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Thread: I think I'm in love.....

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    I think I'm in love.....


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    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    I'd be the guy that spends all his lunch money on something like this, then tries to save up again by running steel cased Wolf ammo through it...

    In reality, I'm waiting for either the Desert Tech MDR or Tavor 7 to get into out in the wild to where the prices settle down.
    Last edited by SteveDaPirate; 29 Jan 18, at 14:32.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    I'd be the guy that spends all his lunch money on something like this, then tries to save up again by running steel cased Wolf ammo through it...

    In reality, I'm waiting for either the Desert Tech MDR or Tavor 7 to get into out in the wild to where the prices settle down.
    Those bullpups are nice, especially during home defense.

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    Senior Contributor surfgun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by surfgun View Post
    I'm more of a latest high tech kind of guy but that IS really cool.

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    Senior Contributor antimony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by citanon View Post
    I'm more of a latest high tech kind of guy but that IS really cool.
    OK, why is this really cool? This is not even "classic" technology. This is an older iteration of a modern variant. It is as if someone has produced a circa 2007 iphone with features from tat age and wants to sell as "retro".

    This underscores what I told Col OOE. There is no innovation in firearms :((
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" ~ Epicurus

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    Oh, you're looking for something to dream about.

    The next innovation that is coming is caseless ammo but we've been hearing about that for decades. They have yet to solve the cook off problem but with the advent of new cooling technologies from the IT world, this may be coming through.

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    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by antimony View Post
    This underscores what I told Col OOE. There is no innovation in firearms :((
    You've got some innovation with bullpups coming to the civilian market, designs like the AN-94, and as the Col mentioned, caseless ammunition hanging out there just out of reach.

    But the firearms market suffers from the fact that there just isn't much incentive to innovate. Firearms are a very mature technology already, and as product they are extremely durable.

    For example, your iPhone won't last more than about 3 years before it needs a new battery, and a succession of OS updates have caused the hardware to start chugging along. As a result, there's constant demand for the latest and greatest version that's faster, smaller, and with longer battery life.

    On the flip side, if your great grandfather put even a modicum of effort into maintaining his old Winchester model 1894 it probably works just as well today as it did when he took his first white-tail deer with it 100 years ago. So now, in addition to having a product that lasts such a long time you have a rifle with heritage. Why would you replace a tool that still functions perfectly and has been handed down from father to son for generations?

    So innovation is slow because there's not much incentive and the margins are pretty thin. You have a few smaller companies like Kel-Tec that are always churning out new whiz-bang designs but they don't have the QC to back it up unfortunately.

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    Senior Contributor Monash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Oh, you're looking for something to dream about.

    The next innovation that is coming is caseless ammo but we've been hearing about that for decades. They have yet to solve the cook off problem but with the advent of new cooling technologies from the IT world, this may be coming through.
    I thought the LSAT program was close to solving the 'cook off' problem. I read an article quoting someone who worked on the program stating that their caseless round was stable at over 200 F . I also though the mg ( not the rifle) had been extensively field tested including in Afghanistan.
    So it looks like they're getting close.
    Last edited by Monash; 01 Mar 18, at 20:00.

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    Quote Originally Posted by antimony View Post
    OK, why is this really cool? This is not even "classic" technology. This is an older iteration of a modern variant. It is as if someone has produced a circa 2007 iphone with features from tat age and wants to sell as "retro".

    This underscores what I told Col OOE. There is no innovation in firearms :((
    This is a .308 semi-auto that weighs less than 7.5 lbs and shoots < 1 MOA. Very nice performance increase on both counts vs typical Ar-10s.

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    Senior Contributor surfgun's Avatar
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    (Sarcasm). But, but, but, Armalites are only for killing Humans....

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    Quote Originally Posted by surfgun View Post
    (Sarcasm). But, but, but, Armalites are only for killing Humans....
    All of these mass shootings would stop if we just banned the index finger....

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    The POF is a nice do everything rifle but barrel is a bit too short as an ideal hunting platform because you loose too much velocity for the .308 cartridge.

    Here's a crazy guy who cut up his rifle to find out how much velocity you lose:

    https://rifleshooter.com/2014/12/308...ty-28-to-16-5/

    With a 24 inch barrel and good ammunition, you can send a bullet fast enough (2600 fps) to get hydrostatic shock on medium sized game out to about 200 yards. With the 16.5 inch barrel, you're basically at 2650 fps at the muzzle even using the highest power loads.

    There's this < 8lb AR-10, which seems about the ideal hunting AR, but damn, ideal sure costs a lot of $$$$.

    Attachment 45509

    https://christensenarms.com/ca-10-dmr/
    Last edited by citanon; 02 Mar 18, at 01:59.

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    Quote Originally Posted by citanon View Post
    The POF is a nice do everything rifle but barrel is a bit too short as an ideal hunting platform because you loose too much velocity for the .308 cartridge.
    With a sub 1 MOA? Who cares? Aim well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    With a sub 1 MOA? Who cares? Aim well.
    You've got a point there col.

    Also, this guy does a part by part breakdown and review of the rifle:



    And another guy who shot 1000 rounds out of it for his review:

    Last edited by citanon; 03 Mar 18, at 21:43.

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