Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

2018 American Political Scene

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    You don't know crap about NAFTA. What Mexico and Canada had to give up to have some sort of North American trade. Mexico, in effect, just gutted her car industry. Canada just lost 15% of her dairy industry.
    Perhaps then you could explain the deep difference between the old and new agreements - I fully acknowledge that I do not know the details but if you say it is entirely different please enlighten me on how.

    Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    It isn't going to be solve. The US doesn't need INF missiles in Europe. NATO AF and USN cruise missiles do the job there. She needs them in Asia where the lack of allied air power is stacked against North Korean and Chinese military strengths.
    I do not disagree with the Chinese need to block China but not sure how this plays out in Trumpkin's INF renouncement or what it means for Europe.

    Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    You're certainly giving us the impression that you are. After years of Mueller, there has been NOT one piece of evidence that Putin has any influence over Trump. We have asked you for years for any piece of evidence. All you put up are suggestions that when upon closer examinations yield absolutely zero. I find your defintion of money laundering in desribing making a profit to give you zero credibility in criminal and economic expertise.
    Mueller has indicted and got the cooperation of over 30 people; Manafort - the campaign manager, Flynn - the NSA, Cohen - the fixer... seems likely Roger Stone is next. Also many Muscovites. Do you not think that a full inquiry is required into what all US security agencies agree was Muscovite interference in the 2016 US election in Trumpkin's favour? Should it just be forgotten?


    Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    So a former mob boss has became an idiotic angel.
    When was he a mob boss? I think you mistake Poroshenko for his predecessor. A fool he may be (but that is my opinion and I do not know all he knows) but a mob boss he could never be.

    A simple google showed that Poroshenko is far worst than Trump will ever be

    Look I am not saying Poroshenko is clean as a Nun - I know for a fact he is not. I am not a supporter of his in particular for that reason. I would prefer more acute reform faster myself - line the oligarchs up in court or at a firing squad and do away with the lot and hand out their loot to the the people as individuals if you want. But Poroshenko has overseen more reform in Ukraine (although some is shoddy) than any other President since 1991 - and probably all them put together. Whatever you or I may think of him he has stood up to Moscow as well. He has not been a 'bad' President though he has not done all that some (myself included) might wish and what has been has often only been half done. Like I said I am not a great fan but he has done far more good for Ukraine that Trumpkin will ever do for the US.

    Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Whatever. Criticize Trump all you want but do not bring the UKR as a shinging example of a defender of Western Democratic values because clearly, Trump's US is light years ahead of Poroshenko's UKR.
    Trumpkin is a democrat? Get lost darling. He's a racist bigot who likes to abuse Ladies.

    Comment


    • zraver,

      Do you ever check your sources, or is it part of the initiation to swallow whole anything right-wing talk radio spews out?

      The Southern Poverty Law Center classifies the Federation for American Immigration Reform (by the way, that's your source) as a hate group with close ties to white supremacist groups. Founder John Tanton is pro-eugenics, which for the verbally challenged means openly racist to the point of selective breeding and sterilization.

      He also founded SPLC-idendtifed hate group The Social Contract Press.
      "One of my prime concerns is about the decline of folks who look like you and me... for European-American society and culture to persist requires a European-American majority, and a clear one at that."
      So, we'll score that a zero for reliable, impartial sources.

      As for the accuracy of its economics,

      At the federal, state, and local levels, taxpayers shell out approximately $134.9 billion to cover the costs incurred by the presence of more than 12.5 million illegal aliens, and about 4.2 million citizen children of illegal aliens. That amounts to a tax burden of approximately $8,075 per illegal alien family member and a total of $115,894,597,664. The total cost of illegal immigration to U.S. taxpayers is both staggering and crippling. In 2013, FAIR estimated the total cost to be approximately $113 billion. So, in under four years, the cost has risen nearly $3 billion. This is a disturbing and unsustainable trend. The sections below will break down and further explain these numbers at the federal, state, and local levels.
      Since you didn't directly answer the gross / net question, I'll spell it out for you: IF the data have any connection to the real world, THEN it is wholly a gross figure. (The cartoonish effort to account for taxes paid is blatantly absurd.)

      But, at least they're open about it:
      FAIR believes that most studies grossly overestimate both the taxes actually collected from illegal aliens and, more importantly, the amount of taxes actually paid by illegal aliens (i.e., the amount of money collected from illegal aliens and actually kept by the federal government).
      Back to zraver-land:
      See all that money being sent outside the borders in remittances isn't creating jobs here. A citizen who makes $100 spends 100 and that adds to economic activity. An illegal who makes $100 and sends $50 out of the country is only generating half as much economic activity.
      To follow the logic, it should be illegal for a US pension fund, for example, to invest in any financial instrument from outside the United States. Since that might – just might – invite retaliation, how would you go about paying for the GOPers' national debt? China, Japan, Korea, Hong Kong and Taiwan would no longer be interested in buying US T-bills if US investors were to boycott foreign investments…

      Oops.


