Page 10 of 66 FirstFirst 12345678910111213141516171819 ... LastLast
Results 136 to 150 of 984

Thread: Stone pelting a conspiracy by Pakistan and its agents in Kashmir

  1. #136
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Tronic View Post
    Only thing that tells me is how dangerous it is to be pro-India among an anti-India society.
    And why should that be the case. Is the state being outgunned. Does its writ not extend here. This should change. Otherwise the idea that India is the eternal enemy gets ingrained. And whose interests does that serve. Not ours.

    You're saying a couple million Kashmiris in an isolated remote valley discriminate against a billion Indians by not accepting Indian hegemony? I don't condone violence but rather than punish the terror tap next door, the government finds it much easier to clamp down on the freedoms of Kashmiris.
    Communal politics as practiced in Kashmir marginalises those in Jammu & Ladakh. 35A discriminates against every non-resident Indian. The clamping down on freedoms is the result of the wrong choices people over there continue to make. They have no choice as should they decide to go pro-India there will be consequences. That we have not been able to convince them we have their backs is our failing. We are doing that now. So I don't see this as hegemony rather the state taking charge of its ward instead of merely managing it like in the past.

    Because the Himachalis dont live in a perpetual state of war or under the threat of the gun.
    So reduce support and funds for people that encourage guns. Get at the eco system. If leaders do not acknowledge this threat then empower those that will.

    So Modi will scrap their elected leaders and make their choice for them and it still doesnt sound like a foreign occupation to you. "These people" will now be ruled by "your government".
    Hang on a minute. What elected leaders are you referring to ? their assembly has been dissolved. The PDP & BJP combine didn't work out. People said this at the beginning but that's not how the world works. The people chose these parties and it was up to them to carry out the people's wishes. Now the BJP could have tried to partner with the NC but that party lacks pragmatism. The govt was not scrapped, it was not sabotaged, every effort to make it work was made. It collapsed on its own. So presently there is no govt in J&K. It's under president's rule and remains so until elections are called.

    Assembly elections are due this year so the people will most certainly go out and elect their leaders with all the security the state can muster to have elections. Remember J&K as UT now still has an assembly.


    Isn't the Indian parliament filled with rapists, murderers and crooks anyhow? Indian politics is hardly an example of functional politics yet the Kashmiris are the ones who cant be trusted.. I say they are still much better than the scumbag politicians in UP, but I get it, the scumbags in UP are "our" scumbags.. These Kashmiris, not so much..
    No, those scumbags in UP aren't endangering national security.

    That question is redundant when the government decides to bypass all the Kashmiris, regardless if someone is separatist, pro-union or a commoner.
    It marked a change in policy. A change from the twenty years prior. Why were we even talking to people who actively supported secession. Providing them with security too. Because this was a solution foisted on us by Clinton in the 90s. Americans don't interfere in our domestic affairs to the extent any more.

    That's just a matter of perspective. From my perspective, the Indian government is useless because I see them as a Hindu government, by the Hindus for the Hindus; hence useless to the minorities. In the same manner, I can see why you'd think the same for the Kashmiri politicians as they consistently failed to seed the Indian narrative in the valley.
    When will this "hindu govt" bogey die ?

    The reason, ostensibly for partition was no muslim (or minority) could live with dignity under Hindu rule. Communal leaders at the time were Nehru & Gandhi. Then when Babri went down the same bogey reared itself, and here it is again.

    I've watched this govt since 2014 and they are bound and sworn to defend a secular constitution whether their fans like it or not, admit or not. People are wondering when this hindu govt plans to build a ram mandir and stop managing temple finances. This govt might not be pro minority but i cannot say it is anti minority either. Where are the major communal riots in the last five years. Doesn't the Kartapur initiative mean anything for you ?

    Our actions in Nepal to prevent a constitution there from disenfranchising the madhesis adds further confidence. You'd think relations with another state that is 98% hindu would be better but relations with Bangladesh, Maldives & Afghanistan are further ahead.

    I've seen the results in other muslim countries to create an islamic state and its been dismal. The so called IS no longer exists. The afghans had a short stint with the Taliban. Sharia rules in the tribal areas of Pakistan only. So given the results with the muslims i'm not holding my breath for a hindu rashtra any time soon. The biggest obstacle to such an idea is modernity.

    Ofcourse, can try all means; Kashmiris are powerless in front of the Indian juggernaut. Time will tell if this solves the issue but I guess we both know, phase 2 is probably Israeli styled Hindu settlements in the valley. Like I said, government by the Hindus for the Hindus. I will be surprised if that is not the case.
    We don't plan to do that and i can say right now it won't happen. Neither of us really knows but my answer is as equal as yours and will get stronger with time. I refuse to second guess outcomes. Why do people keep doing this. Everybody it seems can predict the future. I cannot. Let things develop, track them when they do and then we will assess the results.


