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Thread: Ex-FBI Director Mueller appointed DOJ Special Counsel

  1. #751
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    rj1,



    i'm rather more ambivalent about this. i'm inclined to agree, because impeachment requires a pretty large number of "defections" especially if the majority party is in charge, but there's some factors within the Democratic Party that clearly makes it less "disciplined" than the Republican Party.

    IE, look at the number of Dems publicly stating how they want to throw Nancy Pelosi overboard. not because of misconduct, but simply because the Republicans have made her an effective boogeymonster and an easy synonym for "SF liberal". there's no equivalent with the Republicans-- if anything, when Republicans talk about kicking someone out, it's because they're "not conservative enough".
    The Democrats wanting to throw Pelosi overboard is 1.) the Democratic Party leadership are stale and old, look at the ages of everyone in the House party leadership, that's just generational, 2.) if Pelosi does not run for reelection for the 2019 House (there's not going to be a contested election that she will lose, she'll either win or "retire"), she will have led the House Democrats for 16 years, 3.) it's not full on like the Tea Party's internecine warfare with the Republicans has been, but there's a segment of liberals/people on the left that are just pissed off with the Democratic Party, and Crowley's loss in New York was a symbol of that; I'm not sure that has much legs outside of certain narrowly drawn districts like the Bronx and Queens

  2. #752
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOR View Post
    I may be overreacting, but it is starting to sound like some people around here have lost faith in the separation of powers design. The idea that we need a constitutional convention, for example, suggests that the 240+ year old governing structure is so far gone that it should be chucked out and we should start all over.

    I disagree.

    Asking a nation that can’t be bothered to register to vote in large numbers, let alone actually casting a ballot, to comprehend something as complex as a constitutional convention is just silly. If people don’t care enough to get involved, why in the world would they be excited – in the overwhelming numbers necessary – to hand ultimate power over to a group of unknown, untested, unrestricted political activists?

    Don’t fool yourselves into thinking “We The People” are going to be the majority at such a convention. It will be the same career politicians that run every aspect of political life. The difference will be just one thing: unlimited power.

    That’s why I am dumbfounded by the so-called conservatives calling for a constitutional convention. The idea of giving that much power to that kind of group should scare the pants off them.
    1.) It's not a constitutional convention. It's a convention for calling amendments.
    2.) I do agree with the separation of powers. The separation of powers has been progressively worn down to the point of broken over the past 80 years. The executive, all of which is unelected outside of the president and vice-president, has become so powerful compared to the legislative.
    3.) People at the convention will not have ultimate power. First, anything they pass has to get a majority of people present, than 38 out of 50 state legislatures (all of which are bicameral except for Nebraska) also have to pass it in order for it to become law. To decry this as terrible is to lack fundamental belief in representative democracy.
    4.) There is precedent of acknowledgement that representatives can't do a job and they need to have other means to get law passed - the repeal of prohibition bypassed state legislatures and they had special ratifying conventions called.

  3. #753
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    Quote Originally Posted by DOR View Post
    rj1,

    Take a moment.
    Reflect on what's gone on.
    Ask yourself one question: Is what I think I believe about Hillary Clinton based on fact, or is it the swirling mix of Russian propaganda, GOPer dirty tricks and echo chamber social media?
    Let's go pre-2016 election.

    Whitewater in Arkansas
    the fact her husband while governor and president under 2018 eyes committed mass sexual harassment with his interns for years, and Hillary looked the other way because that was best for her political career
    "vast right-wing conspiracy"
    politicized the First Lady's Office, which has no standard or bearing in U.S. Law, the fact the First Lady has a budget and staff has all the markings of monarchialism and it should be defunded regardless of which party is holding the White House
    carpetbagged into New York when her time as First Lady ended because she was guaranteed to win a Senator seat there
    stories from Politico and other non-Trump established media mouthpieces of essentially spying on her staff because she was so paranoid they were sharing info, this is incredibly Nixonian
    compared to her husband an absolutely horrendous debater, she tried to be for everything while not committing to anything, the chink in her armor that pretty much gave Obama the opening against her in the 2008 primaries was when Chris Dodd pushed back on her on drivers' licenses for immigrants
    was given the Secretary of State office by Obama to just shut her up and make peace in an intra-party civil war, I'll let conservative satirist P.J. O'Rourke sum up her performance from March 2014:

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/pj-oro...well-was-right

    Then Came Hillary Clinton Who, as Secretary of State, Traveled to 112 Countries…

    Which makes for an interesting point of comparison with some of America’s other famous diplomats.

