are not stupid for treating their women in a way that they do. Woman's natural drive to mate with the best man, makes harem an natural setting for them.

    This is the truth about human condition and the only reason why it comes as a shock to an incel is due to fact that due to economic prosperity, West has created an abundance of resources that burred these foundations. Now, as economy dwindles the reality surfaces. They were there from the day one, and incels were born on the foundations that are no longer valid. Their pain is real and that drives their pathology because they have no coping mechanisms to deal with this harsh reality.

    In Serbia this is the norm. Chads and Tyrons rule and get all the girls. The small minority of us whom were born under socialism is destined to be alone till the end of our days. But we don't blame women for it, we accept it as normal. As for me, I never had problems attracting girls/women but the communist teaching aka my mental programming still forces me to seek a partner in a woman and that prevents me to go full Chad on them. Because I treat them as equal beings and they interpret that as a weakness, because they don't want a partner they want to be lead and submitted to a man and I hate to lead.

    Now, after becoming MGTOW it is a choice and I am voluntarily celibate.
    Last edited by Versus; 01 May 18, at 20:50.

  5. #200
    Senior Contributor GVChamp's Avatar
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    Yes, the whole field of quantum mechanics is poorly understood. We just fundamentally don't understand how the universe works. The analogy to Newtonian Mechanics is perfect: we thought we had a pretty good idea of how the universe worked, and it turned out we were totally, completely wrong. So wrong we thought that once we "figured out" the reality, we were able to disprove the existence of Planet Vulcan.

    If String Theory is right, we actually exist in at least 12-dimensions, and that would be a relatively simple solution to advanced physics problems.
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

  6. #201
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    You said all that before Versus and it is still BS as is Solipsism. You cannot prove a theory correct - that is why it remains a 'theory'. Solipsism, which basically says all I can ever know is something that I call "I" thinks. Everybody and everything else might be an illusion. So what logical meaning does the "you" or "they" have? A solipsist must argue that have none and are as it were 'illusions' which means most logic must be nonsense too and if that is the case the reasoning for solipsism must be unsafe in itself.
    Last edited by snapper; 01 May 18, at 20:18.

  7. #202
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    I don't think 'social science' are without insight.
    I think both have helped in this discussion and primarily responsible this thread has gone on so long by creating contours anyone can interact with. That's a good thing. IMO.

    What we have trouble accepting are the explanations, our instincts and iife experiences say otherwise

    This does not mean the all explanations are BS. Certainly debatable.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 01 May 18, at 20:18.

  8. #203
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    I am not they lack some ability to give insight but that they are not science in the strict sense.

  9. #204
    Senior Contributor Red Team's Avatar
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    MGTOW community, and others like it, is highly vulnerable to confirmation bias and a flawed use of anecdotes as evidence. Their theories are a great example of the contrasts in old theory psychology (think Freud) to mainstream psychology, which has largely focused on observable data like behavior analysis and cognitive assessment. Trying to generalize the individual motivations of humans as a whole, never mind women, is a fool's errand because like Ironduke said--there's too much variability when you consider influencing factors like wealth, culture, experience etc.

    What we can generalize is that human behaviors are not random, they are tied to some sort of function--whether that is survival, acquisition of wealth, or completion of a personal goal. When we look at psychology from this perspective, trying to define and influence individual motivations becomes irrelevant---the focus is now to reinforce behaviors that are objectively healthy and functional, and fade out ones that are dysfunctional.

    Unfortunately, we see these principles also used as a method of emotional abuse by both men and women to control and manipulate their partners---especially in communities like MGTOW. In my view, all of the theories they peddle aren't for the purpose of informing others, they are there to project a sense of legitimacy to these people which they use to justify treating their "marks" like they are objects to be manipulated.
    "Draft beer, not people."

  10. #205
    Senior Contributor Versus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    You said all that before Versus and it is still BS as is Solipsism. You cannot prove a theory correct - that is why it remains a 'theory'. Solipsism, which basically says all I can ever know is something that I call "I" thinks. Everybody and everything else might be an illusion. So what logical meaning does the "you" or "they" have? A solipsist must argue that have none and are as it were 'illusions' which means most logic must be nonsense too and if that is the case the reasoning for solipsism must be unsafe in itself.
    It is genetically induced coping mechanism for abuse. For ages, women were taken as a war prizes and therefore they developed this ability to cope with the abuse and stress. Any psychologist or psychiatrist will tell you that disassociation is one of the most common defense mechanisms in the victims of abuse.
    One little remark about "Slavic masculinity" where did it lead us? To be a bi..ch to any empire that conquered us, regardless if it comes from the East or West. Our chad-lovin culture always seem a bit homosexual to me. The whole Serbian nationalism is a bro love chad worshiping cult that brought us to extinction. Serbia is one big high school where chads bully nerds whom than go to the West and design weapons that are than used against Serbian chads whom go and bully others. I mean, our engeneers were included in tomahawk navigation system design and also were included in F-14 cockpit design. The very weapons used in 1999 against Chad army. Its just insane. The Putin cult is self explanatory.
    Last edited by Versus; 01 May 18, at 21:05.

