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Thread: Free Speech on College Campuses

  1. #16
    Senior Contributor Doktor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbm3fan View Post
    How the hell anyone would know outside of city hall is anyone's guess. City police do not come onto campus unless called upon. Campus police have always protected the buildings going back as far as I can remember. They will let you mess up the concrete Sproul Plaza but draw the line at trying to enter a building.

    Now once the action moved west down Bancroft to Shattuck, about five blocks, those people had no affiliation with the students at Sproul Plaza. They were the anarchists that Phil Matier described as having poles and heavy duty plastic signs aka shields. From my point of view, farther away, I thought they were 2x4s. Either way a weapon brought to the scene for one purpose only. Why the City Police of Berkeley were not out in force at that point beats me.

    The meeting ground for the group I assume is digital. If you are going to infiltrate then you need to be between 18-30 and male.
    So, it's a fail of the LEO's and campus security?
    No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

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  2. #17
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doktor View Post
    So, it's a fail of the LEO's and campus security?
    Well not campus police. One, they really aren't trained in that kind of crowd control. Two, there isn't a lot of them. Third, with most across the imaginary line along Bancroft, the sidewalk, it is out of their jurisdiction. As for the City of Berkeley one could make a good case as to why they weren't out and I'm sure damaged businesses are.

  3. #18
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    Ah, the spoiled little crybullies are at it again... and of course it works again.

    Way to go Berkeley.

    http://opslens.com/2017/04/18/uc-ber...olence-begins/

    http://nypost.com/2017/04/22/berkele...peech-bullies/

    http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/27/us/ber...r-free-speech/

  4. #19
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    For someone has never been on the campus of UC Berkeley, much less the City of Berkeley you know very little as expected.

    You are probably one of those who agree/think Berkeley was the cradle of Free Speech. Are they talking about the City of Berkeley? If so then you would be wrong. Are they talking about the University? Then, again, you would be wrong. Are you talking about Mario Savio and the student demonstrations? If so you would be right as they are responsible. Don't even have to take if from me, although I have been around Berkeley since 1972, you can take it from the father of the conservative movement Ronald Reagan. The man, who while running for governor in 1968, has said he would send in the police to shut down these demonstrations and the Free Speech movement. Seems Ronnie wasn't a fan of it back then.

    Those first two articles above are a joke using older news to make a point about yesterday. The last article quoting the student is farfetched. People seem to mix the City of Berkeley and the University of California at Berkeley up. The University is to Berkeley as the Vatican is to Rome. Today Cal is possibly the toughest University to get into in California with Stanford and UCLA right behind. As such no one gets in with less than a 4.0 GPA. Sixty five percent are from in state and thirty five percent are out of state and out of country admissions. Got news for you they are not progressives at all. Some are liberal, some are conservative and many don't care because the main goal is stay in a super tough school and get good grades for their degree.

    The next thing about Cal is the absolute huge diversity one sees. I'd have to think long and hard to come up with a university more diverse than Cal. I know I was surprised by it when I first set foot on campus as compared to SDSU. SDSU almost all white while Cal had Asians of many backgrounds in the 70's. Not to mention that once you walked across Bancroft, off campus, the whole place became a circus. Needless to say one pretty much needs to be open to all the different people they will run into in class. I have many patients going there now from different ethnic backgrounds. All hard working serious students but none of them would be called activist.

    So what happened yesterday after all the demands that the University provide the appropriate on campus venue for this speech. Although the University has no obligation to provide a campus venue to anyone outside of the campus. Well, the anarchists didn't show up and that was a plus as they don't like anybody on any side. Those on the right showed up and a far amount were prepared with helmets and what could be called weapons. Students didn't show up as Cal is into the last two weeks of school and there were better things to do like finals preparation. However, some students from Berkeley High showed up wanting to talk and actually wowed some of those on the right. One thing about Berkeley High is that those students have an amazing awareness of things going on around them and the world. Clearly outpace any high school in the Midwest. Hell, clearly outpaced my Catholic high school in San Diego by a little bit if it weren't for Vietnam which had all on edge.

    http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/articl...r-11103790.php

    Although I am of the opinion that all this was a publicity stunt to gain footage for future use by which ever side. The interesting thing to me is that I never see any kind of leftist group want to speak in a place like Dallas TX. to make a point like the right using Berkeley.

  5. #20
    Idiot Mode [ON] OFF Senior Contributor YellowFever's Avatar
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    These Berkely high school kids are so stupid.

    Only ones dumber are the professors....


  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbm3fan View Post
    The interesting thing to me is that I never see any kind of leftist group want to speak in a place like Dallas TX. to make a point like the right using Berkeley.
    They speak there, but the Right doesn't riot and burn things down to stop them so it doesn't make the news. The importance of Berkely is not who is speaking, it is that they have been repeatedly shut down with violence.