      Oh, and the day the wholly elective Bush-Cheney war is paid for by Iraqi oil is the day you can begin to explain how The Trumpet's wall is going to pay for itself.



      = = = = =

      Dazed,

      Illegal employees may use another person's Social Security Number to get around the system. That means, paying SSN taxes but getting no benefit.
      Trust me?
      I'm an economist!

      Comment


      • Originally posted by snapper View Post
        Perhaps then you could explain the deep difference between the old and new agreements - I fully acknowledge that I do not know the details but if you say it is entirely different please enlighten me on how.
        For Mexico, they agreed to upping car worker's wages to American and Canadian norms, effectively killing any competitive advantage of having car factories in Mexico. For Canada, dairy farmers can no longer rely on higher Canadian prices to subsidize their cheap sales of dairy products to Asia.

        Originally posted by snapper View Post
        I do not disagree with the Chinese need to block China but not sure how this plays out in Trumpkin's INF renouncement or what it means for Europe.
        The INF Treaty was WORLDWIDE. The Intermediate Range of weapons was banned between the US and Russia. The INF Treaty is not and was not Europe specific. It was just that Europe benefitted from them.

        Originally posted by snapper View Post
        Mueller has indicted and got the cooperation of over 30 people; Manafort - the campaign manager, Flynn - the NSA, Cohen - the fixer... seems likely Roger Stone is next. Also many Muscovites. Do you not think that a full inquiry is required into what all US security agencies agree was Muscovite interference in the 2016 US election in Trumpkin's favour? Should it just be forgotten?
        And yet not one single sentence, not one word on how Trump himself was compromised, the entire premis of your Trumpkin spew. You can dance around the issue all you want, there is zero evidence of Trump being willingly or unwillingly compromised by Putin. I again challenge you to come up with any evidence that Trump is compromised. Put up or shut up.

        Originally posted by snapper View Post
        When was he a mob boss? I think you mistake Poroshenko for his predecessor. A fool he may be (but that is my opinion and I do not know all he knows) but a mob boss he could never be.
        You've got to be shitting me. How about appointing another gang boss Mikheil Saakashvili as Odessa Governor and then stripped him of power and citizenship when he became too troublesome? That's Mafia to the tilt.


        Originally posted by snapper View Post
        Look I am not saying Poroshenko is clean as a Nun - I know for a fact he is not. I am not a supporter of his in particular for that reason. I would prefer more acute reform faster myself - line the oligarchs up in court or at a firing squad and do away with the lot and hand out their loot to the the people as individuals if you want. But Poroshenko has overseen more reform in Ukraine (although some is shoddy) than any other President since 1991 - and probably all them put together. Whatever you or I may think of him he has stood up to Moscow as well. He has not been a 'bad' President though he has not done all that some (myself included) might wish and what has been has often only been half done.
        The US under Trump is 100 times better than the UKR under Poroshenko.

        Originally posted by snapper View Post
        Like I said I am not a great fan but he has done far more good for Ukraine that Trumpkin will ever do for the US.
        Considering you don't know crap about NAFTA and the INF Treaty, you're not the authority to state such since your Trumpkin bias has zero evidenciary basis.

        Originally posted by snapper View Post
        Trumpkin is a democrat? Get lost darling.
        Get some glasses, pale face. DO NOT put words in my mouth.

        I've said the UKR is NOT my democratic defender and never will be. Trump, for all his faults, is still the one we rely on. Poroshenko is not and will never be.

        Originally posted by snapper View Post
        He's a racist bigot who likes to abuse Ladies.
        I'll do better. Trump is an asshole but he's our asshole. Stick to yours.
        Last edited by Officer of Engineers; 24 Oct 18,, 22:13.
        Chimo

        Comment


        • Originally posted by snapper View Post
          Trumpkin is a democrat? Get lost darling. He's a racist bigot who likes to abuse Ladies.
          Racist and bigot begin to look attractive options if these ''victims of abuse'' deserve to be called Ladies.A lady,just like a gentleman is defined by his/her deeds vis-a-vis his/ counterpart.Just as plenty of men deserve contempt and a bullet,many women deserve justly so to be treated as whores and presstitutes.
          As a general rule of life I found useful.

          Wrt missiles,our ''good'' friends in the East and their ''good'' friends even further East have completely ignored the INF.The Chinese weren't bound by it and the Russians did it anyway,but less open.

          The big deal is missile defense,anyway.The West may have an advantage in that.I say ''may'' because nothing is ever certain in war.
          Those who know don't speak
          He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

          Comment


          • Originally posted by DOR View Post
            zraver,

            Do you ever check your sources, or is it part of the initiation to swallow whole anything right-wing talk radio spews out?

