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Thread: The battle of Brexit!

  1. #1591
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post


    Well I know Ramsgate harbour quite well and the Goodwin sands tend to drift into it. At low tides you sometimes get sandbanks in the outer part of the old harbour. You can tie your yacht up and scrape and antifoul it if you hurry before the tide floats you off again. It will need 24/7 dredging to get ferries through the commercial port as they had the last time when a company called Sally ran a service from there. They were some Scandanavian company I think because they apparently did a Smorgasboard eat all you want deal and people would just go on a day trip for the Smorgasboard alone (plus french wine and cheese etc) that became part of local folklore almost. At one time I believe there was even a hovercraft service from the bay just south of Ramsgate harbour. All went bust. The sands were still filling the harbour last time I was there. Not the wisest idea.
    Just spotted this one. Absolute classic Remain negativity. The UK isn't just the South East. Its an Island with many points of entry. The investment at Liverpools transatlantic hub by Peel is an engineering master stroke and yet it gets no coverage from the likes of Channel 4 News or the BBC.





    The extension at Liverpool2 costing almost half a billion pounds can accommodate two 13,500 TEU post-Panamax vessels simultaneously. Giving business's in the North direct access to global supply routes and alleviating traffic from motorways that otherwise would dock at Southampton or felixstowe. Over half the containers coming to the UK end up closer to Liverpool than Felixstowe or Southampton.

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    Peels investment plans don't just stop there...Liverrpool2 phase 2 is due to open this year...Maybe somebody at Channel 4 news should wake up and investigate!!

  2. #1592
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freyr View Post
    Yeh thats what I said cloth ears...God some people
    Quote Originally Posted by Freyr View Post
    Ridiculous!..You can hardly expect him to appear in front of a select committee when the electoral commision are investigating him.
    So "can hardly expect to appear in front of a select committee" actually means "he did appear in front of a select committee"?

  3. #1593
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    Liverpool does not handle half as much shipping as Dover and the Channel Tunnel. In 2017 Dover handled 2.6m lorries and over 11m passengers amounting trade worth £122bn. In the event that all freight requires custom checks at Dover and the tunnel, say it is only 10 mins for each truck, a substantial backup would occur on the motorway leading to Dover (the M2 from memory) creating upto 30 miles of what would basically be a motorway lorry park.

    So the previous Government looked at alternatives such stacking the backed up trucks at Manston airport which is just inland from Ramsgate. Manston is not in use as an airport but is being sold off for housing development. They also considered re-opening Ramsgate to carry freight. Ramsgate harbour is owned by the local authority (Thanet District Council) but the then Secretary of State for Trade, the Honourable (and imbecilic) Chris Grayling, put out a tender to operate a freight service from Ramsgate awarding £42.5m to Danish shipping firm DFDS, and £13.8m to British firm Seaborne Freight, to provide additional cross-channel freight capacity in case of a "no-deal" Brexit on 29 March 2019. It then transpired that Seaborne Freight had never operated a ferry service and did not own a rowboat let alone any ships. Further details revealed that the CEO of Seaborne Freight had run a chartering service which went bankrupt and still owed tax. The company that owned Seaborne Freight then pulled out and the whole Ramsgate plan was dropped.

    That was not the end though... It turned out that the original tender for these contracts to reopen Ramsgate for freight had not been entirely correctly carried out and Eurotunnel, who run the Channel tunnel sued the Department of Transport alleging that the tender process had been "secretive and flawed." That was settled out of court with Eurotunnel getting £33m. A further £28m was payed out when the UK did not leave the EU in March. So Grayling spent over £100m to accomplish sweet nothing.

  4. #1594
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    Liverpool does not handle half as much shipping as Dover and the Channel Tunnel. In 2017 Dover handled 2.6m lorries and over 11m passengers amounting trade worth £122bn. In the event that all freight requires custom checks at Dover and the tunnel, say it is only 10 mins for each truck, a substantial backup would occur on the motorway leading to Dover (the M2 from memory) creating upto 30 miles of what would basically be a motorway lorry park.

