Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 16 to 30 of 30

Thread: Las Vegas Oct 2017 mass shooting

  1. #16
    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
    Join Date
    08 Aug 13
    Location
    Kansas City, United States
    Posts
    1,271
    Quote Originally Posted by citanon View Post
    Reports seem to indicate ONE bump fire stock, but multiple other guns that may have been modified for full auto.

    Bumpfiring has bad consequences for accuracy and I'd imagine would be physically very tiring. It would be difficult to maintain long sustained automatic fire bursts on a target area 500 yards away, even with the help of tripods. He kept firing for over 20 min, at one point firing 280 rounds at 90 rounds/s.

    IMO most likely setup is multiple full auto weapons on stands, with the guy alternating between the rifles to allow them to cool between firing.

    Edit: no I could be wrong. The actual reported firing rate was 280 rounds over 30 seconds, which would make for 9 rounds per second, which is doable with bump fire.
    An accurate rifle can usually put a grouping within 1 MOA and at 1200 feet 1 MOA is represented by a 4" target. I'll grant you that bump fire isn't going to be particularly accurate, but he's not shooting a 4" target either. His target was a crowd of 22,000 packed into an ~ 800' x 500' area.

    It sounds like he probably had the means to modify a firearm for full auto if he was determined to do so, but a $99 bump fire stock would be a lot less hassle on his part and might be more achievable than expensive firearm modifications if he had suddenly found himself in arrears to a Vegas casino.

    So far that's the only really plausible motive I've heard for the guy. Even that seems shaky however, since you'd think if he felt robbed by the casinos he'd direct his ire towards them rather than a crowd of concert attendees.
    Last edited by SteveDaPirate; 03 Oct 17, at 20:08.

  2. #17
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    5,970
    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    So far that's the only really plausible motive I've heard for the guy. Even that seems shaky however, since you'd think if he felt robbed by the casinos he'd direct his ire towards them rather than a crowd of concert attendees.
    Agree

    Last time we got a retiree firing it was aimed at a congressman for advocating taking away obama care.

  3. #18
    Senior Contributor
    Join Date
    13 Nov 07
    Posts
    3,559
    I think he might have been a high functioning psychopath who decided to go out with a bang.

    Maybe he lost his money, maybe he split with his girlfriend, maybe he found out he had terminal cancer. Heck, maybe he had an undiagnosed brain tumor that changed his personality.

    I suspect whatever answers we find about his motive will make no sense to normal minds.

    His father was a notorious criminal psychopath.

  4. #19
    Senior Contributor surfgun's Avatar
    Join Date
    06 Nov 09
    Location
    MD
    Posts
    1,446
    How the "H" would a tripod and a bump fire stock be compatible? When they are not.

  5. #20
    Senior Contributor
    Join Date
    13 Nov 07
    Posts
    3,559
    Quote Originally Posted by surfgun View Post
    How the "H" would a tripod and a bump fire stock be compatible? When they are not.
    Pics from the scene show bipods. Not sure if tripods was just early misreporting.

    Also no firm information on whether some of his weapons were actually full auto or not.

  6. #21
    Senior Contributor Monash's Avatar
    Join Date
    01 Mar 10
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    1,482
    Anyone care to guess how long it will take before the far right conspiracy industry starts piling in? I would say maybe 24 more hours or so - if we're lucky.

  7. #22
    Senior Contributor Bigfella's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jan 07
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    9,213
    Quote Originally Posted by Monash View Post
    Anyone care to guess how long it will take before the far right conspiracy industry starts piling in? I would say maybe 24 more hours or so - if we're lucky.
    Already happening according to people I talk to, though not just 'far right'. There is a point of detachment from reality where 'right' and 'left' cease to function as labels.


    Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

  8. #23
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    5,970
    Quote Originally Posted by Monash View Post
    Anyone care to guess how long it will take before the far right conspiracy industry starts piling in? I would say maybe 24 more hours or so - if we're lucky.
    Post some examples if you see any as i don't understand what the far right can exploit from this

    The anti-gun lobby however is going well

  9. #24
    Senior Contributor Monash's Avatar
    Join Date
    01 Mar 10
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    1,482
    Will do. FYI I was thinking along the lines of some of the poisonous Sandy Hook conspiracy theorists out there. I won't quote//link them here. You can look them up yourself if your curious.

  10. #25
    Senior Contributor
    Join Date
    12 Aug 08
    Location
    UK/Europe
    Posts
    4,150
    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    An accurate rifle can usually put a grouping within 1 MOA and at 1200 feet 1 MOA is represented by a 4" target. I'll grant you that bump fire isn't going to be particularly accurate, but he's not shooting a 4" target either. His target was a crowd of 22,000 packed into an ~ 800' x 500' area.