            The Southern Poverty Law Center classifies ....
            Wanna bet you will not get the irony?
            Those who know don't speak
            He said to them, "But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one. Luke 22:36

            Comment


            • The instant, inevitable cries of ‘false flag’ after bomb threats targeting the Clintons, Obamas and CNN
              By Abby Ohlheiser and Avi Selk

              The Washington Post, October 24, 2018


              We knew nearly nothing, except that the Secret Service had intercepted “potential explosive devices” targeting the Clintons and Obamas, while investigators also looked into a suspicious package at CNN’s New York offices. Days earlier, authorities found an explosive device in the mailbox of liberal philanthropist George Soros. We did not know who sent them, or why, or what exactly the potential devices were.

              But John Cardillo, a right-wing media personality, was already tweeting out his suspicions.

              “Investigators need to take a serious look at far left groups like #Antifa when investigating the bombs sent to Soros, Obama, and the Clintons,” he wrote in a now-deleted tweet. “These smell like the false flag tactics of unhinged leftists who know they’re losing.”

              Cardillo wasn’t alone. Bill Mitchell, a pro-Trump Twitter mainstay and radio host, was also convinced that the real target of the potential explosive devices was the political power of Republicans.

              “These ‘explosive packages’ being sent to the #Media and high profile Democrats has Soros astro-turfing written all over it so the media can paint the #GOP as ‘the dangerous mob.’ Pure BS.” Mitchell wrote. His tweet, which is still live on Twitter, has more than 2,000 retweets.

              Online speculation is an inevitable result of a breaking news story on the Internet. On Wednesday, #MAGABomber was the top trending topic on Twitter, propelled by a combination of those assuming the bombs were motivated by Trump’s rhetoric against Democrats and the media — and those who were using the hashtag to criticize it. On the pro-Trump Internet, breaking news speculation has increasingly helped to push the once-fringe idea of politically motivated “false flag” attacks into the mainstream.

              Within minutes of the news of the suspicious packages, the “false flag” narrative began circulating in pro-Trump spaces like the r/The_Donald subreddit. Rising posts linked to articles about Bill Ayers, one of the founders of the radical Weather Underground organization, which claimed responsibility for a series of bomb attacks in the 1970s. Another rising post said, “FALSE FLAG. When you hear the MSM screaming about attempted violence by Trump supporters two weeks before Midterms just remember what leftists are capable of.”

              Later on Wednesday, Rush Limbaugh promoted the false-flag theory, suggesting that a “Democratic operative” was more likely to have sent the devices than a Republican. “Republicans just don’t do this kind of thing,” Limbaugh said on his radio show. " You’ve got people trying to harm CNN and Obama and Hillary and Bill Clinton and Debbie “Blabbermouth” Schultz and, you know, just, it might serve a purpose here."
              Trust me?
              I'm an economist!

              Comment


              • Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                For Mexico, they agreed to upping car worker's wages to American and Canadian norms, effectively killing any competitive advantage of having car factories in Mexico. For Canada, dairy farmers can no longer rely on higher Canadian prices to subsidize their cheap sales of dairy products to Asia.
                Is this 'great changes' because a reality TV host proclaims them to be so? I think not.

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                The INF Treaty was WORLDWIDE. The Intermediate Range of weapons was banned between the US and Russia. The INF Treaty is not and was not Europe specific. It was just that Europe benefitted from them.
                I was aware but thankyou for the reminder.

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                And yet not one single sentence, not one word on how Trump himself was compromised, the entire premis of your Trumpkin spew. You can dance around the issue all you want, there is zero evidence of Trump being willingly or unwillingly compromised by Putin. I again challenge you to come up with any evidence that Trump is compromised. Put up or shut up.
                Yes I shall spare you a few words; how many indictments has Mueller lodged? I mean apart from the US citizens...who all happen to have been in the Trumpkin election. I may never understand war as well as you but I do know the Checka.

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                You've got to be shitting me. How about appointing another gang boss Mikheil Saakashvili as Odessa Governor and then stripped him of power and citizenship when he became too troublesome? That's Mafia to the tilt.
                Poroshenko has no criminal convictions unlike the democratically elected Yanukovych. Not that I do not think he is guilty of fraud and embezzlement in a small degree - I think he is. I think it is a little unfair to accuse Saakashvili of crimes of which his successor accuses him and as I do not know the details it sound a bit like "lock her up" and then calling him a criminal. I honestly do not know where his money comes from but he fights Moscow so I do not give a damn. Trumpkin has many bankruptcies.

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                The US under Trump is 100 times better than the UKR under Poroshenko.
                You are free to your opinion: which is fighting Moscow? I will take them.

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                Considering you don't know crap about NAFTA and the INF Treaty, you're not the authority to state such since your Trumpkin bias has zero evidenciary basis.
                Not sure what has to do with comparisons of Presidents...

