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Thread: Stone pelting a conspiracy by Pakistan and its agents in Kashmir

  1. #916
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    it is possible to be in the NRC as well as the ineligible list at the same time o_O

    “It has come to the knowledge of the undersigned that after the publication of final NRC on 31st August 2019, few names of ineligible persons are found present in the final NRC…”
    Since the publication of the final NRC, which excluded 19 lakh people, the BJP government and Assam Public Works (APW), the original petitioner of the NRC are both unhappy with the list.

    They feel it is an “incorrect” list, and demand a re-verification of the exercise.

    On Tuesday, APW moved the Supreme Court again demanding a hundred per cent reverification alleging that the final NRC had almost “eighty lakh foreigners” including “jehadis.”

    While Sarma was unavailable for comment, he had, in an earlier Facebook post from February 2019, stated there are “lakhs and lakhs of Bangladeshis in the NRC”.
    Wait....what ?? You have got to be shitting me !!!

    Assam: Official NRC memo seeks details of ‘ineligible persons’ in final list | IE | Feb 21 2020

    Given the screw ups that have occurred just in Assam in this pilot exercise, one wonders what surprises await us when NRC is scaled up to the national level !!!
    Last edited by Double Edge; 21 Feb 20, at 16:41.

  2. #917
    Military Professional 667medic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    I don't understand why these college girls are being detained. What exactly is the charge here ? threat to public safety & order ?

    There is no charge, she has been detained. Not arrested.

    The cops suspect these girls (notice how its always girls and not boys) are being encouraged to do so by people inimical to the state.

    Who has put them up to it.

    Thing is at their age, this is just mischief and even fun to defy the state. Harmless fun.

    Amulya seems a smart girl for just 19 going by her social media profile. Very spirited.
    Problem is that these lone loons are fodder for foreign PR machinery. Amulya already finds mention in Dawn and it is being portrayed that Hindus are themselves rebelling against BJP, which I honestly think is more the exception and not the norm. Just see how Imran Khan keeps comparing Modi to Hitler, the sustained campaign looks eerily similar to a similar campaign launched in USA that eventually got Modi banned from getting a US visa.
    Seek Save Serve Medic

  3. #918
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 667medic View Post
    Problem is that these lone loons are fodder for foreign PR machinery. Amulya already finds mention in Dawn and it is being portrayed that Hindus are themselves rebelling against BJP, which I honestly think is more the exception and not the norm.
    Amulya isn't a hindu, she's a Catholic.

    Watch the ANI video, you see a kid being bundled off the stage by a bunch of cops. How many do you need to handle a 19 yr old. She is literally surrounded.

    So the image is look at how aggressive this state is.

    They should have asked for the mic and then ejected her without any cops getting involved. She wasn't a threat to anyone there.

    No charges should have been filed unless the protest organisers brought them since they really are the aggrieved party here.

    But the news networks jumped on it and gave it unnecessary publicity.

    Her parents house in the country got attacked by Bajrangi goons and her father had to apologise to the country.

    These are self goals for what ? two word slogan


    Just see how Imran Khan keeps comparing Modi to Hitler, the sustained campaign looks eerily similar to a similar campaign launched in USA that eventually got Modi banned from getting a US visa.
    It was not launched in the US. Blair did it in 2004, after that the EU followed, then the US & Canada thereafter.

    When the Supreme court could not find anything on Modi in 2012, Cameron removed the ban and the rest followed.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 21 Feb 20, at 20:08.

  4. #919
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Assam rejected the NRC back in November and made a plea to the Supreme court which has rejected the pleas of both the Center as well as the Assam govt.

    Assam rejects NRC, Amit Shah says will do it afresh across nation | IE | Nov 21 2020

    The compromise is

    Sarma made the announcement at a press conference in Guwahati soon after Union Home Minister Amit Shah told Rajya Sabha that whenever the NRC exercise is extended to the whole country, it will have to be repeated in Assam.
    In other words the present NRC of Assam is null and void.