    So the previous Government looked at alternatives such stacking the backed up trucks at Manston airport which is just inland from Ramsgate. Manston is not in use as an airport but is being sold off for housing development. They also considered re-opening Ramsgate to carry freight. Ramsgate harbour is owned by the local authority (Thanet District Council) but the then Secretary of State for Trade, the Honourable (and imbecilic) Chris Grayling, put out a tender to operate a freight service from Ramsgate awarding £42.5m to Danish shipping firm DFDS, and £13.8m to British firm Seaborne Freight, to provide additional cross-channel freight capacity in case of a "no-deal" Brexit on 29 March 2019. It then transpired that Seaborne Freight had never operated a ferry service and did not own a rowboat let alone any ships. Further details revealed that the CEO of Seaborne Freight had run a chartering service which went bankrupt and still owed tax. The company that owned Seaborne Freight then pulled out and the whole Ramsgate plan was dropped.

    That was not the end though... It turned out that the original tender for these contracts to reopen Ramsgate for freight had not been entirely correctly carried out and Eurotunnel, who run the Channel tunnel sued the Department of Transport alleging that the tender process had been "secretive and flawed." That was settled out of court with Eurotunnel getting £33m. A further £28m was payed out when the UK did not leave the EU in March. So Grayling spent over £100m to accomplish sweet nothing.
    Exactly the point ..its a future investment..thought I wouldn't need to explain that. The UK had historically since the 70's and before been very reluctant to invest for the long term. Peel are not that, theY ACTUALLY THINK LONG TERM! and the Uk it would seem are now looking elsewhere for trade. Also they are looking at entry points and considering congestion etc. Have you looked at the Manchester ship canal project? Its progressive and makes perfect sense.. This is one of many infrastructure projects that are happening NOW... So yes of course Dover etc are higher at present in terms of gross tonnage but the future is elsewhere now and people need to play catch up!

  5. #1595
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    So "can hardly expect to appear in front of a select committee" actually means "he did appear in front of a select committee"?
    You bigging up Dominic Cummings doesn't make him in charge of Boris, Highly unlikely wouldn't you say?

  6. #1596
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freyr View Post
    Exactly the point ..its a future investment..thought I wouldn't need to explain that. The UK had historically since the 70's and before been very reluctant to invest for the long term. Peel are not that, theY ACTUALLY THINK LONG TERM! and the Uk it would seem are now looking elsewhere for trade. Also they are looking at entry points and considering congestion etc. Have you looked at the Manchester ship canal project? Its progressive and makes perfect sense.. This is one of many infrastructure projects that are happening NOW... So yes of course Dover etc are higher at present in terms of gross tonnage but the future is elsewhere now and people need to play catch up!
    Right... Grayling's 'long term investment' didn't work out too well.

  7. #1597
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    grrr

  8. #1598
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freyr View Post
    You bigging up Dominic Cummings doesn't make him in charge of Boris, Highly unlikely wouldn't you say?
    How was I "bigging up Cummings"? I was not. You are just too scared to admit your self contradiction.

    Seems Mr Cummings received £230m in EU grants for his farm. Bit like Farage who refused to give up his EU pension; for these people it is do as I say not as I do.
    Last edited by snapper; 11 Aug 19, at 07:16.

  9. #1599
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    dble

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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    Right... Grayling's 'long term investment' didn't work out too well.
    You'll have to expand on that, But I think you mean Chris Grayling....I'm not a big fan of Governments throwing money at schemes although I can see they have to be involved at some level..Just don't think they're very good at getting the best value...

  11. #1601
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    How was I "bigging up Cummings"? I was not. You are just too scared to admit your self contradiction.

    Seems Mr Cummings received £230m in EU grants for his farm. Bit like Farage who refused to give up his EU pension; for these people it is do as I say not as I do.
    At what point did I contradict myself. I'm not a big fan of Farage, hes a one trick pony. I don't know Cummings , just that hes a political strategist for the leave campaign. My big problem with the election commission etc is its a team effort by the state apparatus to discredit the democratic result...

    I'm not disagreeing that there are not big uncertainties with a no deal Brexit. But whats the point of leaving if you continue to have a gun pointing at your head. Uk needs a clean break to sort its own affairs out . Thats what people want that voted leave and the vast majority knew how'd they vote prior to any referendum being called. So No I don't buy that the social media campaigns etc had any bearing on the result.

    Boris for all his Clowning is not daft at all... and he's very good at getting the right people into the correct areas to implement policy and get the job done. When you skipper a trawler, doesn't mean you do everything yourself..You delegate and reward and put rockets up peoples arses mostly
    Last edited by Freyr; 11 Aug 19, at 14:50.

