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  • CIA: China is waging a 'quiet kind of cold war' against US
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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    • Originally posted by Ironduke View Post
      For electronics goods, China, primarily. I'm sure there's thousands or tens of thousands of individuals all doing it. There's also Americans who either wittingly or unwittingly import counterfeit electronic goods and re-sell them. Even brick and mortar stores are getting duped, as well as the Department of Defense.

      Counterfeit electronics are also a plague on Amazon as well.
      I knew it. I just wanted to hear it from an American. Thank you.
      Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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      • Originally posted by Oracle View Post
        DOR,
        The problem as I see right now is more to do with some Americans (?) who support Chinese marauding, IPR theft, fanbo'ism, basically defence of everything Chinese. You are biased when you so ardently speak of Russian interference in US elections, but remain blind to Chinese interferences the world over with their economic clout. The way I see it, you are trying to pass off as a CCP mouthpiece and losing out on whatever reputation you have left here. Don't ever, for a moment think I don't understand trade wars or little bit of economics. I am putting you in my ignore list. Have a good day if you can.
        I’ve never met, nor even heard of “Americans (?) who support Chinese maurading, IPR theft, fan’boism [whatever that is].” Please cite sources, and stop the sly insults. It is beneath the standards of WAB.

        There is a world of difference between the unprecidented (as far as we know) interference in the US 2016 election and its aftermath, and China being the fourth or fifth Asian economy to rip off US IPR. To equate the two is to diminish the historic severity of what the Putin-Trump Alliance has achieved. To suggest that these companies were caught flat-footed is to reveal a deep ignorance about Western business interaction with China.

        Neutralizing US global respect, commitment to allies, support for international regulatory institutions and domestic confidence cannot, by any stretch of the imagination, be on the same level as 35 years of China doing what other North-East Asian economies did for over 50 years.

        Accusing me of being a CCP mouthpiece because you only understand economics a little bit is well below par for Wabbit behavior. Accusing me of trolling because you don’t know China as well as I do is inappropriate.

        I appreciate differences of opinion, but when it comes to doing business in Asia, and the economics of the region, I don’t find much in the way of excellent knowledge and long experience on this board. At least have the grace to acknowledge that this is my entire career’s experience you’re dismissing off-hand and without shred of valid counter point.
        Trust me?
        I'm an economist!

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        • What I meant to say was, . . .
          There is a world of difference between the unprecidented (as far as we know) interference in the US 2016 election and its aftermath, and China being the fourth or fifth Asian economy to rip off US IPR. To equate the two is to diminish the historic severity of what the Putin-Trump Alliance has achieved. To suggest that these companies were caught flat-footed is to reveal a deep ignorance about Western business interaction with China.

          Oh, that IS what I said.
          Trust me?
          I'm an economist!

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          • Originally posted by hboGYT View Post
            Haha no. China is still decidedly a middle income economy. The earlier China opens up, the more likely it is to get stuck there.
            World Bank says otherwise.

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            Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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            • Originally posted by DOR View Post
              What I meant to say was, . . .
              There is a world of difference between the unprecidented (as far as we know) interference in the US 2016 election and its aftermath, and China being the fourth or fifth Asian economy to rip off US IPR. To equate the two is to diminish the historic severity of what the Putin-Trump Alliance has achieved. To suggest that these companies were caught flat-footed is to reveal a deep ignorance about Western business interaction with China.

              Oh, that IS what I said.
              None of your posts are upto the point, why? Never ever talked directly to the point? I didn't ask you which Asian economies ripped off US IPR before China, I was talking about China. You bring in a lot of bullshit together, just to confuse posters. Why do you always try to take the flow of the thread away from China to Taiwan, Skorea, Japan? You do that everytime, why? You think I am a newbie here to fall for your deflection?

              You are all against Russia and Trump, but when it comes to China you're the first line of defense here at WAB. Then you squirm and shout that you're an economist, and that this is your life's work, and you ought to be repected - well the bad news is I have never heard of you before (and I know quite a few economists), and the worst news is it doesn't matter. Why didn't you quote Astralis when he commented on China's wholesale technology theft? You think people are stupid in here? Take your jabberwocky somewhere where you think you'd be noticed or given respect. In here, people don't beg for respect again and again, they earn it. And if you think I don't understand the nature and direction of your posts, I very well know.