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                Get some glasses, pale face. DO NOT put words in my mouth.
                I did not put word in your mouth; you did: "Criticize Trump all you want but do not bring the UKR as a shinging example of a defender of Western Democratic values because clearly, Trump's US is light years ahead of Poroshenko's UKR." But if you think Trumpkin even understands the meaning of democracy I must disagree. All he listens to is his own ego - a child man with dangerous toys.

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                I've said the UKR is NOT my democratic defender and never will be. Trump, for all his faults, is still the one we rely on. Poroshenko is not and will never be.
                Then you are ignorant or blind.

                Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                I'll do better. Trump is an asshole but he's our asshole. Stick to yours.
                I hope ours may change as I hope the US executive power may change.
                [QUOTE=WABs_OOE;1038911]

                Originally posted by Mihais View Post
                Racist and bigot begin to look attractive options if these ''victims of abuse'' deserve to be called Ladies.A lady,just like a gentleman is defined by his/her deeds vis-a-vis his/ counterpart.Just as plenty of men deserve contempt and a bullet,many women deserve justly so to be treated as whores and presstitutes.
                As a general rule of life I found useful.
                My friend the fact that a man has many rendez vous with females who are not Ladies says something about his right to be called a Gentleman too. Sure I have know rich kids at school even that hired "Ladies of the Night"; I never respected them either. Be kind to your Wife and she will stand by you is my advice. PS Regards to your Lady.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Mihais View Post
                  Wanna bet you will not get the irony?
                  You'd win that bet, like most leftist he promotes the SPLC as some sort of unbiased judge that just calls balls and strikes when in truth it is highly partisan.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Is this 'great changes' because a reality TV host proclaims them to be so? I think not.
                    It's a big change all right. A lot of Mexicans are going to lose their jobs and a lot of Canadians are going to lose their farms.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    I was aware but thankyou for the reminder.
                    I really doubt that since you questioned the importance to Europe since no European country was a signatory to that Treaty and hence, no say. Hell, you were not even in high school when the treaty was signed and I strongly doubt you were even borned when the SS20 and PERSHINGs was raising the ruckus. I lived through those times and being on the receiving end of a SS20 was a real nightmare. So, don't tell me you know anything about how we got rid of them.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Yes I shall spare you a few words; how many indictments has Mueller lodged? I mean apart from the US citizens...who all happen to have been in the Trumpkin election. I may never understand war as well as you but I do know the Checka.
                    AGAIN, HOW MANY AGAINST TRUMP!?!?! PUT UP OR SHUT UP!

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Poroshenko has no criminal convictions unlike the democratically elected Yanukovych. Not that I do not think he is guilty of fraud and embezzlement in a small degree - I think he is. I think it is a little unfair to accuse Saakashvili of crimes of which his successor accuses him and as I do not know the details it sound a bit like "lock her up" and then calling him a criminal. I honestly do not know where his money comes from but he fights Moscow so I do not give a damn.
                    He grabbed a foreigner to rule over Ukrainian Peoples. He then stripped Saakashvili of powers and citizenship because he believed Saakashvili was corrupt.

                    What Poroshenko did with Saakashvili, we call it Treason around here. To bring in a corrupt foreigner to rule over peoples who have no say in Saakashvili's governorship.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Trumpkin has many bankruptcies.
                    Not personally. He knows how to play the system as do any successful businessman.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    You are free to your opinion: which is fighting Moscow? I will take them.
                    My opinion means that I will not be dragged into the UKR mess and I want no part of it whether they're fighting Moscow or not. The truth is that you're fighting fellow Ukrainians as well as Russians but you can't get yourself to admit that.

                    However, Standards of Living and the Corruption Index backs me up to the hilt. Poroshenko's UKR ain't anywhere close to Trump's US on either scale.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Not sure what has to do with comparisons of Presidents...
                    To state 100% that you're absolutely deluted with zero evidence to back up any of your claims.


                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    I did not put word in your mouth; you did: "Criticize Trump all you want but do not bring the UKR as a shinging example of a defender of Western Democratic values because clearly, Trump's US is light years ahead of Poroshenko's UKR."
                    Obviously, you CANNOT read. Where in that did I state that Trump is a democrat? However, Trump did not and will not appoint a corrupt foreigner with zero ties to the land and people as State Goveernor, an act with is considered treason in every NATO country.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    But if you think Trumpkin even understands the meaning of democracy I must disagree.
                    Trump may or may not understand democracy but the United States of America does. And that is the biggest difference between the US and the UKR. Trump cannot get away with half the stuff Poroshenko already pulled, including using his own men and allowing his Ministers to use their own men as Body Guards instead of State Security.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    All he listens to is his own ego - a child man with dangerous toys.
                    The US voted him those powers. You are NOT THE ONE to tell the US that they voted wrong.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Then you are ignorant or blind.
                    I am neither. You apparently are both. I have the North Atlantic Treaty to back me up. Where is the UKR's signature on that Treaty?