    It sounds like he probably had the means to modify a firearm for full auto if he was determined to do so, but a $99 bump fire stock would be a lot less hassle on his part and might be more achievable than expensive firearm modifications if he had suddenly found himself in arrears to a Vegas casino.

    So far that's the only really plausible motive I've heard for the guy. Even that seems shaky however, since you'd think if he felt robbed by the casinos he'd direct his ire towards them rather than a crowd of concert attendees.

    Perhaps less info for the next wandering nutter on the target capacity?

  11. #26
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    5,970
    Quote Originally Posted by Monash View Post
    Will do. FYI I was thinking along the lines of some of the poisonous Sandy Hook conspiracy theorists out there. I won't quote//link them here. You can look them up yourself if your curious.
    Ah, now i understand what you mean, there are people who insist the Sandy Hook school shootings never happened. Or that the official narrative is suspicious. Therefore the same pattern applies here too. The usual warning signs are there lol

    Pozner doesn't want to disclose the city where he now lives. He's had death threats and has moved several times in recent years. Leonard Pozner has been targeted because he's fought back against trolls and conspiracy theorists who make sweeping and false allegations about the murder of his son.
    Didn't realise he'd be targeted. This rings a bell for me, in India we've had three rationalists murdered over the years and i would not be surprised if the same game was at play. Getting in the way of business.

    Oh there are so many now on youtube, false flag shooting bla bla people rushing to post 'the truth' about mandalay bay etc

    In the youtube era, this nonsense will actually increase, just see the view counts and subscriber counts for the people putting this crap out. Money to be had if you have an imagination. Bulk are in english but the idea can be used in other languages for local events. It's here to stay : (

    this board was so very helpful with debunking this nonsense over ten years ago for me. These days its called fake news.

    eg


    Alt media is where its at : D
    Last edited by Double Edge; 04 Oct 17, at 16:15.

  12. #27
    Senior Contributor
    Join Date
    05 Sep 06
    Posts
    3,986
    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    Perhaps less info for the next wandering nutter on the target capacity?
    Please, there's easier ways to cause mass casualties in a crowd on a similar level without even exposing yourself.

    *points broadly at PIRA remote-controlled home-built mortar attacks*

  13. #28
    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
    Join Date
    08 Aug 13
    Location
    Kansas City, United States
    Posts
    1,271
    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    Perhaps less info for the next wandering nutter on the target capacity?
    To build on what Kato noted:

    The Las Vegas shooter was a pilot who personally owned a couple of aircraft.

    It makes me kind of sick to even imagine it, but if his only goal was to maximize the number of people he killed at the concert and didn't object to ending his life in the process, he could have taken off from McCarran International Airport (about a mile away from the concert) then immediately turned around and crashed into the crowd with a full load of fuel.

    That would have been horrific on a whole different level.

    I think what makes his attack resonate so strongly in the US is that he didn't use anything particularly exotic. Any idiot could buy a rifle from the local Wal-Mart, order a bump-fire stock with free 2 day shipping, and go shoot up a concert, rally, or county fair this weekend if they were so inclined.

    Flying planes, or building mortars or bombs would be more effective of course, but all those require some modicum of specialized knowledge and planning the average person doesn't generally possess.

    On the other hand, 10 year old kids can and do shoot rifles in the US, so imagining the crazy neighbor who lives down the block going out and killing a bunch of people no longer seems quite so far fetched.
    Last edited by SteveDaPirate; 05 Oct 17, at 20:12.

  14. #29
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
    Join Date
    11 Sep 10
    Location
    Bangalore
    Posts
    5,970
    What missing in this story is motive

    No statement. Nothing

  15. #30
    Senior Contributor Bigfella's Avatar
    Join Date
    12 Jan 07
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    9,213
    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Post some examples if you see any as i don't understand what the far right can exploit from this

    The anti-gun lobby however is going well
    This thread might provide some examples. The conspiracy theorists have got their teeth into this & are off. This stuff is all over the net already & will be creeping into Breitbart etc. soon enough (I assume Infowars has already started). Welcome to the era of just making up your own facts.


    Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. What Happens in Vegas Should Stay in Vegas
    By Shek in forum World Affairs Board Pub
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 10 Apr 09,, 06:12
  2. Replies: 26
    Last Post: 13 Apr 08,, 05:49
  3. 30 000 Brits in Las Vegas RIGHT NOW
    By Mobbme in forum World Affairs Board Pub
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 09 Dec 07,, 10:36
  4. Las Vegas
    By bonehead in forum World Affairs Board Pub
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 21 Dec 06,, 03:42

Share this thread with friends:

Share this thread with friends:

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •