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  1. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    Recall 'freedom of speech'? Not like others have not or are not free to give their view on Ukraine - seem to recall you commenting there too. You are free to comment on politics in any country - being a public figure making decisions for a country invites it; the whole world is free to comment. You are Canadian but free to comment on Trump - does me having a different passport prohibit my freedom of speech more? I am afraid that forbidding others to comment on the politics of other countries than their own is beyond anyone's power as you yourself have and continue to prove by commenting on Trumpisms as a Canadian.
    I certainly don't tell the Americans how to deal with Trump. And I'm most certainly ain't telling you not to comment. What I'm telling you is you're just spouting hot air with zero proof of any Trump's wrong doing. That makes your credibility zero and make your post nonsensical and just repeatitious of the same horse puckey with zero proof.

    You can comment on Trump being an asshole all you want but stop trying to tell us about the Rule of Law in the US of which you have zero knowledege and stop lecturing us about the superiority of British law. Edward VIII proves you don't know what you're talking about.

  2. #137
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironduke View Post
    Infowars...
    THAT is why i'm glad i discovered this board

  3. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    THAT is why i'm glad i discovered this board
    The link was actual recordings of Trump disadvowing David Duke and the KKK. As full of horse puckey infowars was, that link does prove a point that Trump really hates David Duke and the KKK from at least 20 years ago.

  4. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOR View Post
    Did you just bring up something that was laid to rest before Obama even declared his intent to run for president, and do so in order to justify the actions of The Trumpet?

    Don’t tell me you’re actually going to pretend Jeremiah Wright, someone Obama distanced himself from before declaring his intent to run for President, is someone with an influence on the man.

    Candidate Obama saying he was outraged and saddened by Wright’s comments doesn’t seem to you, maybe just a little bit, like he disagreed with Wright’s views?

    Really?
    I didn't bring up Rev Wright. Though since you did, you don't get to go 20 years listening to hate willingly every Sunday and then say ops when you run for public office. Trump denounced Duke over 20 years ago and yet every time the sleazeball raises his head he is expected to denounce him again. Which perfectly illustrates my point. The standards applied to the Left are vastly lower than those applied to the Right.

  5. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOR View Post
    Yeah, 1.54%, because the economy was in such beautiful shape when Obama took over.
    Isn't it astonishing how badly GOPers manage the economy?
    It really makes you wonder at the intelligence of the average voter.
    Without Bill Clinton forcing Freddie and Fannie to write subprime mortages... Bush's stupid wars without winning were the straw that broke the camels back, but the housing crisis was a Dem creation.

    The CBO produces something called potential GDP. All else being equal (which it never, ever is), this number is what the economy should be doing. You can see the data, which starts in Q1 1949 and goes out into the 2020s, here: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/GDPPOT

    It given a nice confirmation to the notion that the White House changes parties when the economy isn’t doing so well.
    It also shows pretty conclusively who leaves the economy is better shape.

    The universe is 17 starts to a term of office, from 1953 to 2017.
    The measure is how far from potential the economy was – plus or minus – from its potential.
    The time period is the four quarters from Election Year Q2 to Inauguration Year Q-1 (i.e., Q2 2016 – Q1 2017 for DJT).

    Variation from real economic growth potential, by term
    DDE I _ _ +2.22%
    DDE II _ _ +2.38%
    JFK _ _ _ -2.23%
    LBJ _ _ _ +0.94%
    RMN I _ _ +2.89%
    RMN II _ +2.07%
    JEC _ _ _ -2.21%
    RWR I _ -1.94%
    RWR II _ -1.33%
    GHWB _ _ -0.24%
    WJC I _ _ -2.37%
    WJC II _ _ -0.39%
    GWB I _ _ +0.82%
    GWB II _ _ -0.85%
    BHO I _ _ -3.14%
    BHO II _ _ -3.03%
    DJT _ _ _ -0.58%

    Last four quarters of Democratic terms: +0.12%
    Last four quarters of GOPer terms: -0.47%

    Note that Reagan I handing over to Reagan II, and Reagan II handing over to GHW Bush are both counted as to how well the GOPer handled the economy.
    Wait, so every Dem except LBJ under performs and you think this says Dems do better? 3 GOP presidents over performed vs 1 Dem.... wooo what planet are you on?

