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Thread: Hungarian Election

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    Hungarian Election


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    OSCE report on yesterdays Hungarian election; https://www.osce.org/odihr/elections...?download=true (not exactly glowing).

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    if Hungary wants to live in a dictatorship so bad...don't see why the EU has to help them out.

    EU is so badly broken that it continues to funnel money to someone who wants to wreck it from the inside. amazing.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    The only good thing about Orban is that he's not Jobbik. Sort of like choosing between amputing a foot, or everything below the knee.

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    there was previous discussion about expelling places like Hungary and Poland from the EU. for Hungary, at least, these discussions should be elevated with threat to end funding if Orban continues implementation of his authoritarian policies.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    I am no fan of Orban - nor as it turns out the current Polish Government policy (though I have friends in PiS and the Polish Civil Service). I do not think throwing Orban out or cutting him off would work though - it might with Poland. There is a difference between the two - Orban is partly in hock to Moscow since the Paks ll deal but for any Polish politician to even be seen to playing footsie with Moscow would be political suicide. Thus the EU has more leverage on Poland but if it takes action against Hungary it risks driving them into the enemy camp.

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    Realistically the post-Brexit budget will be a convenient crackdown on Poland and Hungary.

    For "their" opinion on that: https://www.pism.pl/publications/bulletin/no-23-1094

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    Thus the EU has more leverage on Poland but if it takes action against Hungary it risks driving them into the enemy camp.
    thus the threat first.

    as for enemy camp-- Orban's main goal is to eat the EU from within and TURN more countries into his "illiberal democratic" vision; as far as i'm concerned he's just about part of the enemy camp already.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    "as far as i'm concerned he's just about part of the enemy camp already."

    Orban is no friend of Europe I agree. I am not a fan of the EU as it is currently but in favour of European unity against common problems from global warming to gas supply and sharing. Orban is an enemy of any European unity.

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    If we're going to start calling NATO members "enemy nations," I really don't see the point in the alliance.
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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    Quote Originally Posted by GVChamp View Post
    If we're going to start calling NATO members "enemy nations," I really don't see the point in the alliance.
    Not NATO. The EU.

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    If we're going to start calling NATO members "enemy nations," I really don't see the point in the alliance.
    hey, Turkey's been even worse if anything.

    there needs to be consequences to these type of actions. Hungary is worse in a way because at least Erdogan just gives a shit about Erdogan, while Orban wants to spread a new system altogether.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Not NATO. The EU.
    Astralis is American, though. The specifics of the EU politics aren't really our problem, and interference (like Obama lecturing the UK on BREXIT) is not needed. We just want minimum buy-in for certain values and institutions like the UN, IMF, Basel capital standards, WTO, stuff like that. I think the cohesion fund is stupid and practically everyone thinks the Euro is stupid (except the Europeans themselves).

    hey, Turkey's been even worse if anything.

    there needs to be consequences to these type of actions. Hungary is worse in a way because at least Erdogan just gives a shit about Erdogan, while Orban wants to spread a new system altogether.
    I don't really see Turkey and Hungary being in the same league. Hungary is still listed as a "Free Nation" by Freedom House. Turkey is listed as an authoritarian state on par with Iraq. Their attitude towards the press is not great, but who cares?
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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    Quote Originally Posted by GVChamp View Post
    If we're going to start calling NATO members "enemy nations," I really don't see the point in the alliance.
    So, you're coming around to the (Western) European view of it?

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    Europe still needs the US if nothing else than a source of munitions. Europe has not stockpiled enough bombs for their own use.

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