                    The UKR cannot fight WWIII. NATO can. The UKR is not a member of NATO and we don't need the UKR. We, however, do need the US. You are really both ignorant and blind to think otherwise.

                    Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    I hope ours may change as I hope the US executive power may change.
                    Oh, I know the US Executive will change. In 2 years or 6 but Trump's US has an expiriy date. I have no such confidence in Poroshenko.
                    Last edited by Officer of Engineers; 25 Oct 18,, 02:00.
                    Chimo

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      It's a big change all right. A lot of Mexicans are going to lose their jobs and a lot of Canadians are going to lose their farms.
                      How many have? I believe you are Canadian so tell me how many Canadians have lost their farms? My cousins in Ontario have not.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      I really doubt that since you questioned the importance to Europe since no European country was a signatory to that Treaty and hence, no say. Hell, you were not even in high school when the treaty was signed and I strongly doubt you were even borned when the SS20 and PERSHINGs was raising the ruckus. I lived through those times and being on the receiving end of a SS20 was a real nightmare. So, don't tell me you know anything about how we got rid of them.
                      You are right - I am younger than you. You are retired; your generation won a peaceful victory and I respect your help in achieving it. Now it is our problem and in Ukraine it is not peaceful. I understand though Thatcher was key to the former Treaty which they signed in Iceland. I can read and learn; a passtime of time.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      AGAIN, HOW MANY AGAINST TRUMP!?!?! PUT UP OR SHUT UP!
                      NSA, Campaign Manager and sundry others involved in the campaign and his lawyer - so far. I KNOW he is a traitor. Ukraine has not submitted half the evidence it could. We have only so far contributed evidence related to the Manafort case as he stole from us.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      He grabbed a foreigner to rule over Ukrainian Peoples. He then stripped Saakashvili of powers and citizenship because he believed Saakashvili was corrupt.

                      What Poroshenko did with Saakashvili, we call it Treason around here. To bring in a corrupt foreigner to rule over peoples who have no say in Saakashvili's governorship.
                      Saakashvili for starters went to school and University here. Avakov is Armenian - the PM a Jew! Should they be shot for that? Not in my view. There are Georgians fighting in Donbass right now... is that wrong or bad? No. We fight for their - and others - liberty as much as our own. I have sworn an oath to go help our Circassian and Chechen friends who help us today when their time comes. It is not about nationality or faith - it is about liberty and not being stolen from. Churchill said that "If Hitler invaded hell I would make at least a favourable reference to the devil in the House of Commons." I will chose whatever bedfellows in our war as I can - the devil himself it may seem to some.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      Not personally. He knows how to play the system as do any successful businessman.
                      Yea a clever business man who's casino's went bust and got saved by the Muscovite mob. How the hell can a casino go bankrupt? Oh might have been something to do with money laundering maybe. Wonder who's money?

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      My opinion means that I will not be dragged into the UKR mess and I want no part of it whether they're fighting Moscow or not. The truth is that you're fighting fellow Ukrainians as well as Russians but you can't get yourself to admit that.

                      However, Standards of Living and the Corruption Index backs me up to the hilt. Poroshenko's UKR ain't anywhere close to Trump's US on either scale.
                      I do not blame you for not wishing to involve yourself in 'our mess'; in many ways I wish I was not ever involved either and could disregard it as an nmp (not my problem). I got drawn in as I knew people and my family home is here due to the post WW2 border changes. I honestly did not have any real idea that I could become a Ukrainian in 2013; I'd have laughed if someone suggested it. You did not experience the revolution though and have not seen the war. I was outside Kyiv for most of the revolution but there was still blood on the pavements on the night we got there and candles in the thousands all around where the martyrs died. I seen much more of their (and in small part my) blood since. This was coming for a long time though... hell I guessed it in 2008 after Georgia. I am Polish... We know the enemy well - it is almost genetic. Ukraine has a real soul almost and anyone who fights the Chekist mafiosi in Moscow must be my ally - apart from my home being here. I do not expect you to 'understand'; the 'west' has never understood Slavs or the differences between them. I merely submit that my enemy is also yours or were all the US security agencies wrong?