              So, PLEASE STOP QUOTING ME. I am done with you.
              Last edited by Oracle; 22 Jul 18,, 16:56.
              Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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              • DOR, I think your posts are definitely coming off as "China pressuring companies for IPR is no big deal." This is not the opinion of policy-makers of any nation and it definitely is against global trade rules. Other nations may have done it in the past, but that doesn't mean we have to put up with China doing it. Other nations sanctioning China for their behavior is totally within the realm of reasonability. And, yes, Trump is going about it in a stupid way were that his goal, but that's a different point.

                Yeah, Russian interference in the election is worse. It cuts right at the heart of what we are as a nation. We can always choose not to trade with China.
                Last edited by GVChamp; 24 Jul 18,, 16:10.
                "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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                • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
                  DOR, I think your posts are definitely coming off as "China pressuring companies for IPR is no big deal." This is not the opinion of policy-makers of any nation and it definitely is against global trade rules. Other nations may have done it in the past, but that doesn't mean we have to put up with China doing it. Other nations sanctioning China for their behavior is totally within the realm of reasonability. And, yes, Trump is going about it in a stupid way were that his goal, but that's a different point.

                  Yeah, Russian interference in the election is worse. It cuts right at the heart of what we are as a nation. We can always choose not to trade with China.
                  You're right; that's how it sounds, because that's what I'm saying.
                  That's what I'm saying in the context of (a) today's US political environment; (b) the Putin-Trump Axis of Evil; and the past 50+ years of East Asian behavior.
                  China's IPR theft, in that context, is no big deal.
                  Somebody's been doing it for decades.

                  That "is not the opinion of policy-makers of any nation and it definitely is against global trade rules."
                  Who could argue with that? Policy-makers are seeking to shift attention away from the PTAEvil, so it's time to China bash. And, just as the US takes China to the WTO -- and wins -- so, too, does China take the US to the WTO (and, win).
                  The system works, at least until The Trumpet tosses his toys out of the pram.

                  "Other nations may have done it in the past, but that doesn't mean we have to put up with China doing it."
                  Hang on a second. US business has been extremely lackadaisical about proactively protecting its IPR, and has been throughout my career. That really shouldn't be a question; it's a simple fact of history.
                  Uncle Sam can be relied on to come crack the whip when the thieves' home markets become interesting enough to warrant serious investment, or at least that was the case up until China.
                  All of a sudden, the old strategy of milking production facilities abroad for the price of some obsolete IPR, until Uncle Sam is needed, suddenly that strategy doesn't work anymore. Note that there is no -- NO -- serious effort to protect IPR outside of Silicon Valley.

                  "...sanctioning China for their behavior is totally within the realm of reasonability. And, yes, Trump is going about it in a stupid way were that his goal, but that's a different point."
                  No argument about sanctions, and certainly none about The Trumpet's competence.

                  But, back to the main issue. In the context of (a), (b) and (c), how should we read the trade war?
                  Destructive distraction that decimates US competitiveness and standards of living sounds about right to me.
                  In this context.

                  But, I'm just a fellow-traveling, commie loving, 10 fen stooge, so what do I know?
                  Trust me?
                  I'm an economist!

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                  • Trump wants $12 billion in aid to U.S. farmers suffering from trade war

                    WASHINGTON/KANSAS CITY, Mo. (Reuters) - The Trump administration on Tuesday said it will use a Great Depression-era program to pay up to $12 billion to help U.S. farmers weather a growing trade war with China, the European Union and others that the president began.
                    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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                    • I want all those farmers to be drug tested before they get any money!
                      “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                      Mark Twain

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                      • i mean they voted for the guy who was LOUDLY PROMISING tariffs so yeah, some drug testing is probably in order...lol.
                        There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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                        • Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                          I want all those farmers to be drug tested before they get any money!
                          Bring back the LIKE button!
                          Trust me?
                          I'm an economist!

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                          • Facebook's China venture fails as record of approval for innovation hub vanishes
                            Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

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                            • Originally posted by astralis View Post
                              i mean they voted for the guy who was LOUDLY PROMISING tariffs so yeah, some drug testing is probably in order...lol.
                              They are also getting government support, too. Which they probably would expect, because....you know....farmers. Iowa. Etc.
                              "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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