View Poll Results: What is the best course of action in dealing with North Korea?

Voters
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  • Full scale preemptive military strike

    4 28.57%
  • Limited preemptive military strike

    0 0%
  • Appeasement in the form of recognition and aid

    1 7.14%
  • Strategic Patience - Neither negotiation nor military action

    9 64.29%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: The Korean Dilemma

  1. #496
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    Kim Jong-un is more insecure.

    Heavy is the head that wears the crown, the Sword of Damocles, etc. and so on.

    His father and grandfather felt more secure in their positions. Un is still just a pudgy child.
    Last edited by Ironduke; 04 Apr 18, at 01:03.

  2. #497
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Fine, but father and grandfather did not have a problem with meeting with Chinese leaders did they ? and they would have bigger reasons not to as they remember that war
    North Korea wasn't as popular as a villian as she is today. Thus, very little importance was attached to what the Kims did to North Korea. We had a 2 and a half war strategy back then. We were supposed to fight 2 big wars and a half war at the same time. In reality that meant, fighting the Soviets in both Europe and Asia and North Korea/India/Iran/Middle East were the half wars.

    The Kims, though, did managed to play Moscow against Beijing and vice-versa for military and economic aide but it was a drop in the bucket in the scheme of things.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    All changes when Kim takes over. Why is the present stance so antagonistic. There hasn't been any major development after the father passed away and son took over.
    I get the impression that KJI's henchmen were not KJU's henchmen (ie, the pro-Chinese faction) and given the mafia style government of North Korea, there can only be one top dog. So, he slaughter those who stood in his way. That didn't do the Chinese any favour as they were counting on a more stable North Korea. Instead, North Korea is more unsecured than before, now with a belicose US President willing to goto war.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Could Kim have wanted it to be that way. Unofficial and secret. Given the animosity maybe that is to be expected. It means he was unsure of the Chinese reception or its outcome. Then again he'd never go unless he knew something was to be had and he got it, Xi's support, at least for now.

    Am going with the Kim is an independent actor play here
    KJU didn't have control of the narrative. It was a Chinese narrative. That in itself speaks volume of who was in charge.

  3. #498
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    1. I would be force fed AA gun bullets at a rapid rate. Not good for me
    Tough choice. Instant painless death vs two screaming North Korean women who know how to use knifes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    2. I would be in charge of the country. Do you really want me to have nukes?
    A canon-cocker who doesn't want to cock the big gun?

  4. #499
    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    Tough choice. Instant painless death vs two screaming North Korean women who know how to use knifes.
    So 2 younger versions of my wife at the same time. I may have to rethink that.

    A canon-cocker who doesn't want to cock the big gun?
    Ooh No. I want to have a nuke. Lots of them. Nothing like a round that is warm to the touch and can do more damage than a Corps worth of guns shooting a sweep and zone

    The question is, Do YOU want me to have them?
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

  5. #500
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    Ooh No. I want to have a nuke. Lots of them. Nothing like a round that is warm to the touch and can do more damage than a Corps worth of guns shooting a sweep and zone

    The question is, Do YOU want me to have them?
    If it stops you from spreading Celine Dion pics, I will give you the nukes myself.

  6. #501
    Senior Contributor GVChamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    If it stops you from spreading Celine Dion pics, I will give you the nukes myself.
    I think I need to see the fineprint on the delivery options before agreeing to this deal....
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

  7. #502
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    So 2 younger versions of my wife at the same time.
    I was going to ask you a question. Then I realized, I'd better not.

  8. #503
    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GVChamp View Post
    I think I need to see the fineprint on the delivery options before agreeing to this deal....
    I heard it was via Next Day Air with a 50% probability of arriving within 120 m.

  9. #504
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    Gentlemen, I am not a canon-cocker. That being said, GS, watch where you step.

  10. #505
    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WABs_OOE View Post
    If it stops you from spreading Celine Dion pics, I will give you the nukes myself.
    Man I forgot about doing that. Thanks for reminding me. Been a while

    But I'll pass. Being an Engineer all you probably have are some old ADMs
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

  11. #506
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    Name:  MADM.jpg
Views: 202
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    MADMs anybody?
    We must be...increasingly on the alert to prevent them from taking over other mineshaft space, in order to breed more prodigiously than we do, thus, knocking us out in superior numbers when we emerge! Mr. President, we must not allow...a mine shaft gap!
    - General Buck Turgidson

  12. #507
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    I'm sure a North Korean warhead would be 1000-1500 miles off-target in the event of a nuclear attack on Hawaii, and that's being generous, assuming it weren't a dud in the first place, or perhaps the rocket blowing up on the launch pad strewing radioactive material in an own goal on the NK launchpad, but that being said, there's nothing wrong with Hawaii getting in the right spirit.

    Full article: https://thediplomat.com/2018/04/hawa...-aloha-spirit/
    You Say You Want a Resolution

    In the face of all the war talk last year, one Hawaii resident decided to take a different approach. Koohan Paik, a resident of Hawaii County (Big Island of Hawaii), wanted to see her own county officials show support for diplomacy with North Korea, so she wrote a resolution calling for the United States to pursue diplomacy to reduce tensions with North Korea.