  6. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    z,



    there is literally not a single study, including the most optimistic Republican forecasts, that predict this.
    Rising wages mean not just more taxes paid, but also fewer people needing tax dollars paid to them. Also if the money parked overseas is in fact brought in at the sum of 4 trillion dollars that is a single year 4600 billion dollar windfall to the treasury not counted in the CBO estimates AFAIK. Add in sustained 3%+ growth and we could add several trillion to our economy by the time Trump leaves. Each trillion added is over 200 billion in tax revenues for the federal government. If our economy adds 3 trillion in gdp and the 4 trillion in repatriated money with a slight reduction in people needing assistance and it is paid for. The key is for Congress to finally control spending. At this point most of our national debt is exceedingly low interest.

    This piece shows federal spending as a percentage of GDP. If the GDP under Trump grows faster than the sub 2% of the Obama years the actual dollar losses will be wiped out even if total federal tax revenues as a percentage of GDP are lower.
    Last edited by zraver; 18 Jan 18, at 04:48.

  7. #142
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    In the Clinton years leading up to the Bush tax cut federal revenues were growing by an average of 104 billion a year. The Bush Tax cuts and the 01 recession saw a loss of 152 billion before revenues caught up to 2000 levels. After that the federal receipts grew by an average of 210 billion a year until the great recession hit. Had the great recession not occurred the tax receipts would have caught up with loss revenues in 5 years. Economic growth and a bigger GDP leads to increased tax revenues in the medium term unless other wise interrupted. Only 1 year in Reagan's presidency saw a decrease in federal revenues and that was a recession.

  8. #143
    Senior Contributor DOR's Avatar
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    ngnh3569,

    Duke Trumpet—
    FactCheck.org, March 1, 2016

    Asked if he would publicly reject the support of former Ku Klux Klan grand wizard David Duke, Republican presidential front-runner Donald Trump said, “I just don’t know anything about him.”
    Except, The Trumpet is on the record denouncing David Duke – very much like Obama did with Rev Wright – multiple times since 1991. So, why did his memory fail him so badly during the one time in his life when it was vitally important that he not be in any way associated with the KKK?

    CNN, Feb 28, Jake Tapper interview—
    Tapper: I want to ask you about the Anti-Defamation League, which this week called on you to publicly condemn unequivocally the racism of former KKK grand wizard David Duke, who recently said that voting against you at this point would be treason to your heritage. Will you unequivocally condemn David Duke and say that you don’t want his vote or that of other white supremacists in this election?
    Trump: Well, just so you understand, I don’t know anything about David Duke. OK? I don’t know anything about what you’re even talking about with white supremacy or white supremacists. So, I don’t know.

    Tapper: OK. I mean, I’m just talking about David Duke and the Ku Klux Klan here, but…
    Trump: I don’t know any — honestly, I don’t know David Duke. I don’t believe I have ever met him. I’m pretty sure I didn’t meet him. And I just don’t know anything about him.

    = = = = =

    zraver,

    Without Bill Clinton forcing Freddie and Fannie to write subprime mortages
    Now I know you’re just trolling. It was President GHW Bush who signed the Housing and Community Development Act of 1992 to facilitate lending for affordable housing.

    2005: Sen. Chuck Hagel (he’s a Democrat, by the way) introduces the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, which dies in the GOPer-controlled Senate.
    2006: Mortgage-backed securities start to wobble, so lenders dramatically expand the borrowing pool, even though Fannie Mae wouldn’t securitize such loans. Regulatory oversight is GOPer, I mean “absent.”
    2007: Former President and CEO of Fannie Mae Daniel Mudd testifies that the GW Bush Administration’s policies drove sub-prime borrowers into the arms of the private mortgage industry, who used aggressive tactics such as teaser rates, interest-only options and no-doc loans.
    2008: The Bush Administration makes plans to take over Fannie Mae if its financial situation worsens. It does. The Federal Housing Finance Agency places Fannie and Freddie into conservatorship.