    “The NRC exercise in Assam was undertaken as per an order of the Supreme Court and as per a separate Act. When the NRC exercise is replicated across the country, it will naturally have to be repeated in Assam. I want to make it clear again that people, whichever religion they belong to, should not feel scared. Everybody will be included in NRC. As for the gazette notification that the member referred to, it is applicable across the country,” Shah said.
    Then what is the problem with the NRC conducted in Assam ? wasn't everybody included or maybe that is the problem

  5. #920
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    US senators letter to Pompeo and they want answers to specific questions about J&K, NRC & CAA protests, within 30 days

    Spoiler!


    CAA has corollary in US’ Lautenberg Amendment | ET | Jan 18 2020
    Last edited by Double Edge; 22 Feb 20, at 18:37.

  6. #921
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    I'm gonna marry her!
    Or, maybe date her!
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  7. #922
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  8. #923
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    BJP guy leads a pro CAA protest against the Jaffrabad metro sit in. He then gives the cops an ultimatum to clear them off within 3 days or he will do it himself. He does not want a second Shaheen Bagh crap in Jaffrabad. Who can blame him.

    Things go downhill from there. The Delhi BJP unit has distanced themselves from Kapil Mishra.



    I suddenly appreciate the value of declaring 144 in Bangalore on day 1 of the anti-CAA protests. We've seen none of this nonsense.

    There are plenty of parks to go protest but the idea here is to disrupt and choke things.

    They purposely send their women there so if any thing happens then they go on a rampage.

    Opposition is claiming all sorts of things. Amit Shah's devious plan to clear the place.

    I'm not seeing a communal angle here. Doesn't stop people calling it that.

    One group saying you're not starting your shit here and the other insisting

    What i'm seeing is an organised group ready to stir trouble.

    Who's funding them, where are they from. Out of work Kashmiri rabble rousers. Are they even Indian.

    You put up with the protest for how ever long or they trash your town

    Now choose

    There have been a few deaths. One of the head constables was shot

    The cops haven't done a whole lot either, no arrests or detentions yet. Not a peep out of the home minister either.

    Wait until Trump leaves town the bosses said.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 27 Feb 20, at 04:06.

  9. #924
    Military Professional 667medic's Avatar
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    This was a colossal screwup. They should have anticipated that rabble rousers will stir up trouble to take advantage of Trump’s visit. What supposedly exacerbated the issue is that Hindu mobs supposedly roamed around the whole night burning and trashing homes. The media houses have started harping in that and the foreign media has picked this up.
    Seek Save Serve Medic

  10. #925
    Military Professional 667medic's Avatar
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    Now they have realized that the best way to shut down an area is to get a bunch of ladies to act as human shield. I wont be surprised if the other side loses patience again and then we are going to see a repeat of the same riots...
    Seek Save Serve Medic

  11. #926
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Something from 2016.

    Two crore Bangladeshi immigrants illegally staying in India, Centre informs Rajya Sabha | TOI | Nov 17 2016

    Bharti Jain | Updated: Nov 17, 2016, 01:48 IST

    NEW DELHI: The government, citing inputs available with it, told the Rajya Sabha on Wednesday that there were around 2 crore Bangladeshi immigrants staying illegally in India.

    The rise in the number of illegal Bangaldeshi immigrants, which almost equals the size of the entire population of Australia, shows a rise of around 67% over the 1.2 crore estimate given out by the UPA government in 2004 but withdrawn soon after.

    “There are reports of Bangladeshi nationals having entered the country without valid travel documents. Since entry of such Bangladeshi nationals into the country is clandestine and surreptitious, it is not possible to have accurate data of such Bangladeshi nationals living in the various parts of the country. As per available inputs, there are around 20 million (2 crore) illegal Bangladeshi migrants staying in India,” Union minister of state for home Kiren Rijiju said in written reply to a question posed by Rajya Sabha MP Jharna Das Baidya.

    The 20 million estimate far surpasses the figure of 12 million cited by then minister of state for home Sriprakash Jaiswal in 2004 in the same House.

    Jaiswal had, in reply to a question dated July 15, 2004, said that 1,20,53,950 illegal Bangladeshi migrants were residing in 17 states and Union territories as on December 31, 2001. He also said Assam alone accounted for 50 lakh Bangladeshi squatters, while their number in West Bengal was estimated to be the highest at 57 lakh.

    The BJP, which was then the main opposition party, demanded that the 12 lakh illegal Bangladeshi immigrants be identified and deported. As a political storm brewed in states like Assam, Jaiswal withdrew his reply, dismissing the 12 million figure as one based on “unreliable reports” and “hearsay”.

    However, a Union minister on Wednesday said it was a conscious decision by Modi government to highlight the 20 million estimate of illegal Bangladeshi migrants residing in India. “Unlike UPA, we won’t be cowed down by pressure to deny the figure as 'hearsay',” said the minister.

    Incidentally, Rijiju’s reply does not dwell on a definite strategy of the government to identify and deport the 20 million illegal Bangladeshi migrants. “Deportation of illegally staying foreign nationals is continuous process. The powers of identification, detention and deportation of illegal foreign nationals including Bangladeshi nationals have been delegated to the state governments and Union territories under Section 3(2)(c) of the Foreigners Act, 1946,” he stated.

    BJP is in power in Assam, which with West Bengal shows the highest incidence of illegal immigration from Bangladesh. Chief minister Sarbananda Sonowal had, after coming to power in May this year, declared his intent to update the national register of citizens (NRC) in Assam and seal Indo-Bangladesh border in the state in two years.

    West Bengal, however, may be at odds with the Centre’s assessment of number of Bangladeshi immigrants staying illegally within its jurisdiction.
    This is why the Assam BJP head threw a fit.

    The question is how did these illegals manage to beat the NRC ?

  12. #927
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Something from 2016.

    Two crore Bangladeshi immigrants illegally staying in India, Centre informs Rajya Sabha | TOI | Nov 17 2016



    This is why the Assam BJP head threw a fit.

    The question is how did these illegals manage to beat the NRC ?
    Very easy actually.

    <haha> <adding to the suspense> <lol>
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  13. #928
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Very easy actually.

    <haha> <adding to the suspense> <lol>
    It means about 30 lakh odd out of 50 lakh previously estimated illegals managed to convince authorities they are legal

    How did they do that. An envelope under the table ?

    The final NRC list includes some 3.1 cr people out of a total population 3.3 cr. The remainder are those 19 lakhs

    So nearly all in Assam accounted for

    The part i have a doubt with is when the second draft was put out in Sept 2018. Is that when they completed the exercise or were more people still left to enroll ?

    Because at that point the list excluded around 40 lakh people. Sounds like the right ballpark figure for illegals.

    Then we get to 2019 and that 40 lakh is reduced to 19 lakh

    It looks like foreigners tribunals ended up including half of the previously excluded in the final list. If anything went wrong this is when it happened.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 27 Feb 20, at 23:52.

  14. #929
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    The govt will take it easy on notifying the CAA rules for now. It does not mean they will not come. It just means it will come after some time.

    Modi govt delays announcing CAA rules as it fears move could ‘add fuel to fire’ | The Print | Feb 24 2020

  15. #930
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Digging into NRC some more. Trying to understand what went wrong ?

    Unfortunately this article does not explain the how just the result & its after effects

    Assam wanted an end to its ethnic conflict. In the end, it got an NRC that nobody accepts | The Print | Sept 10 2019

    Nobody seems to be willing to accept the final NRC list. The outcome of a long-drawn exercise has merely revealed the problems.

    RUHI TEWARI 10 September, 2019

    The updated National Register of Citizens has propelled Assam into a vortex. The situation may seem calm on the surface, but it is replete with contradictions and dangerous undertones.

    The final NRC list, released on 31 August, excluded 19.07 lakh people – less than six per cent of the total applicants – which is less than half of the 40 lakh excluded in the draft list.

    Despite a meticulously planned exercise – exhaustive and exhausting in equal measure – this has turned out to be nobody’s NRC. It has also exposed its own inherent flaws, deepened the fault lines in the state, caused immeasurable chaos, and found absolutely no solution to Assam’s decades-long ethnic conflict. The only objective NRC has achieved is to further play to the gallery as far as the Assamese people’s fear of the ‘foreigner’ is concerned.