                      Regarding the Corruption Index I think you will find that Ukraine has moved up and the US down. Regarding Standards of Living we have also risen in the indexes. The US again fallen. We have much catching up to do still but my children will have a better future than we have now.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      To state 100% that you're absolutely deluted with zero evidence to back up any of your claims.
                      What on Presidential comparisons? You claimed Poroshenko was a "mob boss" but that was a lie. It is proved (admitted by a son) that Trumpkin took money from Muscovy, that the campaign had many contacts with Muscovite diplomats, 'lawyers', gun loving types - remember Miss Butina? Yet he claimed to have "nothing to do with 'Russia'". What mob did Poroshenko run? Please tell me... I am not a fan as I said.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      Obviously, you CANNOT read. Where in that did I state that Trump is a democrat? However, Trump did not and will not appoint a corrupt foreigner with zero ties to the land and people as State Goveernor, an act with is considered treason in every NATO country.
                      Maybe the "Western Democratic values" bit regarding your question. Poroshenko has stood up for them far more than Trumpkin is capable of understanding how to.

                      Regarding Sarko I said long ago here I was not a fan of his in regard to his Ukrainian aspirations. I only met him twice while he was here. I did not care for him as a person; arrogant was my impression. There is no disputing the reforms he managed to achieve in Georgia though.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      Trump may or may not understand democracy but the United States of America does. And that is the biggest difference between the US and the UKR. Trump cannot get away with half the stuff Poroshenko already pulled, including using his own men and allowing his Ministers to use their own men as Body Guards instead of State Security.
                      What has Poroshenko "pulled"? I will give you a clue - the Chief Prosecutor (who was not even a lawyer by profession) is about the worst I can think of. But Trumpkin just insults AG... and lies and lies and lies. I would go to God happier in Poroshenko's shoes - where is his grab a Lady the private parts? His racialist speeches? I have not agreed with much of the half hearteded reforms that Poroshenko has overseen and much more remains for us to do but his twice the man than Trumpkin can ever be. You give the finger to Moscow and hold them for real - 6% next year on military - you deserve some respect in my eyes. Compare with Helsinki - which the idiot was forced to 'correct' the next day.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      The US voted him those powers. You are NOT THE ONE to tell the US that they voted wrong.
                      So I should not comment on US politics but you as a Canadian may? Have you never commented on European affairs? Did we elect you? How does these rules of yours work? Am I obliged to commit to your made up rules? I think not old man.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      I am neither. You apparently are both. I have the North Atlantic Treaty to back me up. Where is the UKR's signature on that Treaty?
                      "I've said the UKR is NOT my democratic defender and never will be." We are currently taking part in 'Trident Venture' as a "Partner Nation". We have stopped the bastards getting to the Polish border - again. Do your geography. We are killing them you are not; until you step up and fight our common enemy you disgrace yourself by disparaging those who defend their homeland.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      The UKR cannot fight WWIII. NATO can. The UKR is not a member of NATO and we don't need the UKR. We, however, do need the US. You are really both ignorant and blind to think otherwise.
                      I would seek every opportunity to avoid WWlll myself.

                      Originally posted by WABs_OOE View Post
                      Oh, I know the US Executive will change. In 2 years or 6 but Trump's US has an expiriy date. I have no such confidence in Poroshenko.
                      We have Presidential elections next year and I hope Slava will stand and the reformers win. As I have said I am not a Poroshenko fan but there is no way he could ever have been a "mob boss" and no evidence that he was.

                      Colonel I am tired of our arguments. I bear you no grudge but we re-hash the same ground every time and on that we must agree to differ. It is a waste of your and my time and I hope your spare time is not as scarce as mine. I therefore shall not be replying to your insults and comments regarding me or Ukraine in future. I apologise to the fight watchers.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by zraver View Post
                        You'd win that bet, like most leftist he promotes the SPLC as some sort of unbiased judge that just calls balls and strikes when in truth it is highly partisan.
                        Therein lies your problem. If he is a "leftist" as you say then what does that make you and it isn't a centrist. It has been alluded to before.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          How many have? I believe you are Canadian so tell me how many Canadians have lost their farms? My cousins in Ontario have not.
                          You're showing your ignorance again and proves once again you have no Foreign Service experience. The USMCA has not been ratified by any country and thus yet not in force but everyone of us can see the writings on the wall.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          You are right - I am younger than you. You are retired; your generation won a peaceful victory and I respect your help in achieving it.
                          Peaceful? That's a load of crock. We saw combat in a bunch of small wars and the Americans in a few big ones. I was UNPROFOR.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Now it is our problem and in Ukraine it is not peaceful. I understand though Thatcher was key to the former Treaty which they signed in Iceland. I can read and learn; a passtime of time.
                          You still know shit all. Why the Soviets viewed the SS20 as necessary and it gave them an overwhelming advantage of a first strike over the Fulda Gap. Why a counter was necessary. Did the British and French got rid of their nukes? You know shit all.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          NSA, Campaign Manager and sundry others involved in the campaign and his lawyer - so far.
                          All smoke and no fire. Not one hint. Not one leak of any wrongdoing. After years of Mueller, while others are being charged with crimes, there has been not one single hint that they found something wrong, after they got all these people and all these documents, not one single shred of evidence or even a hint of an investigative angle to pursue. Nothing. Nadda. Zip.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          I KNOW he is a traitor.
                          You BELIEVE he is a traitor. Big difference. You know shit all.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Ukraine has not submitted half the evidence it could.
                          Bullshit! You don't know crap and you have no access to any evidence. Nice try though.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Saakashvili for starters went to school and University here.
                          Petro Poroshenko- Wikipedia
                          Mikheil Saakashvili