    William Seward…

    The Secretary of State under Presidents Abraham Lincoln and Andrew Johnson skinned the guy who used to have Putin’s job (Czar Alexander II—he was assassinated). Seward bought Alaska for 2 cents an acre. Plus, he crafted the Lyons-Seward Treaty, joining the U.S and Great Britain in suppressing the international slave trade. Seward never, to my knowledge, went anywhere. He stayed home and got some work done.

    The Same for John Hay…

    Secretary of State under Presidents William McKinley and Theodore Roosevelt. Without leaving town, he negotiated the end of the Spanish-American War and the treaties making the Panama Canal possible, and he authored the “Open Door Policy” that prevented China from being divvied up by Japan and the European colonial powers. (P.S. His boss Teddy won the Nobel Peace Prize for doing something—making peace between Japan and Russia.)

    Charles Frances Adams…

    Lincoln’s ambassador to the Court of St. James almost single-handedly kept Great Britain from allying with the Confederacy during the Civil War. He went to just one country, Great Britain, to do it.

    And Robert R. Livingston…

    President Thomas Jefferson’s ambassador to France traveled only to France. He came back with the Louisiana Purchase.
    when she realized she lost the election, she didn't go up on stage to concede, she sent John Podesta out; if Trump had done that, the media would have rightly excoriated him for being a coward, Hillary escaped that treatment
    and then, in another incredibly Nixonian thing, the Democrats reported by Politico and some other Washington news sources, had their post-election loss autopsy, and the Clinton national campaign people refused to take any blame or hear anything negative about their performance, the state party-level chairs were incredulous and reported to the news people "are you effing kidding me!?!"

    It's not a good thing for the United States of America that Donald Trump became President. The reason Donald Trump is President is the Democratic Party's nominee for President had been on the national stage since 1992 and Americans absolutely hated her. It's not just Republicans, a lot of Democrats hated her too. The Obama 2008 primary voters hated her and so do the Sanders 2016 voters.

    I've never been a Democrat by any stretch of the imagination and I hated Trump, but I hated Hillary too. If Hillary withdrew, had a stroke or heartattack, or got shot pre-November 2016 and Kaine became the nominee, I would have had no problem voting for Kaine and he more likely than not would be President right now (the same scenario is true for Pence, at least as far as my voting).
    Last edited by rj1; 13 Aug 18, at 13:29.

  4. #754
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    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    I wasn't around much + foreigners from nations who won't be enforcing said red line don't have particularly worthwhile opinions.
    Those who draw lines are responsible for enforcing them. If I someday say to my daughter "No more sweets before supper" and she ignores me it is not the responsibility of others to chastise her.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Up to the people making the claim to prove that Russia changed the election results/hacked election machines.
    Just about every part of your Government has said so - apart from Trumpkin. Last weekend Coates and Co all came out one after another and said yes Moscow did and is continuing to actively interfere, then Trumpkin says "Russia's a hoax." It cannot be both ways. When you get to a defence of "I did not collude with an enemy and even if I did collusion is not a crime" you are nigh on saying breaking the law is not illegal.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Democrats are turning Russia into a far more capable and threatening nation than it could dream of being in the hopes of explaining away the loss of the Rust Belt.
    Trumpkin and his willingness is the one making a Moscow a major issue. All his insane tarrif wars against allies and adversaries alike are creating a greater rust belt.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    LOL, more fakery.
    You know Trumpkin first went to Moscow in 1987 right? Expenses payed trip courtesy of the good ole USSR. And you think they never taped him? All Western correspondents (such a Luke Harding for example) were fair game but Trumpkin they never bothered?

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    People trot out the "opinion" of Europeans when they intend to insult American people, I and millions of others simply don't care what Europeans think.
    I repeat; is a nation stronger with allies or without them?