  12. #1602
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    Quote Originally Posted by Freyr View Post
    You'll have to expand on that, But I think you mean Chris Grayling....I'm not a big fan of Governments throwing money at schemes although I can see they have to be involved at some level..Just don't think they're very good at getting the best value...
    I am not a fan of anyone throwing away my taxes as they so often do. Perhaps you will agree with me then that the 30bn GDP or so (sorry can't find the sterling sign on this laptop) that Boris Johnson has so far pledged to spend may also be a total waste of money if 'brexit' is indeed a benefit for the UK?

    Oh yes apparently new high speed railways will spring from nowhere, more police will appear from pockets perhaps, tougher sentencing (though a law would be needed and I believe the HoC is on holiday). More money for the health service etc etc etc - talk. "Talk makes me thirsty" to quote a memorable line from GoT but perhaps more apt and in the vein "words are wind". Johnson has by all accounts always been a talker, nothing more.

  13. #1603
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    I refer you to post #1592 in this thread.

    UK GDP -0.2 in the second quarter. Ukraine GDP +4.6. Still we have much to catch up on here. Bond rates inversed; in English the 10yr yield is lower than the 2yr yield... recession is coming, in part due to Trumpkins 'easy to win' trade wars.

    Boris is likely to be out of job when the HoC reassembles - not sure when that is. Corbyn (the leader of the Opposition) has said he press a "no confidence vote" which he will win as the until recently Chancellor, Phil Hammond, has basically admitted he will support; other Conservatives also. The Tory Party as it once was, even under Cameron, is now dead. That saddens me. Comrade Corbyn proposes that if and when a "no confidence vote" is won he should form an 'emergency Government' and hold an election. This apparently is rejected by others as Corbyn is of course toxic and it is doubtful he could gain the confidence of the Conservative MPs who reject a 'no deal'. Other candidates are therefore suggested such as Ken Clarke, who I do not think would be acceptable to some Tories, or Harriet Harman of the Labour Party and each the longest serving members of their sexes as MPs.

    As far as I can I understand the "no confidence vote" is almost certain to be won. What happens then is tricky and could depend on an interpretation of a Fixed Term Law passed by Cameron when in alliance with the Libdems basically to solidify to coalition Government as it was. Under this law I understand 14 days are permitted to see if a new majority and PM can be agreed on within the HoC. If this is not possible an election must be called but at a time of the current PMs choice. The threat of the Cummings/Johnson camp is to either prorogue Parliament, so that a "no confidence vote" cannot be held, which was the earlier suggestion of Mr Dominic Raab, the now Foreign Secretary, or for the PM, should no leader be found who could hold a majority in the House, to call an election AFTER the October 31st deadline. Whether this would be 'constitutional' in British terms is doubtful as Boris was elected by 0.13% of the population of the UK and they all promised a "deal" would be "easiest deal ever". Boris certainly does not have a 'mandate'.

    Basically those MPs who are convinced that "no deal" will ruin the UK and mostly the Union need to agree on an emergency PM other than Corbyn, who is a commie and terrorist sympathiser. His 'adviser' Seamus Milne is a clear Kremlin tool saying of the illegal annexation of Crimea that it was "clearly defensive." For these reasons and others it is doubtful that Corbyn could form a Government so it seems to be a question of deciding who could?

    And I thought Ukraine was chaos...

  14. #1604
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    I refer you to post #1592 in this thread.

    UK GDP -0.2 in the second quarter. Ukraine GDP +4.6. Still we have much to catch up on here. Bond rates inversed; in English the 10yr yield is lower than the 2yr yield... recession is coming, in part due to Trumpkins 'easy to win' trade wars.

    Boris is likely to be out of job when the HoC reassembles - not sure when that is. Corbyn (the leader of the Opposition) has said he press a "no confidence vote" which he will win as the until recently Chancellor, Phil Hammond, has basically admitted he will support; other Conservatives also. The Tory Party as it once was, even under Cameron, is now dead. That saddens me. Comrade Corbyn proposes that if and when a "no confidence vote" is won he should form an 'emergency Government' and hold an election. This apparently is rejected by others as Corbyn is of course toxic and it is doubtful he could gain the confidence of the Conservative MPs who reject a 'no deal'. Other candidates are therefore suggested such as Ken Clarke, who I do not think would be acceptable to some Tories, or Harriet Harman of the Labour Party and each the longest serving members of their sexes as MPs.