    Paik’s resolution stated that a diplomatic solution “is in keeping with our islands’ most treasured ideal, that of aloha.” After public hearings in Hilo last October, the resolution was passed by Hawaii’s County Council with an 8-0 vote.

    In February, a similar resolution was introduced to the Kauai County Council by councilmember JoAnn Yukimura, the county’s former mayor. Yukimura said she also wanted her community to demonstrate its support for diplomacy with the ultimate goal of signing a peace treaty and formally bringing the Korean War to an end.

    Some council members were skeptical, but Yukimura insisted: “You never know what a difference you can make. I know it won’t make a difference if we don’t pass it.” In the end, the Kauai resolution passed unanimously.

    A third resolution followed on Maui in late March when a county councilmember Kelly T. King introduced a version which called for and hoomaluhia (peacemaking). That resolution read, in part: “…Hawaii’s strategic location in the Pacific makes the state especially vulnerable in the event of a transpacific war, and places its people in a unique position to call for peace between the United States and the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea,” the formal name for North Korea.

    King said she hopes Maui becomes part of a “larger collective voice” seeking nonviolent solutions to conflicts at every level — local, national, and international. Like the previous resolutions, Maui’s was passed unanimously, marking the third of Hawaii’s four counties to have passed such resolutions.

    In her own written testimony, Paik said, “We cannot stand by silently, and fearfully.” By first writing her own and then encouraging the other two resolutions, Paik hopes other counties in other states will follow suit. Rather than be a force for projecting military power, Paik wants Hawaii to be a force for peace and diplomacy, as she wrote, “so that true aloha can emanate from Hawaii to influence the rest of the world.”

    Aloha as a Political Strategy

    In Hawaii, security experts like Wieninger also see the political value of what is known in Hawaii as “the aloha spirit” as a value that not only means hello, goodbye, and love, but can refer to compassion, mercy, and charity. Aloha can also mean neutralizing conflict by peaceful, harmonious means.

    “The aloha spirit is a real thing that you can make work if you try,” Wieninger says, based on his own experience. He adds, “I don’t want to make it sound like it’s a magical thing that works every time but I think it is a magical thing that works sometimes.”

    The East-West Center’s Roy also mentions the aloha spirit as something Hawaii can offer the world but says, “I don’t think this would mean much to the key figures around the world who are inveterately committed to political goals for which they are willing to spill unlimited amounts of other people’s blood.”

    CSIS’s Pacific Forum President Cossa said simply, “The aloha spirit — we need a lot more of it in the world.”

    The concept of aloha has a deeper meaning, which many Kanaka Maoli — Native Hawaiians — say is an alternative to the pursuit of war.

    Speaking at the edge of a recent lava flow in the Puna district of Hawaii Island, one steward of the land named Lakea Trask said, “We can’t have peace in the world until we have peace in Hawaii. And we can’t have peace in Hawaii until we have peace with Hawaiians which means demilitarizing, healing the lands and the communities through education and the right kind of living. Hawaii is a microcosm for the world, and a beacon hopefully, for the future.”
    Last edited by Ironduke; 15 Apr 18, at 13:38.
    If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy. -Red Green

  13. #508
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    Dr. William Wieninger is an idiot. China has a limited number of ICBMs and SLBMs and nowhere close to enough nukes to blanket anything. To suggest that they can circumvent American defences ignores the fact that they don't have the money to spend on decoys. Obviously, not a China watcher and most certainly, not a weapons development watcher.

  14. #509
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    I'd only skimmed the first paragraph and did a copy-pasta.

    I edited the article down to the part regarding the Aloha Spirit. The rest of the article was clearly just filler material.
    If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy. -Red Green

  15. #510
    Former Staff Senior Contributor Ironduke's Avatar
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    More here: http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-43792658

    Mike Pompeo, CIA chief, met with North Korean leader Kim Jong-un - reports

    CIA director Mike Pompeo travelled to Pyongyang for a secret meeting with North Korean leader Kim Jong-un, US media report.

    The meeting to prepare for direct talks between US President Donald Trump and Mr Kim took place over Easter weekend, unnamed officials told the Washington Post and Reuters.

    Earlier Mr Trump acknowledged the US had held direct talks at high levels.

    He was speaking as he hosted Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe in Florida.

    "We have had direct talks at... extremely high levels," he said, adding that five locations were being considered for the Kim Jong-un meeting.

    He also said he gave his blessing for talks between South and North to discuss a peace treaty to formally end the 1950-1953 Korean War.
    What do we know about the 'secret meeting'?

    The news that Donald Trump's nominee for US Secretary of State had travelled to North Korea for a clandestine meeting with Mr Kim was first reported by The Washington Post newspaper.

    Very little is known about the talks other than that they were to prepare for the upcoming Trump-Kim summit.

    According to the paper, the meeting took place soon after Mr Pompeo was nominated as secretary of state and is attributed to two anonymous sources "with direct knowledge of the trip".

    Later the Reuters news agency said the report had been confirmed to them by senior officials.
    If the women don't find you handsome, they should at least find you handy. -Red Green

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