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Germany is meanwhile building a pipeline to get Russian gas cheaper...
    Nice whataboutism try. So because there are traitors in Germany it is ok for Trumpkin to be a traitor? No; two wrongs do not make a right.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Millions, who vote for both political parties, could care less about the Ukraine and Eastern Europe in general. Barry, and his base, shrugged off Putin taking the Crimea. You are a foreigner who is mad that two American Presidents representing two different electoral bases haven't been prepared to go to war over which third world nation runs which abandoned factory town.
    Do they care about their own election being attacked or having a traitor as President? Seems you don't but then you idolise dictators.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Drive to the Crimea, please go there and fight some Russians.
    No need - plenty to kill in Donbass would be better to just let it drain Moscow's resources until they are bankrupt. $6bn for a bridge that one missile can take out... no $6bn to save a dwarfs image so his occupation of Crimea does not look like the miserable self inflicted wound it was.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Silly to cry and scream that any American who doesn't believe that they were put here on Earth go to work in the morning so other people can flush their tax dollars down Eastern Europe, the Middle East, or any other region should go live in Russia.
    How you spend your money is not my issue. That you appear to idolise dictators but do nothing about your convictions other than snipe at others who do (and the thousands who have died for it) disgusts me. If you do not have the balls to act for your convictions you do not have the right to criticise those who do.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Deficits are bi-partisan.
    Increasing the debt during an upturn in the economic cycle is not.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Trump was voted in with people knowing he wasn't an Evangelical.
    Pretty sure "nobody reads the Bible more than" Trumpkin - it's what "stable genius's" do no? Nor by the would it be acceptable for the Polish or Ukrainian Presidents - or a British PM or German Chancellor - to be found to have payed off a string of very dubious Lady's over affairs, let alone approach a Lady by grabbing her private parts - nor lie so consistently. The Romanians have been out on the streets the last two nights calling for their Government to resign over corruption. We do not put with it. You on the hand endorse it by cheering on a traitor.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    We have a long way to go before we wake up the Ukraine or Russia.
    Emoluements? Wilbur Ross? Who was the latest one arrested for insider trading or something? Betsy DeVos's yacht? Scott Pruit? Why can't Trumpkin release his tax returns if he so clean? Flynn and Turkey? Kushner loans? Trumpkin money laudering? Manafort money laundering? Cohen? Not so far to go...

  5. #755
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    BEDMINSTER, New Jersey (The Borowitz Report)—Blasting his former colleague Omarosa Manigault, Donald J. Trump said on Monday that “the White House is no place for a lying lowlife from a reality show.”

    “People were impressed by Omarosa because they saw her on a TV show,” Trump told reporters from his golf course in Bedminster, New Jersey. “Well, I’ve got news for you: being on a reality show does not qualify you to work in the government.”
    https://www.newyorker.com/humor/boro...m-reality-show

    Think most of us had worked out.

  6. #756
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    You know Trumpkin first went to Moscow in 1987 right? Expenses payed trip courtesy of the good ole USSR. And you think they never taped him? All Western correspondents (such a Luke Harding for example) were fair game but Trumpkin they never bothered?
    More BS from you, produce a tape. "If I say it cryptically in the form of a question he can't call me a liar."

    Those who draw lines are responsible for enforcing them. If I someday say to my daughter "No more sweets before supper" and she ignores me it is not the responsibility of others to chastise her.
    The people footing the bill had no interest in enforcing it.

    Nice whataboutism try. So because there are traitors in Germany it is ok for Trumpkin to be a traitor? No; two wrongs do not make a right.
    Treason is a legal matter, Trump has not been found or seriously accused of treason.

    Meanwhile the NATO members who can afford a military seem to care less about the matter.

    No need - plenty to kill in Donbass would be better to just let it drain Moscow's resources until they are bankrupt. $6bn for a bridge that one missile can take out... no $6bn to save a dwarfs image so his occupation of Crimea does not look like the miserable self inflicted wound it was.
    Buy a bus ticket over there.

    I repeat; is a nation stronger with allies or without them?
    Citing pretentious Europeans who feel good by thinking they can look down on us, doesn't mean a damn thing.

    Do they care about their own election being attacked or having a traitor as President? Seems you don't but then you idolise dictators.
    He isn't a traitor, and the millions of people who voted for him are quite happy with him and ready for a second term.

    Pretty sure "nobody reads the Bible more than" Trumpkin - it's what "stable genius's" do no? Nor by the would it be acceptable for the Polish or Ukrainian Presidents - or a British PM or German Chancellor - to be found to have payed off a string of very dubious Lady's over affairs, let alone approach a Lady by grabbing her private parts - nor lie so consistently. The Romanians have been out on the streets the last two nights calling for their Government to resign over corruption. We do not put with it. You on the hand endorse it by cheering on a traitor.
    Trump allegedly banging a hooker comes as a surprise to no one, perfectly in character. Dealt with by a shrug of the shoulders and made good with the selection of conservative justices for the SC.

