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Thread: US plan to improve Afghan intelligence operations branded a $457m failure

  1. #226
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    i mean we will be doing the occupying if anything goes off in India
    ???
    Anything on this I can read?

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Then the existing regime will be replaced by force. They get one shot and lose after. You believe this ? or is this another ruse. The so called negotiating with a gun pointed at one's head
    Pak nukes aren't for war-fighting. You answered it in the bold.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    When dealing with a major non-NATO, duplicit, jihad central of the world 'ally' there is no question of not trusting
    Fixed it for you. And I agree. The Americans haven't learnt their lesson, until Trump came in as POTUS. And I still reserve my doubts.

  2. #227
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    ???
    Anything on this I can read?
    If a Pak nuke goes off in India we will be occupying them

    Pak nukes aren't for war-fighting. You answered it in the bold.
    You said they will threaten to commit suicide, that is like negotiating with a gun pointed at their head. Do you see the similar pattern like with nuclear terrorism. They give this impression like the have no control somehow.

    Won't wash
    Last edited by Double Edge; 30 Jan 18, at 20:24.

  3. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    If a Pak nuke goes off in India we will be occupying them
    You read it somewhere? Source please.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    You said they will threaten to commit suicide, that is like negotiating with a gun pointed at their head. Do you see the similar pattern like with nuclear terrorism. They give this impression like the have no control somehow.

    Won't wash
    Nuclear terrorism is already happening w.r.t India and Afghanistan. Similar pattern, likely in future, if Pak is on the verge of a collapse. Cannot discount the possibilities that PA rouges would not try to encash maybe a few nukes in the black-market. Or the extremist minded PA commander would not lob some at India, when they are going down. Tactical nukes are the responsibility of battlefield commanders as I understand.

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    Ghani Refuses To Take Pakistan PMís Phone Call

    It's been a very very bloody January. RIP, poor Afghans.

  5. #230
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    You read it somewhere? Source please.
    Read it here a few pages back. Nuke goes off whether in Bombay or NYC, there will be an occupation coming. There is nothing to nuke back over there. Why should more innocents die. The regime is the primary problem and will be replaced.

    This is the price they pay for nuclear terrorism. Why will they do it. What i find weird is the fear is coming as if they made this threat. When did they do that. It is implied. Not buying it. Call their bluff.

    Do that and you start to have a way to deal with their terrorism under this supposedly nuclear umbrella. I've heard Indian Generals advocate this idea. But they don't make the decisions.

    Nuclear terrorism is already happening w.r.t India and Afghanistan. Similar pattern, likely in future, if Pak is on the verge of a collapse. Cannot discount the possibilities that PA rouges would not try to encash maybe a few nukes in the black-market. Or the extremist minded PA commander would not lob some at India, when they are going down. Tactical nukes are the responsibility of battlefield commanders as I understand.
    How long have they been on the verge of a collapse, how long have they been a failed state without failing. Why are they not held to account for their actions.

    They will go down if they lob anything at us.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 31 Jan 18, at 22:13.

  6. #231
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Ghani Refuses To Take Pakistan PM’s Phone Call

    It's been a very very bloody January. RIP, poor Afghans.
    Amrullah Saleh wonders why only Kabul burns and nothing happens in Islamabad. The Afghans are having it really bad. This will change as the ANA builds capacity.

    If the Paks want to have two hostile neighbours on their borders they will get it.

    Trump railed against a series of "atrocities" in Afghanistan and said as a result the US would not engage in any future talks with the Taliban as the administration seeks to end a stalemate in America's longest war.

    "Innocent people are being killed left and right. Bombing, in the middle of children, in the middle of families, bombing, killing all over Afghanistan," Trump said. "So we don't want to talk with the Taliban. There may be a time but it's going to be a long time."
    Trump made this decision the moment he announced they would be staying. The idea being to push the Taliban into a bruising stalemate.

    https://youtu.be/R07c0ONCEJ8
    Amrullah in Sept 2016

    Mathis certifies whether Pakistan remains a partner or not. I find he speaks the softest out of the American cabinet
    Last edited by Double Edge; 31 Jan 18, at 21:45.

  7. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Read it here a few pages back. Nuke goes off whether in Bombay or NYC, there will be an occupation coming. There is nothing to nuke back over there. Why should more innocents die. The regime is the primary problem and will be replaced.

    This is the price they pay for nuclear terrorism. Why will they do it. What i find weird is the fear is coming as if they made this threat. When did they do that. It is implied. Not buying it. Call their bluff.

    Do that and you start to have a way to deal with their terrorism under this supposedly nuclear umbrella. I've heard Indian Generals advocate this idea. But they don't make the decisions.
    Will call Pakistanís nuke bluff if tasked to cross border: Army chief

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    How long have they been on the verge of a collapse, how long have they been a failed state without failing.
    Far too long. The Pakmil and the ISI finds a way to keep the US engaged and part with billions in aid. Now it is China.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Why are they not held to account for their actions.
    Geo-strategic location. Look at China and now look at US. US is there in every continent.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    They will go down if they lob anything at us.
    I know. But I doubt they will go down if they keep lobbing terrorists.

  8. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Amrullah Saleh wonders why only Kabul burns and nothing happens in Islamabad. The Afghans are having it really bad. This will change as the ANA builds capacity.

    If the Paks want to have two hostile neighbours on their borders they will get it.
    Capacity building cannot address lone-wolf suicide attacks. What NDS can't do is track or intercept communication that is written down on paper and passed through a reliable courier. No intercept, no intelligence, except HUMINT. The ISI have devised this strategy since Osamas' escape from Tora Bora. I'm not saying it's foolproof, but it works.

    And Saleh probably means paying the Paks in kind, with terrorist attacks. I like him, he's aggressive, however many have questioned what he did when he was the chief of the NDS. Which probably means bloodhounds have no place in the Government.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Trump made this decision the moment he announced they would be staying. The idea being to push the Taliban into a bruising stalemate.

    https://youtu.be/R07c0ONCEJ8
    Amrullah in Sept 2016

    Mathis certifies whether Pakistan remains a partner or not. I find he speaks the softest out of the American cabinet
    Commanders authorised to deal with Ďsafe havensí in Afghanistan, Pakistan: US

    President Trump has said that there are no timelines to his AfPak policy, which means US is there to stay. And that local commanders can use force to deal with the shit as they see fit. No more pussy-footing.

    Given the scare-mongering in media worldwide, I laud Trump. Dude has balls. But he probably needs to think through about sending additional troops. Send in the mercenaries instead. Leak just one picture of blackwater guys cooking a dead taliban with a pigs head. This war should be psychological first. Do you remember after the 93' blasts in Mumbai, how the Mumbai police took confessions from the families of those Muslims involved. Not a nice sight, but it got them cracking the case.

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  10. #235
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    Capacity building cannot address lone-wolf suicide attacks. What NDS can't do is track or intercept communication that is written down on paper and passed through a reliable courier. No intercept, no intelligence, except HUMINT. The ISI have devised this strategy since Osamas' escape from Tora Bora. I'm not saying it's foolproof, but it works.
    Agree. Note it took several attempts during the month to build the body count up. That is a positive. This is not just one attack that gets 100+.

    The objective is make Ghani appear weak. If Ghani can't keep Kabul safe, then what good is he. There are plenty of Afghans who will understand this predicament though. I wonder at what point they decide not to support the Taliban.

    And Saleh probably means paying the Paks in kind, with terrorist attacks. I like him, he's aggressive, however many have questioned what he did when he was the chief of the NDS. Which probably means bloodhounds have no place in the Government.
    Do you have any info about his service. i only came to know abut him after he retired and he hit the talking circuit. He's angling for office.


    Commanders authorised to deal with ‘safe havens’ in Afghanistan, Pakistan: US

    President Trump has said that there are no timelines to his AfPak policy, which means US is there to stay. And that local commanders can use force to deal with the shit as they see fit. No more pussy-footing.

    Given the scare-mongering in media worldwide, I laud Trump. Dude has balls. But he probably needs to think through about sending additional troops. Send in the mercenaries instead. Leak just one picture of blackwater guys cooking a dead taliban with a pigs head. This war should be psychological first. Do you remember after the 93' blasts in Mumbai, how the Mumbai police took confessions from the families of those Muslims involved. Not a nice sight, but it got them cracking the case.
    Let's see how this works over the next few months

  11. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Agree. Note it took several attempts during the month to build the body count up. That is a positive. This is not just one attack that gets 100+.

    The objective is make Ghani appear weak. If Ghani can't keep Kabul safe, then what good is he. There are plenty of Afghans who will understand this predicament though. I wonder at what point they decide not to support the Taliban.
    I think the objective is to give a big F to President Trump for his AfPak policies by the Pak Army and the ISI, saying look 'without our co-operation, you're doomed'. And make Ghani look weak as you have said. And in all honesty, nobody can keep Kabul safe, until Pak is bombed backed to the stone age. I sincerely hope Ghani doesn't became weak like how Karzai was and fall in ISI' trap.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Do you have any info about his service. i only came to know abut him after he retired and he hit the talking circuit. He's angling for office.
    Tajik, born in Panjshir in 1971. Was trained in Pak as a mujahideen and fought against the Soviets, under Ahmad Shah Massoud. In 1990s he was the member of the United Front (Northern Alliance) when he went onto Dushanbe to lead UFs' international liaison office, where he made contacts with numerous intelligence agencies. Was head of NDS from 2004 till 2010, when he quit after a failed terrorist attack. His relationship with Karzai started to slip, as he saw Karzai fall into the trap of ISI who wanted to accommodate his Taliban brothers in peace talks. Oh, and that failed terrorist attack was also an ISI ploy to get him off the NDS. Enemy #1 for the ISI when he was in office. 4 years before OBLaden was killed, he alongwith Karzai went to meet Musharraf, where he told Musharraf the location of Laden in Manshera, some miles from Abottabad. Musharraf got angry and retorted if he was the President of a banana republic. He is highly rated by foreign intelligence agencies, and is considered a clean, patriot who dreams of a pluralistic free Afghanistan. He is a minister for security reforms under Ghani now. This guy hates the Paks so much, that given an opportunity he would chew all 200 million of them without needing any acidity stabilizer. He also founded a political party called the Green Trend. I forgot many things I read years back, but many articles are open source.