  7. #22
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zraver View Post
    They speak there, but the Right doesn't riot and burn things down to stop them so it doesn't make the news. The importance of Berkely is not who is speaking, it is that they have been repeatedly shut down with violence.
    I do hope you know that your opinion is worthless. You have actually no experience in anything concerning facts as they relate to Berkeley. I am sure you didn't go to the University, I'm sure you have never been near the city, I'm sure you have never been near the East Bay Area, lived for any length of time in the Bay Area, maybe not even lived in California. You have no in person facts whatsoever. You simply pontificate on stuff that you have read rather than first hand experience. All of us out here know the City of Berkeley is on the fringe but you can't even separate fact from fiction. Well, your qualified at that if nothing else.

    Me, lots of first hand experience all over the Bay Area. In fact I can tell you when the last actual student involvement occurred on campus that was students only. Since then everything has been off campus agitators. So I'll narrow the time frame down to 1977-1981 as to when that last heated event happened. I actually got involved in it inadvertently with some of my professional grad school classmates. What's your guess?

  8. #23
    Senior Contributor DOR's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbm3fan View Post
    I do hope you know that your opinion is worthless. You have actually no experience in anything concerning facts as they relate to Berkeley. I am sure you didn't go to the University, I'm sure you have never been near the city, I'm sure you have never been near the East Bay Area, lived for any length of time in the Bay Area, maybe not even lived in California. You have no in person facts whatsoever. You simply pontificate on stuff that you have read rather than first hand experience. All of us out here know the City of Berkeley is on the fringe but you can't even separate fact from fiction. Well, your qualified at that if nothing else.

    Me, lots of first hand experience all over the Bay Area. In fact I can tell you when the last actual student involvement occurred on campus that was students only. Since then everything has been off campus agitators. So I'll narrow the time frame down to 1977-1981 as to when that last heated event happened. I actually got involved in it inadvertently with some of my professional grad school classmates. What's your guess?
    Amen.

    Cal Class of '80
    MA, '83

  9. #24
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    2 posts removed. Stop this immature nonsense immediately. You and the WAB are better than this.
    Far better it is to dare mighty things, than to take rank with those poor, timid spirits who know neither victory nor defeat ~ Theodore Roosevelt

  10. #25
    Senior Contributor Doktor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TopHatter View Post
    2 posts removed. Stop this immature nonsense immediately. You and the WAB are better than this.
    We are better than post #23, too.
    No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

    To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by tbm3fan View Post
    I do hope you know that your opinion is worthless. You have actually no experience in anything concerning facts as they relate to Berkeley. I am sure you didn't go to the University, I'm sure you have never been near the city, I'm sure you have never been near the East Bay Area, lived for any length of time in the Bay Area, maybe not even lived in California. You have no in person facts whatsoever. You simply pontificate on stuff that you have read rather than first hand experience. All of us out here know the City of Berkeley is on the fringe but you can't even separate fact from fiction. Well, your qualified at that if nothing else.

    Me, lots of first hand experience all over the Bay Area. In fact I can tell you when the last actual student involvement occurred on campus that was students only. Since then everything has been off campus agitators. So I'll narrow the time frame down to 1977-1981 as to when that last heated event happened. I actually got involved in it inadvertently with some of my professional grad school classmates. What's your guess?
    Funny, that Berkeley and Cal are being sued for collusion in preventing conservative speakers while allowing liberal speakers. College Republicans want to brign conservtive speakers. Liberals threaten to riot, Berkeley and Cal collude to prevent speaker from speaking giving the Liberlas a hecklers veto violating the College Republicans from enjoying the same access as liberal students. This is a prima facia violation of the strict scrutiny standard applied to the First Amendment when message is targeted.

    https://www.facebook.com/myiannopoul...c_ref=NEWSFEED

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doktor View Post
    We are better than post #23, too.
    Agreed, removed. Thank you.
    Far better it is to dare mighty things, than to take rank with those poor, timid spirits who know neither victory nor defeat ~ Theodore Roosevelt

  13. #28
    Idiot Mode [ON] OFF Senior Contributor YellowFever's Avatar
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    Mod Edit: Try that post again, this time without the snarky bullshit
    Last edited by TopHatter; 29 Apr 17, at 23:13.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by YellowFever View Post
    Mod Edit: Try that post again, this time without the snarky bullshit
    Uh.....

    No thank you.

  15. #30
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zraver View Post
    Funny, that Berkeley and Cal are being sued for collusion in preventing conservative speakers while allowing liberal speakers. College Republicans want to brign conservtive speakers. Liberals threaten to riot, Berkeley and Cal collude to prevent speaker from speaking giving the Liberlas a hecklers veto violating the College Republicans from enjoying the same access as liberal students. This is a prima facia violation of the strict scrutiny standard applied to the First Amendment when message is targeted.

    https://www.facebook.com/myiannopoul...c_ref=NEWSFEED
    Like I said your opinion is worthless repetition. Now when you arrive in Berkeley and obtain first hand information then you might have something. You seem like a smart guy but you make me wonder. I don't live in Arkansas and consequently would never voice an opinion about what goes on in the state. I'm smart enough to realize that yet you feel you have more knowledge regarding Berkeley than a person who has lived within 15 miles of it for 45 years.

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