    As far as I can I understand the "no confidence vote" is almost certain to be won. What happens then is tricky and could depend on an interpretation of a Fixed Term Law passed by Cameron when in alliance with the Libdems basically to solidify to coalition Government as it was. Under this law I understand 14 days are permitted to see if a new majority and PM can be agreed on within the HoC. If this is not possible an election must be called but at a time of the current PMs choice. The threat of the Cummings/Johnson camp is to either prorogue Parliament, so that a "no confidence vote" cannot be held, which was the earlier suggestion of Mr Dominic Raab, the now Foreign Secretary, or for the PM, should no leader be found who could hold a majority in the House, to call an election AFTER the October 31st deadline. Whether this would be 'constitutional' in British terms is doubtful as Boris was elected by 0.13% of the population of the UK and they all promised a "deal" would be "easiest deal ever". Boris certainly does not have a 'mandate'.

    Basically those MPs who are convinced that "no deal" will ruin the UK and mostly the Union need to agree on an emergency PM other than Corbyn, who is a commie and terrorist sympathiser. His 'adviser' Seamus Milne is a clear Kremlin tool saying of the illegal annexation of Crimea that it was "clearly defensive." For these reasons and others it is doubtful that Corbyn could form a Government so it seems to be a question of deciding who could?

    And I thought Ukraine was chaos...

  15. #1605
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    I refer you to post #1592 in this thread.

    UK GDP -0.2 in the second quarter. Ukraine GDP +4.6. Still we have much to catch up on here. Bond rates inversed; in English the 10yr yield is lower than the 2yr yield... recession is coming, in part due to Trumpkins 'easy to win' trade wars.

    Boris is likely to be out of job when the HoC reassembles - not sure when that is. Corbyn (the leader of the Opposition) has said he press a "no confidence vote" which he will win as the until recently Chancellor, Phil Hammond, has basically admitted he will support; other Conservatives also. The Tory Party as it once was, even under Cameron, is now dead. That saddens me. Comrade Corbyn proposes that if and when a "no confidence vote" is won he should form an 'emergency Government' and hold an election. This apparently is rejected by others as Corbyn is of course toxic and it is doubtful he could gain the confidence of the Conservative MPs who reject a 'no deal'. Other candidates are therefore suggested such as Ken Clarke, who I do not think would be acceptable to some Tories, or Harriet Harman of the Labour Party and each the longest serving members of their sexes as MPs.

    As far as I can I understand the "no confidence vote" is almost certain to be won. What happens then is tricky and could depend on an interpretation of a Fixed Term Law passed by Cameron when in alliance with the Libdems basically to solidify to coalition Government as it was. Under this law I understand 14 days are permitted to see if a new majority and PM can be agreed on within the HoC. If this is not possible an election must be called but at a time of the current PMs choice. The threat of the Cummings/Johnson camp is to either prorogue Parliament, so that a "no confidence vote" cannot be held, which was the earlier suggestion of Mr Dominic Raab, the now Foreign Secretary, or for the PM, should no leader be found who could hold a majority in the House, to call an election AFTER the October 31st deadline. Whether this would be 'constitutional' in British terms is doubtful as Boris was elected by 0.13% of the population of the UK and they all promised a "deal" would be "easiest deal ever". Boris certainly does not have a 'mandate'.

    Basically those MPs who are convinced that "no deal" will ruin the UK and mostly the Union need to agree on an emergency PM other than Corbyn, who is a commie and terrorist sympathiser. His 'adviser' Seamus Milne is a clear Kremlin tool saying of the illegal annexation of Crimea that it was "clearly defensive." For these reasons and others it is doubtful that Corbyn could form a Government so it seems to be a question of deciding who could?

    And I thought Ukraine was chaos...
    The fundamentals in the British economy are actually doing ok and are proving to be extremely robust. The Chaos is purely at the Political level. Which is now bordering on insane. The EU are clearly pushing the British parliament to hold a second referendum. Which will only increase the vote for a no deal Brexit. The dip in GDP was a consequence of business's buying in the first quarter more than they required to mitigate the March leaving date. Those stocks have now been run down giving the figures the false perception of a downturn..

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