    How you spend your money is not my issue. That you appear to idolise dictators but do nothing about your convictions other than snipe at others who do (and the thousands who have died for it) disgusts me. If you do not have the balls to act for your convictions you do not have the right to criticise those who do.
    I, and millions of others, don't want America involved in that nonsense, there is no lack of "balls" for me travelling the world having a good time while paying my taxes and taking part in elections. You LARP on WAB about "fighting Putin," while staying on your keyboard. It's not sniping, you don't do shit and won't do shit. Years of whining every day about evil Putin, and you haven't done a thing but waste bandwidth on the internet. Your daily propaganda sucks (on the level of crappy Russian Facebook ads), you sure aren't prepared to go stab a Russian. You make up meetings with imaginary officials and Trump seks tapes to brag on an open forum, but at the end of the day it's a rather pitiful Walter Mitty job. You are a fake.

    WAB went from M21 and Gunnut down to some Russian woman screeching about Putin and how much she hates that America elected Trump. Reading your crap makes me want to go back in time and vote for him again, thus convincing me you are a Russian bot.

    MAGA
    Last edited by troung; Yesterday at 00:31.
    To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

  7. #757
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    I think most had figured out it's something called "satire". Something tells me you're not among them. Funny though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    More BS from you, produce a tape. "If I say it cryptically in the form of a question he can't call me a liar."
    I know a tape exists. It is not mine to produce. Nor did I ask a cryptic question; do you believe the Muscovites never taped even a conversation with Trumpkin?

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    The people footing the bill had no interest in enforcing it.
    Obama had no interest in enforcing his 'red line'.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Treason is a legal matter, Trump has not been found or seriously accused of treason.
    I could make a decent case that he is guilty of "adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort." I mean "Russia if you're listening..." is just a starter there.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Meanwhile the NATO members who can afford a military seem to care less about the matter.
    If you are still speaking of North Stream 2 the Danes have rejected the planned route. Nor do I think it would be wise for Poland and others who disagree with the project to invade Germany to stop it as that plays into Moscows hands.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Buy a bus ticket over there.
    You do not fight across a narrow isthmus; you cut off a peninsular.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Citing pretentious Europeans who feel good by thinking they can look down on us, doesn't mean a damn thing.
    I am not citing any "pretentious Europeans"; merely asking your opinion: Is a nation (any nation) stronger with allies or without? Third time lucky?

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    He isn't a traitor, and the millions of people who voted for him are quite happy with him and ready for a second term.
    Just did alot of good business with Muscovites but "never had anything to do with Moscow" and "no contacts"?

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    Trump allegedly banging a hooker comes as a surprise to no one, perfectly in character. Dealt with by a shrug of the shoulders and made good with the selection of conservative justices for the SC.
    Presumably not the Ladies in Moscow though right? I assume he read the bible to them rather than 'banging' them being such a bible reader - the best bible reader no doubt - he is.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    You LARP on WAB about "fighting Putin," while staying on your keyboard. It's not sniping, you don't do shit and won't do shit.
    I have seen the front since late 2014 on a regular basis (barring maternity leave). Come visit if you dare. But I dare say Ukraine is the wrong side for you to visit? You'd prefer a country where people are imprisoned for a facebook 'like'.

    Quote Originally Posted by troung View Post
    thus convincing me you are a Russian bot.
    Rofl. I am Polish Ukrainian; check a map. The usual resort of those who cannot face serious questions is to attack the questioner personally. It demeans the person throwing the insults in my view but you could not go much lower in my opinion already so whatever... just more spout from a dictator lover with no defence.

    Look you are free to disparage my country and President all you wish - on our President I might often agree with you. I did not disparage your country or you - merely your President. If Poroshenko clearly lied I would get acknowledge it no problem; if the Polish Government (that I sadly voted for) does stupid things I have no problem acknowledging it. But for you Trumpkin can do no wrong despite all the clearly proven lies about no business and no contacts with Muscovy. When you are not willing to accept the facts because of your prejudices toward Moscow then we have no basis on which discuss facts. Go to Moscow - have the courage of your convictions. Or come visit us in Ukraine. Until you do one you are just words and I will waste no more time on you. I wish you well.

  9. #759
    A Self Important Senior Contributor troung's Avatar
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    I know a tape exists. It is not mine to produce. Nor did I ask a cryptic question; do you believe the Muscovites never taped even a conversation with Trumpkin?
    You are making this up, as always. It's a larp job to hope to impress people here with your "being in the know." Produce your tape or you are a liar.

    am not citing any "pretentious Europeans"; merely asking your opinion: Is a nation (any nation) stronger with allies or without? Third time lucky?
    You stated Europeans and the world (does that include Zimbabwe?) were laughing at us: I stated I, and millions of others, simply don't care. You regurgitated a stupid statement.