    Most of that to me is rhetoric.

    We are different people, different religion, different ideology so naturally I am opposed to every communal move this government makes against minorities; be they ethnic minorities or religious minorities (in this case, both).

    That said, I get your support for them as you share your world view with those in power and I suppose nothing in this world is static. I feel for all those who will be negatively affected but time will tell how history unfolds.
    This govt is opposing the communal politics of J&K. The govts actions aren't against the people. Even Sujit Nair, no fan of this govt said that. The govts actions are pro minority. The Hindus, Buddhists & Shias in the state are the minority. For now its the political classes that are the most affected. And external forces that want to keep us in a perpetual state of conflict.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 06 Aug 19, at 13:54.

  2. #137
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    In one of his talks Ram Madhav was talking about a village called Turtuk

    Apparently during the '71 war, there was an Indian major who went west, captured a few villages, Turtuk, Tiakshi among them. Then the ceasefire was declared and the matter rested there. Neither India or Pakistan were aware these villages had become Indian over night

    Then in the 80s when India wanted to fence the border. The people in these villages found out they were now on the Indian side of the border. They referred to themselves as coming from Azad Hindustan. There is this family where the father draws a pension from the NLI in Pakistan and the son is in the Indian army.

    Name:  azad hind.jpg
Views: 64
Size:  7.6 KB

    He went on to mention that if anyone in Ladakh needed to interact with the govt and could not afford the air fare that it was a two day trip to Srinagar. In all his travels around the country he never knew of any place that required two days to reach the HQ. Not even in the NE. That gives an idea of how isolated Ladakh is from govt and how little it matters in Srinagar. Now Ladakh talks to the centre.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 06 Aug 19, at 13:09.

  3. #138
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jul 13
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    6,481
    'Only two families will lose their livelihood': Ladakh MP's speech in Lok Sabha wins PM Modi's praise

    Actually it's more than two. Hurriyat, then there are other agents of the mercenary Pakistan Army. Asiya Andrabi types. But, ofcourse well said. Some might say Buddhists are a majority in India, well......

    PoK, Aksai Chin integral part of J&K, can die for it: Amit Shah in Lok Sabha

    Shaksgam Valley! Shaksgam Valley! Shaksgam Valley!

    I was waiting for this day for decades. There is immense pride in what the BJP did yesterday.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  4. #139
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jul 13
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    6,481
    'We are fighting a racist ideology,' says PM Imran in NA address on Indian atrocities in Kashmir

    Says Im the Dim from terroristan.

    Prepared to go to any extent to fulfil our obligations to Kashmiri people: ISPR

    Come and get it, islamic jihadi marauders. Never won a single war in their history, and this big talk while peddling terrorism in the neighbourhood. Every single Pakistani who sets foot on Indian soil will be killed. Every darn single Pakistani. This is also a BIG F U to President Trump.

    Going out to buy a bottle of Jack and celebrate!!! It's not everyday that history is made. This will go down in the annals of Indian/Sub-Continental history in golden letters.
    Last edited by Oracle; 06 Aug 19, at 14:31.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  5. #140
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    'Only two families will lose their livelihood': Ladakh MP's speech in Lok Sabha wins PM Modi's praise

    Actually it's more than two. Hurriyat, then there are other agents of the mercenary Pakistan Army. Asiya Andrabi types. But, ofcourse well said. Some might say Buddhists are a majority in India, well......
    Even the LGBT community became full Indian citizens before this MP from Ladakh.

    Oh well better late than never : )

    I was waiting for this day for decades. There is immense pride in what the BJP did yesterday.
    Funny how the unthinkable becomes possible with this govt and in such a brazen manner

    Kalam told us to dream, this govt is big on show & tell.

    In 2014, i said Modi didn't even reach Indira's ankles.

    He's grown since. Some where between her knees and waist now.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 06 Aug 19, at 15:58.

  6. #141
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    PoK, Aksai Chin integral part of J&K, can die for it: Amit Shah in Lok Sabha

    Shaksgam Valley! Shaksgam Valley! Shaksgam Valley!

    I was waiting for this day for decades. There is immense pride in what the BJP did yesterday.
    The government on Monday revoked some provisions of the Article 370 to take away Jammu and Kashmir's special status, and proposed bifurcation of the state into two union territories, Jammu and Kashmir, and Ladakh, a bold and far- reaching decision that seeks to redraw the map and future of a region at the centre of a protracted militancy movement.
    Second time i see that word 'some' in there. We will find out what went and what remained in due course. But 370 isn't entirely gone

  7. #142
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    "What happened yesterday has only confirmed my suspicion [about India's unwillingness to talk]. This is not a decision they [the BJP] have taken out of the blue. It was part of their election manifesto all along. It is, in fact, ingrained in their ideology that puts Hindus above all other religions and seeks to establish a state that represses all other religious groups."
    Keep repeating that line like Jinnah did.

