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Thread: Las Vegas Oct 2017 mass shooting

  1. #46
    Senior Contributor DOR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    All started with Columbine. Guns were available before

    Any idea why these killings did not happen before Columbine
    According to Wikipedia, seven of the 20 deadliest shootings in the US since 1949 occured before Columbine (1999).
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_s..._United_States

    Maybe it was the McClure-Volkmer Act, passed in 1986?
    Trust me?
    I'm an economist!

  2. #47
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOR View Post
    According to Wikipedia, seven of the 20 deadliest shootings in the US since 1949 occured before Columbine (1999).
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_s..._United_States

    Maybe it was the McClure-Volkmer Act, passed in 1986?
    By Columbine i mean high school shooting, though i suppose the texas Uni in '66 also qualifies. The only one though

    Does it matter school or not, ts a shooting, just as bad.

    But the idea of it happening in school is what gets most people upset.

    Look, how about amending gun laws so only a certain age and above can handle them ?? arguments against, anyone ?

    I find your drinking laws quite stiff already, only 21 and above can drink ? is excessive from a euro pov.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 15 Feb 18, at 17:51.

  3. #48
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    Why haven't they secured classrooms already? Why aren't the leftist nutjobs advocating for that? I don't hear a peep out of the left for that?
    here's an attempt:

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...mental-n727221

    hmmm.


    Secure the classrooms...yes I'm all for that. Bulletproof glass at every school in the nation? Is that financial doable? Have you thought it through?
    we just passed a $1.5 trillion tax cut, so yeah, it's perfectly financially doable. it's about priorities and frankly the GOP doesn't give a sh*t about dead kids.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

  4. #49
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    I really think as a society we should listen to what this man is saying. I only found out about Park Dietz's view through WAB some time ago when another member posted posted a video of his saying essentially the same thing.

    I think this guy is spot on.

    The problem is the Media wants their 'Dirty Laundry'.

    As someone who despises the left, and often goes to FOX NEWS for 'news'. I was absolutely appalled when I hit Fox News yesterday, and my ENTIRE SCREEN blew up "17 dead". I'm thinking to myself,you idiots...your doing exactly what this guy wants, and making it 24/7 news. So the Media...both right and left are part of the problem.


  5. #50
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    Clearly the solution is to force 7+ million teachers to carry guns, whether they like it or not.
    Last edited by Ironduke; 15 Feb 18, at 18:03.

  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironduke View Post
    Clearly the solution is to force 7+ million teachers to carry guns, whether they like it or not.
    Agreed.

    Time for Teachers (leftist) to step up and take some responsibility.

    This will help them understand they only have the freedoms & liberties they do...because they are being protected by guns.

  7. #52
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    I was being sarcastic. It's the worst f-cking idea ever.

  8. #53
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironduke View Post
    I was being sarcastic. It's the worst f-cking idea ever.
    Ludicrous

    But great if you make guns. which makes me wonder is this about business or rights because the two are mutually exclusive

  9. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    here's an attempt:

    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...mental-n727221

    hmmm.

    we just passed a $1.5 trillion tax cut, so yeah, it's perfectly financially doable. it's about priorities and frankly the GOP doesn't give a sh*t about dead kids.
    And the democrats do? Why wasn't securing the classrooms implemented under the Obama administration?

    Both sides are to blame. Two party Tyranny (Uni-party)...but banning guns is not the answer.

    And yes...as a Trump voter...Trump is an idiot for signing that if it's true. Those with mental illnesses shouldn't be allowed to purchase firearms.

    Realistically, it's not going to prevent someone from with a mental illness from getting access to a gun if that's their sole intention...they will simply steal it, or buy one illegally. What happens the majority of the time is these nutjobs take the gun from a gun owner without their knowledge...many of of these gun control laws do very little. That doesn't mean we should make it easy for them to get it, especially if they have a history of medical illness.

    If Americans can find a solution like securing the classroom, and preventing deaths I'm all for it, whether or not that means guns or no guns are needed to prevent child deaths. Whatsoever can be proven to work...I will support it.