    I have seen the front since late 2014 on a regular basis (barring maternity leave). Come visit if you dare. But I dare say Ukraine is the wrong side for you to visit? You'd prefer a country where people are imprisoned for a facebook 'like'.
    I will file that away with your Trump tapes, a lie.

    Next year you will tell us the time you had Putin in your sights but didn't pull the trigger because you didn't want to let him and his russoxhekistmafia off so easy.
    But for you Trumpkin can do no wrong despite all the clearly proven lies about no business and no contacts with Muscovy.
    I think he makes mistakes, but not over the stuff you get hysterical over.
    could make a decent case that he is guilty of "adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort." I mean "Russia if you're listening..." is just a starter there.
    You cannot make that case, you are physically able to blindly spout crap off but that doesn't establish a case for treason.

    Presumably not the Ladies in Moscow though right? I assume he read the bible to them rather than 'banging' them being such a bible reader - the best bible reader no doubt - he is
    He is about to get a second Supreme court pick, few of his voters care about a washed up hooker.

    Please produce the tapes.

    You do not fight across a narrow isthmus; you cut off a peninsular.
    Get a bus ticket there then, make sure to mail the tape to CNN.

    . I did not disparage your country or you - merely your President. If Poroshenko clearly lied I would get acknowledge it no problem; if the Polish Government (that I sadly voted for) does stupid things I have no problem acknowledging it. But for you Trumpkin can do no wrong despite all the clearly proven lies about no
    You screech regularly and for some years have been angry that the American public has elected people who have no interest in which third world nation owns what wheat field or abandoned moonshine still and make up stories to make yourself seem like a well-connected anti-Putin warrior. The shtick is old.

    Now about that tape.

    Go to Moscow - have the courage of your convictions. Or come visit us in Ukraine. Until you do one you are just words and I will waste no more time on you. I wish you well.
    I could care less and want my nation to stay out so I should punish myself and move to the Ukraine or Russia? Foolish line of reasoning.
    Obama had no interest in enforcing his 'red line
    He didn't have the votes in Congress or the public support. And life went on, one of his better decisions.
    Rofl. I am Polish Ukrainian; check a map. The usual resort of those who cannot face serious questions is to attack the questioner personally. It demeans the person throwing the insults in my view but you could not go much lower in my opinion already so whatever... just more spout from a dictator lover with no defence
    Transparently fake stuff about Trump seks tapes that you have access to, irritating screeching on wab, spouting russia level propganda, and a comment wishing harm on our president. Something is off or you are just a miserable propagandist.

    You are a fake, at best a third worlder on an internet forum trying to show off through ever increasing lies. Nazi kin and fake seks tapes, God what have we come to.
    Last edited by troung; Yesterday at 16:42.
    To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

  10. #760
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    Come to Ukraine. You think I am liar but I am in Ukraine. Will you come to visit? Will you answer a question? No. Just a bag of wind like your President.
    Last edited by snapper; Yesterday at 18:08.

  11. #761
    A Self Important Senior Contributor troung's Avatar
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    Come to Ukraine. You think I am liar but I am in Ukraine. Will you come to visit? Will you answer a question? No. Just a bag of wind like your President.
    I don't need to go there for you to produce tapes.

    We had a fake Canadian general here once who insulted OOE (turned out to be a Russian sock puppet), we have had waves of Chinese bots, and now there is you Putin's mortal nemesis a fake Ukrainian spy-commando who has Trump tapes and churns out low quality propaganda so irritating it makes one cheer the other side...

    Now let's see that UkroPole sekstaype, I wanna see the emperor getting spanked like a dirty toddlerbodybillionare.

    WalterMitty.MAGAchekistmafia
    Last edited by troung; Yesterday at 21:32.
    To sit down with these men and deal with them as the representatives of an enlightened and civilized people is to deride ones own dignity and to invite the disaster of their treachery - General Matthew Ridgway

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    I never said I had the tape; I said I knew one existed. Nor am or was I ever whatever a "spy-commando" and never said I was. But misconstrue away and insult me all and my family all you; had worse from teachers at school. But like all your ilk when you cannot answer a question, explain why your "MAGA" President so completely lied time after time about his links and meetings with Moscow you resort to insulting the person asking the question... You cannot win the argument because all the facts are against you. If you wish to trade insults find another schoolboy.

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