    "What they did in Kashmir is in accordance with their ideology. They have a racist ideology," he declared. "They have violated their own country's and international laws to [uphold] their ideology.
    No laws were violated domestic or international

    "I had asked United States President Donald Trump to intervene because our bilateral talks [with India] had failed. This is going to become a big issue now. The people who have kept their resistance alive despite state brutality over the last five years will not stop just because they [the BJP] changed a law. In fact, this is going to get more serious.
    We are prepared. Only how long for they will keep at it is in question. Not another seventy years that's for sure.

    "They will now crack down even harder on the Kashmiri people. They will try to suppress the Kashmiri resistance with brute force. I fear that they may initiate ethnic cleansing in Kashmir to wipe out the local population. With an approach of this nature, incidents like Pulwama are bound to happen again. I can already predict this will happen. They will attempt to place the blame on us again. They may strike us again, and we will strike back.
    Fear monger like any good pol why don't you. There will be no ethnic cleansing. Whether another Pulwama happens is up to your people in Pindi. I imagine they would very much like to see a 100 Pulwamas.

    "What will happen then? They will attack us and we will respond and the war can go both ways [...] But if we fight a war till we shed the last drop of our blood, who will win that war? No one will win it and it will have grievous consequences for the entire world. This is not nuclear blackmail.
    Is this Imran putting the world on notice ?

    "We want the global leadership to take note.

    "My party and I are taking the responsibility to approach the leaders of the world and apprise them of what is happening in Kashmir. I know the Western world, and I feel like they are not sufficiently aware of what is happening in Kashmir. I will inform them that what the Indian government is doing in Kashmir and what it is doing to Muslims and minorities in India goes against everything the Western world believes in."
    Given nothing much was done about the way the Paks treat their own minorities i think they will just politely listen

    "Is it not our massive failure? That we didn't know what the Indian government was thinking? Yes we are united for the cause of Pakistan but that [unity] should not [come] without self-introspection.

    "We have two options: either we hide or we take decisive action. Hiding is not an option, we must take decisive action."

    He noted that none of the friendly nations, including China, had stepped up in Pakistan's favour. "Is this not a massive failure of our foreign policy?"
    Pertinent question by the opposition member.

    "I believe that what is good for Afghanistan is good for Pakistan and vice versa [...] but we should not exhaust all our resources in trying to establish peace [in Afghanistan] without getting anything in return. We have to ask [the government]: Was President Trump's offer to mediate his trump card or trap card?"
    Won't work.

    "We will neither let Modi turn [India] into Israel nor allow Kashmir to turn into Palestine [...] India has been given a free hand while we assure the world that we want peace in Kabul. Are we the only ones responsible [to establish peace in Afghanistan]?"

    Sharif assured that the opposition will stand with the government on this issue as the "nation needed to show unity, now more than ever".
    Interesting how opposition stands with govt in Pakistan. Pakistan of course bears no responsibility whatsoever for what happens in J&K.

    The PPP chairman went on to say that it was "an attack obviously on the Muslims of Kashmir, but it was also an attack on India, on the idea of India as a secular democratic India where all citizens have the right to be treated equally."

    "It is an attack on the India of Nehru and Gandhi, but it is also an attack on the India of Vajpayee," he added.
    And that is point, people in J&K do not treat others equally. We've fixed that now.

    "Kashmiris are looking towards Pakistan in this time of dire need," she added. "We would like them to know that they are not alone; Pakistan will continue its diplomatic support for their cause and raise the matter on all relevant forums.
    Are they ? the place is under lock down presently.

  8. #143
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Prepared to go to any extent to fulfil our obligations to Kashmiri people: ISPR

    Come and get it, islamic jihadi marauders. Never won a single war in their history, and this big talk while peddling terrorism in the neighbourhood. Every single Pakistani who sets foot on Indian soil will be killed. Every darn single Pakistani. This is also a BIG F U to President Trump.

    Going out to buy a bottle of Jack and celebrate!!! It's not everyday that history is made. This will go down in the annals of Indian/Sub-Continental history in golden letters.
    Every time i see videos of these generals, they look like they have either seen a ghost or been to some funeral. Why the long faces.

    Or is that their mean & resolute look designed to instill confidence among their people.

    Yesterday, India's ruling Bharatiya Janata Party stripped Kashmiris of the special autonomy they had for seven decades through a rushed presidential order.
    Was not rushed. C'mon Dawn, you're better than this !!


    An indefinite curfew — that has entered its second day — was imposed in occupied Kashmir and elected leaders were put under house arrest.
    True, its up to the govt how long for.

