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Thread: Tillerson fired

  1. #1
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    Tillerson fired

    It's just breaking that Tillerson has been fired, and is being replaced by CIA Director Mike Pompeo.

    President Donald Trump said Tuesday he is replacing Rex Tillerson as secretary of state, nominating CIA Director Mike Pompeo in his place.

    "Mike Pompeo, Director of the CIA, will become our new Secretary of State. He will do a fantastic job!" Trump tweeted Tuesday. "Thank you to Rex Tillerson for his service! Gina Haspel will become the new Director of the CIA, and the first woman so chosen. Congratulations to all!

    Pompeo's favored status in the West Wing for months led administration officials to view him as Tillerson's likely replacement. Haspel, who Trump said would replace Pompeo, became deputy director of the CIA last year.
    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...f-state-458353
    Last edited by Ironduke; 13 Mar 18, at 14:09.

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    apparently Tillerson found out in realtime via Tweet.

    this penchant of Trump for publicly humiliating his own people will come back to bite him.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    Good riddance, State has been withering on the vine under Tillerson. American soft power and diplomacy are vitally important policy tools and their neglect has put our military personnel at substantially higher risk as a result.

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    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    Speaking to reporters at the White House, Trump said he respected Tillerson's "intellect" and said he "got along well with Rex."

    "I think Rex will be much happier now," Trump said.

    Tillerson did not speak to Trump and is unaware of the reason behind his firing, Undersecretary for Public Diplomacy Steve Goldstein said.

    Trump "thought it was the right time for the transition with the upcoming North Korea talks and various trade negotiations," a senior administration official said, adding that Trump asked Tillerson to step aside on Friday.

    Asked how Tillerson learned of his dismissal, Trump said Tuesday that "Rex and I have been talking about this a long time." He specifically mentioned the Iran nuclear deal as an example of disagreement.

    "We were not really thinking the same," Trump said. "With Mike Pompeo, we have a similar thought process."

    Trump has wanted Pompeo as his secretary of state for months now, and the White House began planning for him to take the job last fall, sources told CNN. Trump told reporters Tuesday that he and Pompeo are "on the same wavelength" and "the relationship has always been very good and that is what I need."

    Trump's anger at Tillerson after it leaked last year that his secretary of state called him "a moron" never subsided, and many in the White House saw their differences as irreconcilable.

    Tillerson had few, if any, allies in the West Wing. Though chief of staff John Kelly was initially on his side when he took over, he eventually grew weary of defending him -- especially after the "moron" remark, which Kelly saw as insubordination on Tillerson's part.

    Sources close to the President say it was clear Tillerson didn't support Trump. They say Tillerson wanted to handle foreign policy his own way, without the President. Trump didn't feel that Tillerson backed him, a source told CNN.
    https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/13/polit...ate/index.html

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    I wonder if Tillerson's public announcement of support for the UK position against the Russian poisoning had anything to do with it.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    FP's been going on about a possible Rex departure for some time now. End of summer became by xmas, then early in the new year.

    But they never spoke of a firing more like Rex quitting.

    Didn't take it seriously as Rex seemed to do a good job. Though the frequent tweets undermining him made you think otherwise.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 13 Mar 18, at 16:06.

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    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    Good riddance, State has been withering on the vine under Tillerson. American soft power and diplomacy are vitally important policy tools and their neglect has put our military personnel at substantially higher risk as a result.
    Think so ? Pompeo strikes me as the guy in the cabinet with the loudest voice. The contrast between him and Matis is stark, matis is the exact opposite. Talks softly etc etc

    Is that who you want at state

    Rex was a business type.

    No idea why posts at state remained unfilled. People seem to attribute that to Trump more than anything. He doesn't like these so called experts remember. Those that allowed China to become a contender with US assistance by advising presidents earlier that china would change etc etc
    Last edited by Double Edge; 13 Mar 18, at 16:09.

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    Didn't take it seriously as Rex seemed to do a good job.
    i don't think ANYONE thought Rex was doing a good job. he had no influence within the Administration and his one pet project, "streamlining" the State Dept, was a complete botch-job.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Then its a wonder he lasted this long. Maybe Trump being polite. Let him finish the year.

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    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Rex was a business type.
    The Secretary of State focuses outwards on diplomacy and projecting American influence to achieve policy goals while relying on senior staff to actually run the internal workings of the Dept. of State.

    Instead of wheeling and dealing with foreign governments and keeping a lid on things around the world, Rex was more interested in playing games with the internal department structure than doing his actual job. As a result a huge swath of senior diplomats departed along with a sizable chunk of the up and comers that represent the next generation of the US Foreign Service.

    He's single-handedly caused damage to State that will take at least a decade to fix.

    A big military stick is most useful when diplomats can get what they want by waving it around and dangling carrots without ever having to actually swing it.

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    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    apparently Tillerson found out in realtime via Tweet.

    this penchant of Trump for publicly humiliating his own people will come back to bite him.
    Going back in time, far back in time, you would find that Trump never fired someone face to face. Usually sent a aide to do the job when he did hotel construction in New York. There were times where the fired person then came by to see Trump, himself, and got hired back afterwards. For a guy who desires to be well liked by everybody he is not a fan of direct confrontation at all. He'll talk about firing someone, he'll joke about firing someone, but he can't pull the trigger personally. The Apprentice show was just that a show.

  12. #12
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    The Secretary of State focuses outwards on diplomacy and projecting American influence to achieve policy goals while relying on senior staff to actually run the internal workings of the Dept. of State.