                          On 29 May 2015 President of Ukraine Petro Poroshenko granted a Ukrainian citizenship to former President of Georgia Mikheil Saakashvili almost 10 months after a Tbilisi city court approved the request of the General Prosecutor of Georgia's office and elected a pre-trial detention for Saakashvili in absentia as preventative measure.[143][144] The reason for granting the citizenship was acknowledging that it "poses a state interest of Ukraine".[145] It should be noted that back in February 2015 the General Prosecutor of Georgia's office had appealed to the General Prosecutor of Ukraine office for extradition of Saakashvili and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Georgia had also recalled the Ukraine Ambassador to Georgia in relation to Saakashvili's appointment as a chairman of Consultative International Council of Reforms.[146] Later during his visit to Georgia in 2017, President Poroshenko at his briefing in Tbilisi stated that Ukraine has never received any requests for extradition of Saakashvili, while Minister of Justice of Georgia Tea Tsulukiani countered it with the announcement that there were actually two official requests.[147] The very next day after receiving citizenship on 30 May 2015 Saakashvili was appointment by the president as a head (governor) of the Odessa Regional State Administration (see Governor of Odessa Oblast).[148]
                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Avakov is Armenian - the PM a Jew! Should they be shot for that? Not in my view.
                          The difference. He was voted in. The former is abuse of power. The latter, an exercise in elections.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          There are Georgians fighting in Donbass right now... is that wrong or bad? No. We fight for their - and others - liberty as much as our own. I have sworn an oath to go help our Circassian and Chechen friends who help us today when their time comes. It is not about nationality or faith - it is about liberty and not being stolen from. Churchill said that "If Hitler invaded hell I would make at least a favourable reference to the devil in the House of Commons." I will chose whatever bedfellows in our war as I can - the devil himself it may seem to some.
                          Great, you're all mercs.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Yea a clever business man who's casino's went bust and got saved by the Muscovite mob. How the hell can a casino go bankrupt? Oh might have been something to do with money laundering maybe. Wonder who's money?
                          I went through your claims and found shit all. Please provide evidence of money laundering. Hint: there isn't any. BTW, money laundering is to provide an official receipt for monies of hidden illegal origins, not buy low sell high. Your Florida gambit? That's not money laundering since everyone knows where the money came from, a Russian.

                          What's more, your view sucks. If Trump is money laundering for the Russians, he's keeping all of it. There has been not one cent being traced to be sent back to Russia.

                          And down you go again.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          I do not blame you for not wishing to involve yourself in 'our mess'; in many ways I wish I was not ever involved either and could disregard it as an nmp (not my problem). I got drawn in as I knew people and my family home is here due to the post WW2 border changes. I honestly did not have any real idea that I could become a Ukrainian in 2013; I'd have laughed if someone suggested it. You did not experience the revolution though and have not seen the war. I was outside Kyiv for most of the revolution but there was still blood on the pavements on the night we got there and candles in the thousands all around where the martyrs died. I seen much more of their (and in small part my) blood since. This was coming for a long time though... hell I guessed it in 2008 after Georgia. I am Polish... We know the enemy well - it is almost genetic. Ukraine has a real soul almost and anyone who fights the Chekist mafiosi in Moscow must be my ally - apart from my home being here. I do not expect you to 'understand'; the 'west' has never understood Slavs or the differences between them. I merely submit that my enemy is also yours or were all the US security agencies wrong?
                          Bullshit! This is a freaking Civil War. You're fighting fellow Ukrainians. DNR and LNR may be supported by Moscow but 90% of their Front Line troops are Ukrainians as is yours. I've seen Civil Wars and they're ugly as hell. Families have been torned apart. Grandmothers throwing out their granddaughters. You want to be in that mess. Good for you. But I'm finished with that.

                          Putin ain't doing you any favours but you're doing shit all to bring them back into the fold.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Regarding the Corruption Index I think you will find that Ukraine has moved up and the US down. Regarding Standards of Living we have also risen in the indexes. The US again fallen. We have much catching up to do still but my children will have a better future than we have now.
                          That's like saying you've lowered you shit pile by an inch while I'm farting more. We both smell shit. However, my floor is still clean.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          What on Presidential comparisons? You claimed Poroshenko was a "mob boss" but that was a lie. It is proved (admitted by a son) that Trumpkin took money from Muscovy, that the campaign had many contacts with Muscovite diplomats, 'lawyers', gun loving types - remember Miss Butina? Yet he claimed to have "nothing to do with 'Russia'".
                          He claimed nothing to do with "collusion." Yeah, I'm still waiting for any evidence that Trump has been compromised. And he took monies from naturalized Americans with ties to Russia ... but you keep ignoring evidence that runs counter to your BELIEFS. As for Miss Butina, yeah, I'm waiting for Daniel Storm II - NOT.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          What mob did Poroshenko run? Please tell me... I am not a fan as I said.
                          Read it.