    By repealing Article 370 of the constitution, people from the rest of India will now have the right to acquire property in occupied Kashmir and settle there permanently. Kashmiris as well as critics of India’s Hindu nationalist-led government see the move as an attempt to dilute the demographics of Muslim-majority Kashmir with Hindu settlers.
    That will happen but not to the extent imagined.

    Tripura is 20% Bong. No trouble there. Quiet.

    I doubt there will even be that many going to J&K. 5% outsiders according to one commentator.

    I'd expect land prices to appreciate significantly now though. So the local land owners are going to see a windfall.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 06 Aug 19, at 16:02.

  9. #144
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    Is Modi really going to raise the flag in Srinagar this Independence day ?

    I don't think so. Maybe when the new assembly gets sworn in.

    No, he's going to be in the red fort thundering about how he extended unification of the country.

  10. #145
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223

  11. #146
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223
    Arab country

    UAE Ambassador to India reacts to Kashmir decision | Gulf News | Aug 06 2019

    Dr Al Banna added: “We also took note of the introduction of Jammu and Kashmir Reorganisation Bill in the Indian Parliament aimed at replacing Article 370 with the creation of Ladakh region and the state of Jammu and Kashmir as India’s two new Union Territories.”

    He commented that from his understanding the reorganisation of states is not a unique incident in the history of independent India and that it was mainly aimed at reducing regional disparity and improving efficiency. He viewed this latest decision related to the state of Jammu and Kashmir as an internal matter as stipulated by the Indian Constitution.
    He gets it!

    Now see below

    Indian opposition

    Spoiler!
    Last edited by Double Edge; 07 Aug 19, at 10:58.

  12. #147
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    11,223


    As a result of annulling article 370 & 35A, the govt shifts the discussion from the way it was in the past. Earlier we said J&K is an integral part of India.

    Today Kashmir refers not only to the valley alone but the entire Kashmir, that is PO J&K as well as Aksai Chin. Resolutions passed in the house today have declared those areas also as integral part of India. The discussion about "kashmir" has been removed and the ability of other powers to dabble there as there are no longer any special provisions relating to the area. This complicates the situation for Pakistan & China.

    To date the Pak perception has been that the Gilgit Baltistan region and the Mirpur Muzaffarabad region together known as PO J&K was their territory and the only part for discussion was the part lying with India. This perception has been challenged over the previous five years and now it has flipped. J&K belongs to India and the only thing left for discussion is PO J&K and how do we get it back.

    If unrest intensifies in Pakistan then people of GB will want to merge with India as that is the historical way people have interacted in that region. Those are the lines of communication. Mirpur muzzafarabad region however we should miss as those people won't mix well. Incidentally the Brits wanted the Paks to have those areas as they allowed access to both China & Russia. This is why they assisted in the '48 raid by the tribals.

    With UT status for Kashmir the political link between the Hurriyat, NC, PDP & the ISI has been decisively broken. Their ability to work with over ground workers and give support to certain terrorist activities & stone pelters will come down. There will be civil unrest. There are also alternative voices in politics coming up. The annulment of 370 will be their victory. As for dealing with the valley, the govt is going to throw money at it. Who in their right mind is going to protest that.

    Unless the Paks want to match contributions : )
    Last edited by Double Edge; 07 Aug 19, at 01:58.

  13. #148
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jul 13
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    6,481
    Article 370 gone, next could be ex-CM’s homes

    Entitlement much?

    Only war, with the destruction of terroristan can solve the Kashmir problem.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  14. #149
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jul 13
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    6,481
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  15. #150
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jul 13
    Location
    Singapore
    Posts
    6,481
    We will take the case of Kashmir to the UN: Imran Khan

    And say what douche? Yes we are the aggressor. Say what to the UN?

    Vacate PoK first, then go complain. Numbskull.

    Oops, we have the signed docs from 1965 & 1971. It's B-I-L-A-T-E-R-A-L, jihadi illiterates. That means, we spank you when we want, we firebomb you positions across the LoC and the IB whenever we want. Pakistan can do no fcuk in return. You retards got lucky America couldn't comprehend your duplicity since the beginning of the WoT.
    Last edited by Oracle; 07 Aug 19, at 01:57.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. India and Pakistan in Kashmir border skirmish
    By Mohan in forum Central and South Asia
    Replies: 312
    Last Post: 02 May 13,, 13:15
  2. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 20 Sep 10,, 13:21
  3. Levitating stone !!!
    By sun in forum World Affairs Board Pub
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 30 Dec 08,, 08:55
  4. Indian Kashmir 'more free' than all of Pakistan: report
    By Archer in forum International Politics
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 01 Feb 07,, 04:27

Share this thread with friends:

Share this thread with friends:

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •