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Thread: 2018 American Political Scene

  1. #1696
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    My recommendation would be to report to the Mueller Inquiry.
    Report what? That US should fight for Ukraine? You have no point, nothing on Trump and you go on and on and on. Write a letter to Trump and see where that takes you. AFAIK, nobody in this board are on Trump's team, and ranting here everyday about Ukraine won't solve your issue. Your obsession with Trump is doing you no good, and it's driving you mad.
    Last edited by Oracle; 03 Nov 18, at 06:49.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  2. #1697
    Senior Contributor Versus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Team View Post
    Well to name the most recent example, the guy was endorsing lethal force as a primary response for a hypothetical case of migrants throwing rocks at troops. American police have quelled riots of thousands of people doing this without immediately resorting to shooting into crowds, why should the response suddenly be so severe?
    I, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."

    Where is the issue?
    Last edited by Versus; 03 Nov 18, at 09:04.

  3. #1698
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  4. #1699
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Report what? That US should fight for Ukraine? You have no point, nothing on Trump and you go on and on and on. Write a letter to Trump and see where that takes you. AFAIK, nobody in this board are on Trump's team, and ranting here everyday about Ukraine won't solve your issue. Your obsession with Trump is doing you no good, and it's driving you mad.
    I replied to you saying that nobody thought that Moscow interfered in the US election; yes they do. That is all. If you wish to discuss the war here fine but do not tell me I raised the issue when replying to you regarding the US election.

  5. #1700
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    Sry double post.
    Last edited by snapper; 03 Nov 18, at 13:31.

  6. #1701
    Senior Contributor Red Team's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Versus View Post
    I, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."

    Where is the issue?
    If I have to explain to you why shooting at unarmed civilians is fundamentally wrong, then clearly we are on two different pages.
    "Draft beer, not people."

  7. #1702
    Senior Contributor Oracle's Avatar
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    I'm wondering which professional Army would listen to its leader and shoot at unarmed civilians. Trump saved himself a big embarrassment.
    Politicians are elected to serve...far too many don't see it that way - Albany Rifles! || Loyalty to country always. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it - Mark Twain! || I am a far left millennial!

  8. #1703
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    I'm wondering which professional Army would listen to its leader and shoot at unarmed civilians. Trump saved himself a big embarrassment.
    Lethal force is authorized in defence of self and position, in this case the border. Just because they're unarmed civilians does not relieve you of your responsibility to defend your position.

    That being said, it will be a cold day in hell before I order fire on unarmed civilians. I will accept their surrender or I will force their surrender. Rock throwers will be identified and treated as illegal combattants.

  9. #1704
    Senior Contributor Versus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Team View Post
    If I have to explain to you why shooting at unarmed civilians is fundamentally wrong, then clearly we are on two different pages.
    After what Albanian "refugees" and "migrants" did few decades later, after havoc that current "migrants" and "refugees" are doing all accross Eu and in Serbia (although it is suppressed), my answer is unequivocally-ON SITE.
    Except if you like to see mutilated corpses hanging from a bridge on a highway or videos of your law enforcment officers being cut to pieces like ours were.

    They are not migrants nor refugees, to begin with, yet they are political activists with hostile intent and agenda against US.
    Last edited by Versus; 03 Nov 18, at 22:17.

  10. #1705
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    Quote Originally Posted by Versus View Post

    They are not migrants nor refugees, to begin with, yet they are political activists with hostile intent and agenda against US.
    You must have some pretty damning evidence that no one, including the US government, has to draw such a conclusion.

    After what Albanian "refugees" and "migrants" did few decades later, after havoc that current "migrants" and "refugees" are doing all accross Eu and in Serbia (although it is suppressed), my answer is unequivocally-ON SITE.
    Except if you like to see mutilated corpses hanging from a bridge on a highway or videos of your law enforcment officers being cut to pieces like ours were.
    So to prevent a hypothetical bloodbath from occurring, we should commit a literal bloodbath? I hate invoking Godwin's law, but this sounds like stuff straight out of Mein kampf.
    "Draft beer, not people."

  11. #1706
    Senior Contributor Bigfella's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Team View Post
    If I have to explain to you why shooting at unarmed civilians is fundamentally wrong, then clearly we are on two different pages.
    You aren't just on different pages, you are in different books in different libraries.


    Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

  12. #1707
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Lethal force is authorized in defence of self and position, in this case the border. Just because they're unarmed civilians does not relieve you of your responsibility to defend your position.

    That being said, it will be a cold day in hell before I order fire on unarmed civilians. I will accept their surrender or I will force their surrender. Rock throwers will be identified and treated as illegal combattants.
    This shouldn't be a military operation to begin with. Unless there is evidence the crowd has more serious weaponry than a few stones they picked up they should be handled by law enforcement. If they do become violent there are riot police who have far more appropriate training and equipment to deal with that.

    This whole conversation is somewhere between bizarre and insane.


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  13. #1708
    Senior Contributor Bigfella's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Team View Post
    You must have some pretty damning evidence that no one, including the US government, has to draw such a conclusion.



    So to prevent a hypothetical bloodbath from occurring, we should commit a literal bloodbath? I hate invoking Godwin's law, but this sounds like stuff straight out of Mein kampf.
    Like I said, different books, different bookshops.


    Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

  14. #1709
    Senior Contributor Red Team's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bigfella View Post
    This shouldn't be a military operation to begin with. Unless there is evidence the crowd has more serious weaponry than a few stones they picked up they should be handled by law enforcement. If they do become violent there are riot police who have far more appropriate training and equipment to deal with that.

    This whole conversation is somewhere between bizarre and insane.
    To be fair BF, the National Guard that would be deployed should ostensibly have competence in crowd/riot control and would be expected to respond to the crowd as such. Despite some high profile incidents in the past (i.e., My Lai), there's plenty of faith around that American troops will not participate in a civilian turkey shoot. The real disturbing part are the people that so readily accept committing virtual war crimes to "keep the dang immigrants from takin' 'er jerbs."

    Different books, different bookshops, and different planets.
    "Draft beer, not people."

  15. #1710
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Team View Post
    Different books, different bookshops, and different planets.
    Different lives but definetely the same friggin planet. Versus is a veteran of the Yugoslav Wars and all that it means. That was a Civil War when you have Grandmothers throwing out their granddaughters because they are a different people, Croats, Serbs, Albanians, Bosnians - take your pick. So yes, he does have that view.

    With that aspect, it is extremely surprising that there has not been a 2nd Kosovo War since the ethnic Albanians claim what cannot be denied as Serb territory within Serbia itself.

    Grandmothers throwing out their granddaughters. That's 3 generations that they remember this stuff and they tell of the First Battle of Kosovo as it were yesterday.

    You may not like it but Versus has lived it.

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