    Potential GDP:
    JEC, for example at -2.21% means that when Jimmy Carter took over the White House, the potential growth rate in Q2 1976-Q1 1977 … that’s the Ford Administration, right? … was under par.

    When GWB I gets a +0.82% rating, that’s thanks to the Q2 2000-Q1 2001 Clinton economy.


    Quote Originally Posted by zraver View Post
    In the Clinton years leading up to the Bush tax cut federal revenues were growing by an average of 104 billion a year. The Bush Tax cuts and the 01 recession saw a loss of 152 billion before revenues caught up to 2000 levels. After that the federal receipts grew by an average of 210 billion a year until the great recession hit. Had the great recession not occurred the tax receipts would have caught up with loss revenues in 5 years. Economic growth and a bigger GDP leads to increased tax revenues in the medium term unless other wise interrupted. Only 1 year in Reagan's presidency saw a decrease in federal revenues and that was a recession.
    Average annual change in tax receipts / spending, by Presidential term of office
    _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Receipts _ _ _ _ _ Spending
    1989/90 – 1992/93 (GHWB): _ _ +3.9% p.a. _ _ _ _ _ +5.4% p.a.
    1993/94 – 1996/97 (WJC I): _ _ +8.2% p.a. _ _ _ _ _ +3.3% p.a.
    1997/98 – 2000/01 (WJC II): _ _ +6.1% p.a. _ _ _ _ _ +3.6% p.a.
    2001/02 – 2004/05 (GWB I): _ _ +2.3% p.a. _ _ _ _ _ +7.3% p.a.
    2005/06 – 2008/09 (GWB II): _ _ +0.0% p.a. _ _ _ _ _ +9.4% p.a.
    1989/90 – 1992/93 (GHWB): _ _ +3.9% p.a. _ _ _ _ _ +5.4% p.a.
    Trust me?
    I'm an economist!

  9. #144
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    The link was actual recordings of Trump disadvowing David Duke and the KKK. As full of horse puckey infowars was, that link does prove a point that Trump really hates David Duke and the KKK from at least 20 years ago.
    Good. The man is originally from Queens, NY. Not exactly some white supremacist stronghold. His anti-immigration positions baffle me though given his New Yorker heritage. Who the heck instead was he employing in his hotels.

    You could go around NYC with a LOON perched on your shoulder because its your religious belief and nobody would say otherwise.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 18 Jan 18, at 13:30.

  10. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOR View Post
    ngnh3569,

    Duke Trumpet—
    FactCheck.org, March 1, 2016

    Asked if he would publicly reject the support of former Ku Klux Klan grand wizard David Duke, Republican presidential front-runner Donald Trump said, “I just don’t know anything about him.”
    Except, The Trumpet is on the record denouncing David Duke – very much like Obama did with Rev Wright – multiple times since 1991. So, why did his memory fail him so badly during the one time in his life when it was vitally important that he not be in any way associated with the KKK?

    CNN, Feb 28, Jake Tapper interview—
    Tapper: I want to ask you about the Anti-Defamation League, which this week called on you to publicly condemn unequivocally the racism of former KKK grand wizard David Duke, who recently said that voting against you at this point would be treason to your heritage. Will you unequivocally condemn David Duke and say that you don’t want his vote or that of other white supremacists in this election?
    Trump: Well, just so you understand, I don’t know anything about David Duke. OK? I don’t know anything about what you’re even talking about with white supremacy or white supremacists. So, I don’t know.

    Tapper: OK. I mean, I’m just talking about David Duke and the Ku Klux Klan here, but…
    Trump: I don’t know any — honestly, I don’t know David Duke. I don’t believe I have ever met him. I’m pretty sure I didn’t meet him. And I just don’t know anything about him.

    = = = = =

    zraver,



    Now I know you’re just trolling. It was President GHW Bush who signed the Housing and Community Development Act of 1992 to facilitate lending for affordable housing.