                          Petro Poroshenko - Wikipedia

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Maybe the "Western Democratic values" bit regarding your question. Poroshenko has stood up for them far more than Trumpkin is capable of understanding how to.
                          I call bullshit but regardless, Poroshenko does not have 1500 readied nukes and a further 8000 more in reserves at his command nor can he field enough armies, air forces, and navies to dominate the battlefield. Hell, he can't even dominate the battlefield from fellow Ukrainians.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Regarding Sarko I said long ago here I was not a fan of his in regard to his Ukrainian aspirations. I only met him twice while he was here. I did not care for him as a person; arrogant was my impression. There is no disputing the reforms he managed to achieve in Georgia though.
                          He managed so much reforms that he's scared to go back to Georgia for a fair trial.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          What has Poroshenko "pulled"? I will give you a clue - the Chief Prosecutor (who was not even a lawyer by profession) is about the worst I can think of. But Trumpkin just insults AG... and lies and lies and lies.
                          From the outside,

                          1) Failed to prosecute the Donbass War/Peace.
                          2) Abuse of power
                          3) Controlling media
                          4) Saakashvili

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          I would go to God happier in Poroshenko's shoes
                          You're going to. He's your President, not mine, and not one I would depend on.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          - where is his grab a Lady the private parts? His racialist speeches? I have not agreed with much of the half hearteded reforms that Poroshenko has overseen and much more remains for us to do but his twice the man than Trumpkin can ever be.
                          Maybe but he's not the most powerful President on Earth. Trump is. Suck it up.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          You give the finger to Moscow and hold them for real - 6% next year on military - you deserve some respect in my eyes. Compare with Helsinki - which the idiot was forced to 'correct' the next day.
                          INF is dead. Cold War II has started.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          So I should not comment on US politics but you as a Canadian may? Have you never commented on European affairs? Did we elect you? How does these rules of yours work? Am I obliged to commit to your made up rules? I think not old man.
                          I comment on the facts that I can back up. You, however, have absolutely zero evidenciary support.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          "I've said the UKR is NOT my democratic defender and never will be." We are currently taking part in 'Trident Venture' as a "Partner Nation". We have stopped the bastards getting to the Polish border - again. Do your geography. We are killing them you are not; until you step up and fight our common enemy you disgrace yourself by disparaging those who defend their homeland.
                          You're killing Ukrainians. Period! I have absolutely zero interest in helping family kill family even if one side of the family is pro-Russian.

                          And spare me that you're stopping the Russians from reaching the Polish border. I remember vividly how the UKR gave Russia permission to fly paratroopers to Pristina and how the Ukrainians wholeheartly supported this action. There were Ukrainian mercs fighting for Serbia.This was 1999. So, no, I do not believe you're our defenders. That bullshit stinks.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          I would seek every opportunity to avoid WWlll myself.
                          Not your call and not your vote.

                          Like it or not, the UKR is still under the Russian nuclear umbrella. China would not dare to nuke Kiev unless she wants to invite a Russian, not American, nuclear retalliation.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          We have Presidential elections next year and I hope Slava will stand and the reformers win.
                          A rock star with zero experience and zero credibility with the power brokers. I would look closely who's going to be pulling his strings.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          As I have said I am not a Poroshenko fan but there is no way he could ever have been a "mob boss" and no evidence that he was.
                          Fine. An oligarch. Same thing.

                          Originally posted by snapper View Post
                          Colonel I am tired of our arguments. I bear you no grudge but we re-hash the same ground every time and on that we must agree to differ. It is a waste of your and my time and I hope your spare time is not as scarce as mine. I therefore shall not be replying to your insults and comments regarding me or Ukraine in future. I apologise to the fight watchers.
                          Then don't. That does not mean I will not call your bullshit when it's stinking too much.
                          Last edited by Officer of Engineers; 25 Oct 18,, 17:23.
                          Chimo

                          Comment


                          • A "mob boss" is NOT the same as an "oligarch", the former has people killed, the latter just bribes officials.

                            Comment


                            • He gets rid of people. Period.

                              https://www.unian.info/politics/1010...in-prison.html
                              Chimo

                              Comment


                              • Are you serious??? "Poroshenko says those buying people's votes must be in prison"... "Staying in opposition does not mean political protection from criminal prosecution," the president added.

                                Should they rewarded instead for breaking election law? Tonight I shall pray for you.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X