    I just don't believe less guns is the answer.

    Personally, I always feel better knowing there are 'good guys' around carrying guns in case something bad happens, or some nutjob comes along.
    Last edited by InfiniteDreams; 15 Feb 18, at 18:46.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ironduke View Post
    I was being sarcastic. It's the worst f-cking idea ever.
    I know you were....I don't think you have one post in all of WAB I agree with.

    It's pretty clear through all your posts that you are part of the leftist 'echo chamber' which permeates WAB.

  11. #56
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    As tragic as school shootings are, the chances of dying in a school shooting is probably close to the odds of dying in an airplane crash.

    Teachers, on the other hand, they're not soldiers, and they're not cops (and we know cops have a hard enough time not shooting people unnecessarily). The introduction of 7+ million guns into an educational setting would cause far more deaths than the current rate of school shootings. Teachers shooting kids, teachers shooting teachers, kids getting ahold of a teacher's gun and shooting kids/teachers, etc.

    Thousands of guns get stolen each year from even the police themselves, and yeah, I don't think things would go well where you have several million civilians possessing guns in an environment of 80 million children and young adults.

  12. #57
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    I just don't believe less guns is the answer.
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    you'll need to explain then why we aren't the safest society around then given this.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
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    you'll need to explain then why we aren't the safest society around then given this.
    For the reasons I've already laid out.

    These incidents occur 99% of the time where there isn't another gun around to fire back until the police are called at which point it's too late.

    How many attacks/deaths on police stations, Army Barracks, or Marine bases?

    These attacks occur only at places where the victims are completely defenseless.
    Last edited by InfiniteDreams; 15 Feb 18, at 19:46.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    you'll need to explain then why we aren't the safest society around then given this.
    To put a wrench in that line of thinking: Compare the French and German numbers in that chart.

    Germany at about 30%, France at about 15%. Both numbers include illegally owned weapons btw, at average estimates (20 million for Germany, 10 million for France; legal weapons are 6 million for Germany, 3 million for France). The difference though: In France 2.75 per 100,000 people, or 13.8 per 100,000 firearms die in firearms-related incidents (shot to death or committed suicide using one). In Germany the number is 1.0 per 100,000 people, or 3.15 per 100,000 firearms.

    P.S.: You really don't want to live in France and its one-seventh the per-capita guns.

    France 9.0 suicides + 4.8 homicides using firearms per 100,000 firearms
    USA 8.2 suicides + 1.8 homicides using firearms per 100,000 firearms
    Germany 2.9 suicides + 0.3 homicides using firearms per 100,000 firearms
    Last edited by kato; 15 Feb 18, at 20:05.

  15. #60
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    kato,

    To put a wrench in that line of thinking: Compare the French and German numbers in that chart.

    Germany at about 30%, France at about 15%. Both numbers include illegally owned weapons btw, at average estimates (20 million for Germany, 10 million for France; legal weapons are 6 million for Germany, 3 million for France). The difference though: In France 2.75 per 100,000 people, or 13.8 per 100,000 firearms die in firearms-related incidents (shot to death or committed suicide using one). In Germany the number is 1.0 per 100,000 people, or 3.15 per 100,000 firearms.

    P.S.: You really don't want to live in France and its one-seventh the per-capita guns.

    France 9.0 suicides + 4.8 homicides using firearms per 100,000 firearms
    USA 8.2 suicides + 1.8 homicides using firearms per 100,000 firearms
    Germany 2.9 suicides + 0.3 homicides using firearms per 100,000 firearms
    well, considering the absolute -number- of guns in the US...that also highly accelerates your overall chances. and moreover, if we're discussing mass shootings...

    here's some more graphs.

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    US gun regulations, if anything, have decreased significantly over the last 20 years (no one is going to bring up the assault weapons ban anytime soon, for instance, and that's just the federal level). correspondingly, the number of guns in the US has increased 50% over the last twenty years.

    for some reason I don't see the US as 50% safer from mass shootings.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

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