    Based on my recent visit to Assam, these are my findings on the NRC process and the challenges it faces.

    The inherent flaws
    The exercise to update the NRC was detailed and long-drawn (62,214 workers, Rs 1,100 crore and 100 TB data), requiring massive manpower, back-end support and logistical planning. The outcome, however, merely reveals the problems that have plagued the process.

    One of the most confounding aspects of this updated NRC is how it has split families – into those who are genuine Indian citizens and those suspected to be foreigners.

    Such cases are more a norm than an aberration, and can be found all over the state – mainly among religious and linguistic minorities like Muslims and Bengali Hindus. Despite submitting the same legacy data, fathers have made it to the list, but the children haven’t; some siblings are in and some aren’t.

    This is inexplicable. Authorities argue that such cases are because of technical errors in the documents or when family members have been unable to prove their linkages adequately. An explanation that is hardly enough considering this is precisely the anomaly the claims and objections process under NRC should have resolved – a process that was supposed to be clear and fool-proof.

    Second, the exercise has revealed how even a degree of subjectivity can be dangerous for something of this nature. In the NRC’s case, a lot rested with the disposing officer and her/his judgement, or in some cases, their biases. While there was a set of guidelines, ThePrint found people across villages felt the disposing officer’s ‘whim’ had put them at the receiving end.

    Third, the entire legacy document issue is in itself problematic, making women, transgenders and the homeless particularly vulnerable. For women, who change their names after marriage, proving linkages through their ancestors has been particularly challenging, given that they couldn’t claim citizenship based on their husband’s family tree.

    Fourth, the inability to verify documents at the back-end from where they were issued in time has meant many who had come from other states were excluded.

    Fifth, there are cases of declared ‘foreigners’, who were sent to detention centres, making it to the final NRC. This shows how flawed the system of determining citizenship can be, especially when the exercise should have been conducted decades ago.

    Sixth, because this was not an exercise of enumeration and put the onus of proving the citizenship on the people, there are many who never submitted their applications under the NRC and are thus out of this net.

    Nobody’s NRC
    Nobody seems to be willing to accept this outcome whole-heartedly. The All Assam Students Union (AASU), which spearheaded the 1979 Assam agitation, has rejected the NRC, calling the final figures of exclusion too low.

    The ruling Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) has also rejected it because it feels the final list has left out ‘genuine citizens’, that it excluded too many Hindus and included far more Muslims.

    The All Assam Minorities Students’ Union (AAMSU) and the Assam Public Works (APW) too have questioned the process and the outcome of NRC.

    Meanwhile, those who have been excluded – mainly Muslims and Bengali Hindus – obviously dismiss the NRC. Those who find their names in the list are not particularly grateful either, since they believe they anyway did not need to be told they were Indian citizens and feel there have been errors of inclusion and exclusion.

    Deepening fault lines
    What the NRC has indeed successfully done is – show how Assam has successfully passed on the legacy of fearing the ‘foreigner’, even to generations born much after the peak of the anti-outsider anger.

    “The bidexis (foreigners) need to be identified and sent back. We have suffered for generations. I heard this from my family and on TV when noise around the NRC began,” said 19-year-old Amita Baruah, a student of Gauhati University.

    To that effect, the NRC exercise has only amplified this sentiment and brought the ‘indigenous people versus outsider’ debate back in focus.

    It has also given a fresh impetus to the BJP’s plans to communalise this ethnic fault line. On the ground, this is now taking shape.

    “This is what we are now going to say on the ground to the people: ‘Look at the final list, it has so many Muslims. You have lived in Assam all your lives. Don’t you know these Muslims are infiltrators? They have all come from either East Pakistan or later, Bangladesh’,” said a powerful local leader of Nagaon, who did not wish to be identified.
    That bolded bit is true when i listen to those kids News X interviewed some months back.

    I don't know what the BJP has got but it looks like a mess.

    FIR filed against Assam official Prateek Hajela for tampering with final NRC list | India Today | Feb 13 2020

    NGO APW has filed a FIR against the person appointed by the state to conduct the exercise. They are accusing him of using his position to tamper with the data.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 28 Feb 20, at 02:02.

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