  11. #206
    Senior Contributor Versus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Team View Post
    MGTOW community, and others like it, is highly vulnerable to confirmation bias and a flawed use of anecdotes as evidence. Their theories are a great example of the contrasts in old theory psychology (think Freud) to mainstream psychology, which has largely focused on observable data like behavior analysis and cognitive assessment. Trying to generalize the individual motivations of humans as a whole, never mind women, is a fool's errand because like Ironduke said--there's too much variability when you consider influencing factors like wealth, culture, experience etc.

    What we can generalize is that human behaviors are not random, they are tied to some sort of function--whether that is survival, acquisition of wealth, or completion of a personal goal. When we look at psychology from this perspective, trying to define and influence individual motivations becomes irrelevant---the focus is now to reinforce behaviors that are objectively healthy and functional, and fade out ones that are dysfunctional.

    Unfortunately, we see these principles also used as a method of emotional abuse by both men and women to control and manipulate their partners---especially in communities like MGTOW. In my view, all of the theories they peddle aren't for the purpose of informing others, they are there to project a sense of legitimacy to these people which they use to justify treating their "marks" like they are objects to be manipulated.
    Do you really believe that left leaning liberal lovin narrative would allow realistic assessment of human behaviour? So incels are bad but fat acceptance is empowerment. It is harsh and it is real.

  12. #207
    Senior Contributor Red Team's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Versus View Post
    Do you really believe that left leaning liberal lovin narrative would allow realistic assessment of human behaviour? So incels are bad but fat acceptance is empowerment. It is harsh and it is real.
    I think any objective assessment of anything would be wise to avoid political entanglements lol

    I too agree that Fat acceptance (HAES) is toxic, but I don't conflate it with the Body Positivity movement, which some try to. That said, HAES has every right to believe its beliefs, it's when they force them on others is where it becomes toxic.

    In the words of the great Ron Swanson:
    The whole point of this country is if you wanna eat garbage, balloon up to 600 pounds and die of a heart attack at 43, you can!
    Last edited by Red Team; 01 May 18, at 21:07.
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  13. #208
    Senior Contributor GVChamp's Avatar
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    Oh, left movements are really bad on realistic assessments of human behavior. That's obvious, and it's what you get when you wed yourself to blank-slatism. I've been to other left-leaning forums where people get REALLY offended by even basic things like "women are not as strong as men" and "women are not capable of competing with the world's strongest men without ridiculous biological alterations."

    Red Pill and Red Pill-adjacent communities have a serious confirmation bias problem. Solipsism is an example, because it's not like men are somehow immune to this. Also, the kinds of guys who populate the Red Pill are HIGHLY emotional. They might approach a novel problem with their logic, but if something trips their emotional wires, they completely short-circuit in the same way they accuse women of doing. They are also heavily invested in bunk theories like Myers-Brigg personality testing, and Alpha-Beta dynamics that don't map really well onto human behavior.

    They aren't engaged in social science, it's just a pop pseudo-science movement. However, I see this all the time in economics from practically EVERYONE, so it's really hard to fault MGTOW. Also, EVERYONE has an opinion about dating and gender relations, and they are usually more wrong on fundamentals than the MGTOW. The whole reason there is a Red Pill and MGTOW community is because consensus dating advice is complete garbage and people are just fumbling around for an answer.

    Like I don't know how this maps on to gender relations at all:

    One little remark about "Slavic masculinity" where did it lead us? To be a bi..ch to any empire that conquered us, regardless if it comes from the East or West. Our chad-lovin culture always seem a bit homosexual to me. The whole Serbian nationalism is a bro love chad worshiping cult that brought us to extinction.
    I would not describe the Serbs as docile in any way. I don't know how you can describe ANY Balkan nation like that.
    Last edited by GVChamp; 01 May 18, at 21:18.
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  14. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Versus View Post
    It is genetically induced coping mechanism for abuse. For ages, women were taken as a war prizes and therefore they developed this ability to cope with the abuse and stress. Any psychologist or psychiatrist will tell you that disassociation is one of the most common defense mechanisms in the victims of abuse.
    More warble...We are denying the scientific authenticity of psychology and psychiatry so tell me what someone who professes to an expert in either of these pseudo sciences may say is irrelevant. If Vulcan as a planet does not exist what someone who professes to come from there says means nothing. "Then the unicorn said..." has meaning but does not make unicorns real. Nor do see it in any way related to solipsism.

  15. #210
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    I am not they lack some ability to give insight but that they are not science in the strict sense.
    Assumes people are deterministic or simplifies them to a point that they are to create a conceptual model ?

    I've been drawn to these subjects because of the ability of studied panelists explaining various inexplicable and troubling incidents in a comprehensible manner
    Last edited by Double Edge; 01 May 18, at 21:20.

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