    2005: Sen. Chuck Hagel (he’s a Democrat, by the way) introduces the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, which dies in the GOPer-controlled Senate.
    2006: Mortgage-backed securities start to wobble, so lenders dramatically expand the borrowing pool, even though Fannie Mae wouldn’t securitize such loans. Regulatory oversight is GOPer, I mean “absent.”
    2007: Former President and CEO of Fannie Mae Daniel Mudd testifies that the GW Bush Administration’s policies drove sub-prime borrowers into the arms of the private mortgage industry, who used aggressive tactics such as teaser rates, interest-only options and no-doc loans.
    2008: The Bush Administration makes plans to take over Fannie Mae if its financial situation worsens. It does. The Federal Housing Finance Agency places Fannie and Freddie into conservatorship.
    President Clinton's tenure was characterized by economic prosperity and financial deregulation, which in many ways set the stage for the excesses of recent years. Among his biggest strokes of free-wheeling capitalism was the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act, which repealed the Glass-Steagall Act, a cornerstone of Depression-era regulation. He also signed the Commodity Futures Modernization Act, which exempted credit-default swaps from regulation. In 1995 Clinton loosened housing rules by rewriting the Community Reinvestment Act, which put added pressure on banks to lend in low-income neighborhoods. It is the subject of heated political and scholarly debate whether any of these moves are to blame for our troubles, but they certainly played a role in creating a permissive lending environment.

    http://content.time.com/time/special...877322,00.html

  11. #146
    Senior Contributor anil's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TopHatter View Post
    People that voted for Trump simply because they were fed up with the status quo have seen what a trainwreck he is.
    How are you able to tell that trump supporters are fed up?

    Pre-elections, you thought(with absolute certainty) that trump would loose; in contrast, he won

    What if you are wrong with your current assumption?

  12. #147
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    The link was actual recordings of Trump disadvowing David Duke and the KKK. As full of horse puckey infowars was, that link does prove a point that Trump really hates David Duke and the KKK from at least 20 years ago.
    Let me ask you something. What animus do you think it was the drove Trump to be the #1 proponent of the birther conspiracy theory? What were his motivations? Do you believe there is an innocent explanation in which race is not a factor?

  13. #148
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    and for Trump, the issue of David Duke has always been malleable for him. the first time he was interested in political office, he actually came in with fairly liberal views. when he ran for the Presidency this time, he very much wanted to corner the WWC vote, to include the redneck white nationalists. he disingenuously said he knew nothing about David Duke and only rebuked his support after a long period of intense political pressure, not least by his fellow Republicans.

    DE,

    Good. The man is originally from Queens, NY. Not exactly some white supremacist stronghold. His anti-immigration positions baffle me though given his New Yorker heritage. Who the heck instead was he employing in his hotels.
    he's doing it for perceived political advantage. he has no set political ideology, and pretty much agrees with whomever talked to him last. with the caveat that he won't do anything to piss off his base, whom he rightly believes voted for him as a cultural statement.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

  14. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironduke View Post
    Let me ask you something. What animus do you think it was the drove Trump to be the #1 proponent of the birther conspiracy theory? What were his motivations? Do you believe there is an innocent explanation in which race is not a factor?
    in what world does race have anything to do with it? COULD it be something a racist would do, sure.

    But prove race was a factor though, and not say, disliking the persons agenda, politics, foreign policy, domestic policy etc etc etc. or in the case of Trump, maybe doing it for the attention, ratings, and to try to prove he's the smartest guy in the room. but naaaaaa, just stick with racism.

    and this was the original comment:

    Don’t tell me you’re actually going to pretend Jeremiah Wright, someone Obama distanced himself from before declaring his intent to run for President, is someone with an influence on the man.

    Candidate Obama saying he was outraged and saddened by Wright’s comments doesn’t seem to you, maybe just a little bit, like he disagreed with Wright’s views?


    So Obamma gets a free pass and excuses get maid for his associations, yet a clip of Trump repeatedly rejecting and disavowing Duke and the like, and that's just meaningless and totally discounted.

    and yes, infowars, unless you are trying to suggest they created, doctored and edited the clip to say things that weren't actually being said by trump.

    and yet I am sure you don't see any double standard going in here....

  15. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by anil View Post
    How are you able to tell that trump supporters are fed up?

    Pre-elections, you thought(with absolute certainty) that trump would loose; in contrast, he won

    What if you are wrong with your current assumption?
    but the polls prove it!

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