  12. #237
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oracle View Post
    I think the objective is to give a big F to President Trump for his AfPak policies by the Pak Army and the ISI, saying look 'without our co-operation, you're doomed'. And make Ghani look weak as you have said. And in all honesty, nobody can keep Kabul safe, until Pak is bombed backed to the stone age. I sincerely hope Ghani doesn't became weak like how Karzai was and fall in ISI' trap.
    Ghani tried with his first two years so continued Karzai's policy. Didn't work. He's not going down that route again. Washington & Kabul are on the same page


    Tajik, born in Panjshir in 1971. Was trained in Pak as a mujahideen and fought against the Soviets, under Ahmad Shah Massoud. In 1990s he was the member of the United Front (Northern Alliance) when he went onto Dushanbe to lead UFs' international liaison office, where he made contacts with numerous intelligence agencies. Was head of NDS from 2004 till 2010, when he quit after a failed terrorist attack. His relationship with Karzai started to slip, as he saw Karzai fall into the trap of ISI who wanted to accommodate his Taliban brothers in peace talks. Oh, and that failed terrorist attack was also an ISI ploy to get him off the NDS. Enemy #1 for the ISI when he was in office. 4 years before OBLaden was killed, he alongwith Karzai went to meet Musharraf, where he told Musharraf the location of Laden in Manshera, some miles from Abottabad. Musharraf got angry and retorted if he was the President of a banana republic. He is highly rated by foreign intelligence agencies, and is considered a clean, patriot who dreams of a pluralistic free Afghanistan. He is a minister for security reforms under Ghani now. This guy hates the Paks so much, that given an opportunity he would chew all 200 million of them without needing any acidity stabilizer. He also founded a political party called the Green Trend. I forgot many things I read years back, but many articles are open source.
    Part i wanted to know was

    many have questioned what he did when he was the chief of the NDS

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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Ghani tried with his first two years so continued Karzai's policy. Didn't work. He's not going down that route again. Washington & Kabul are on the same page
    It's a tough job in Kabul. Ghani is soft. He sent the NDS head to Pak with proof of Pak complicity in the recent bombings. Twitter screamed at him to go to the UNSC or go home. There's still time for both Washington and Kabul to converge on mutual interests. And mutual interests is what both haven't agreed to yet.

    Afghan spy agency points finger at Pakistan for Kabul hotel bombing

    Dostums loyalty still has a selling price. He knows how to maneuver and be with the winning side since the Soviet war.

    Pakistan Army supplied military equipment to LeT in Kashmir: Afghan envoy to the US

    Indian policymakers need to open up to their counterparts in the UK, in clear terms, that transactions with terrorist regimes will be seen as an act against India, and hence retaliated.

    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Part i wanted to know was
    Yes, I missed it in hurry. Spooks have 9 lives and much of it is hidden. I know what's in the public domain. He hates Paks and vice-versa. Too many articles and insights. But he did kill many, with pride he said once. That will be the Taliban, Al-Qaida, Pakmil and ISI. Part of the ire directed to him, indirectly, asked him if Afghanistan retaliated when he was the NDS boss. I say highly probable. Pak is notorious for hiding casualties. Loyalty in Afghanistan can be bought, not Saleh. He's from the Massoud camp.
    Last edited by Oracle; 02 Feb 18, at 16:30.

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    The Pak Army and the ISI are butchering the Afghan people and trying to force the US into peace talks.

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    Look what I found, Pakistan's Gesture Is Less Than Meets the Eye

    there was NO military operation to release Caitlan Coleman and her family. This was a negotiated handover.
    Haqqani, who is now a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute, added that the hostage release “raises questions about the competence of Pakistani intelligence” in finding people within its borders or in the tribal areas near it.

    This is an intelligence service who behaves like the KGB or the Stasi with its own citizens who dissent, and is able to harass them and find there everywhere and anywhere, but is totally unable to find bin Laden when he is located in Pakistan or to find the home where a family is being kept hostage for five years,” he said.
    But Haqqani was dismissive of the idea. “This is really typical of Pakistani intelligence services behavior,” he said. “Whenever the heat gets too much, they deliver something to raise American hopes. ... It has happened enough times in the last 20 years for people to be cynical.
    WTF? And the USGov still tolerates this duplicitous country?

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