    Instead of wheeling and dealing with foreign governments and keeping a lid on things around the world, Rex was more interested in playing games with the internal department structure than doing his actual job. As a result a huge swath of senior diplomats departed along with a sizable chunk of the up and comers that represent the next generation of the US Foreign Service.

    He's single-handedly caused damage to State that will take at least a decade to fix.

    A big military stick is most useful when diplomats can get what they want by waving it around and dangling carrots without ever having to actually swing it.
    Can you help me understand the bolded bit better. I don't go into these internal details much. Rather look at the way he interacts with the rest of the world. How did he come across.

    New administration only a year in, I don't expect miracles.

    You don't think Trump shares any responsibility for state positions going unfilled ?
    Last edited by Double Edge; 13 Mar 18, at 17:01.

  13. #13
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    Mattis back in February:

    If you don't fund the State Department fully, then I need to buy more ammunition ultimately. So I think it's a cost benefit ratio. The more that we put into the state department's diplomacy, hopefully the less we have to put into a military budget if we deal with the outcome of an apparent American withdrawal from the international scene.

    https://www.c-span.org/video/?c46588...tis-ammunition

    The open letter from a year ago from 120 retired generals and admirals to the US Congress:

    Dear Speaker Ryan, Minority Leader Pelosi, Majority Leader McConnell, and Minority Leader Schumer:

    As you and your colleagues address the federal budget for Fiscal Year 2018, we write as retired three and four star flag and general officers from all branches of the armed services to share our strong conviction that elevating and strengthening diplomacy and development alongside defense are critical to keeping America safe.

    We know from our service in uniform that many of the crises our nation faces do not have military solutions alone from confronting violent extremist groups like ISIS in the Middle East and North Africa to preventing pandemics like Ebola and stabilizing weak and fragile states that can lead to greater instability. There are 65 million displaced people today, the most since World War II, with consequences including refugee flows that are threatening America’s strategic allies in Israel, Jordan, Turkey, and Europe.

    The State Department, USAID, Millennium Challenge Corporation, Peace Corps and other development agencies are critical to preventing conflict and reducing the need to put our men and women in uniform in harm’s way. As Secretary James Mattis said while Commander of U.S. Central Command, “If you don’t fully fund the State Department, then I need to buy more ammunition.” The military will lead the fight against terrorism on the battlefield, but it needs strong civilian partners in the battle against the drivers of extremism lack of opportunity, insecurity, injustice, and hopelessness.

    We recognize that America’s strategic investments in diplomacy and development like all of U.S. investments must be effective and accountable. Significant reforms have been undertaken since 9/11, many of which have been embodied in recent legislation in Congress with strong bipartisan support on human trafficking, the rights of women and girls, trade and energy in Africa, wildlife trafficking, water, food security, and transparency and accountability.

    We urge you to ensure that resources for the International Affairs Budget keep pace with the growing global threats and opportunities we face. Now is not the time to retreat.

    cc: Secretary of State Rex Tillerson
    cc: Secretary of Defense James Mattis
    cc: National Security Advisor H.R. McMaster
    http://www.usglc.org/downloads/2017/...use_Senate.pdf

  14. #14
    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Can you help me understand the bolded bit better. I don't go into these internal details much. Rather look at the way he interacts with the rest of the world. How did he come across.

    New administration only a year in, I don't expect miracles.

    You don't think Trump shares any responsibility for state positions going unfilled ?
    Give this article from last November a look. It makes it abundantly clear the level of damage Tillerson did to the State Dept.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/24/u...tillerson.html

    • Mass firings
    • Total disinterest in briefings
    • Hiring freezes
    • Huge budget cuts
    • Very toxic working environment


    His performance was so worrisome it drew letters of warning from both sides of the isle in congress as well as collections of generals including Mattis.

    The guy did terrible damage at a time when the world order is being redefined and the US can't afford to just coast along.
    Last edited by SteveDaPirate; 13 Mar 18, at 17:16.

  15. #15
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    ‘Strong sense of relief’: State Department staffers react to Tillerson’s ouster

    State Department employees had one main reaction to Rex Tillerson’s ouster as secretary of state on Tuesday: “Good riddance.”

    President Donald Trump’s decision to fire the top U.S. diplomat sent a wave of hope through a department battered by low morale under Tillerson, who dismissed the expertise of career diplomats and sought to downsize the department.

    “There is strong sense of relief at State. The last year has been traumatic to put it mildly. It was as though ‘T-Rex’ stomped through Foggy Bottom devouring staff and structures,” said Brett Bruen, a former State Department official.

    Several current State officials said they also hope to bid farewell to Tillerson’s top aides, including chief of staff Margaret Peterlin and policy chief Brian Hook, whom they criticize for forming a protective and secretive clique around the secretary during his nearly 14-month tenure.

    “People see this as a chance for a clean sweep,” said one staffer, who like most others spoke on condition of anonymity to avoid losing his job. “This team has proven itself incapable of managing the State Department.”

    Multiple Foreign and Civil Service officers struck an optimistic note about Tillerson’s chosen replacement, CIA Director Mike Pompeo. Many hope that Pompeo’s close relationship with Trump will mean that the State Department will gain more influence with a president who has often sidelined it.

    But some sounded more wary, saying that Pompeo has a hawkish reputation and little diplomatic experience.

    One recently departed State Department official noted that Pompeo had a reputation in some quarters of the CIA as a political partisan, warning: “If people at State disliked Tillerson, they might downright hate Pompeo.”
    https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...eaction-459535

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