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  • it seems to me that the GOP will do its best to ensure that the Trump Presidency is not humiliating-- IE they're not going to press impeachment proceedings on Trump even if massive conflict of interest issues arise.

    but if there's any real Trump policy that deviates from the standard conservative catechism, they will do their best to ignore it.

    there hasn't been all that much of that, because his biggest deviation is on trade issues where the executive has the most power anyways. they've also been trying their best to hem-haw their way around the proposed Trump infrastructure plan, too.

    by the way, i find the term "establishment" GOP and whatever it is that Trump represents to be meaningless. a significant portion, if not most, of the GOP members of Congress were a part of the 2010 Tea Party wave after all.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

    Comment


    • Originally posted by YellowFever View Post
      Can someone please tell me how the Russian hacks were a "threat to free and open election" or "our election process"?

      I keep asking and nobody seem to answer me.

      I voted for Trump knowing he was an asshole.* I voted for Trump knowing a vote for him would be a vote against Clinton.

      I knew way before the* emails ever leaked that she had shady practices in the Clinton foundation.* I knew of her cozy relations with the press and I knew the DNC much prefered her over Bernie.

      I knew all this and still voted for Trump.

      In effect what you are saying is the American people can't be trusted to arrive at their own conclusion as to how they voted.

      And why is it that Trump is left holding the bag on this one when he had absolutely zero to do with it?

      Why isn't Obama roasted over the coals for letting this happen and not saying something before the results of the elections were known.*

      What new revelations did we find out?

      That Russia (and the Chinese and the Norks and Iran and everyone including the kitchen sink) is attacking us through cyber means to gain our secrets?

      We knew that.

      We knew Wikileaks is hell bent on exposing our secrets and Asdange doesn't care where the leaks come from.

      So how did they hurt our election process?

      Please explain that to me.

      Did those life long Democrats in the Wisc. Mich. and Penn wanted to vote for Hillary and changed their votes because of the released emails?

      I'd like to see you try without calling the American voters stupid.

      Forget for a moment that the Russians were behind the DNC hack, and consider the imbalance it created. One of the major parties had all its filing cabinets stolen and the contents made public. The other did not. Is that fair? You can bet the farm that the RNC's files were just as juicy and filled with opposition research, none of it revealed, whereas the DNC's opposition research was and may have helped GOP congressional candidates win in several close district elections. Of course, much more was revealed in the files.

      "Free and fair elections", if I may borrow from an independent source, "allow people living in a representative democracy to determine the political makeup and future policy direction of their nation's government." Obviously, any secret attempt by a foreign entity to control the outcome of an election infringes on this right. It's none of their fu*king business. Thus, by definition, the hack, now attributable to Russians cannot be seen as anything else but a threat to free and fair elections. Left unchecked the threat will grow. More and more entities with a stake in the outcome of our elections at a national, even state, level will try to sway our elections. Making a big deal out of Russia's hack may seem like a tempest in a teapot, but Americans who think so lack foresight.

      Now one might argue, as some do, that the DNC servers were relatively insecure. So they got what was coming to them. That's the same argument rapists use when they argue that the woman's dress was seductive. The argument doesn't fly. The hack was illegal. If the RNC had done the hack, grand juries would be convening as we speak. In this case, a foreign government or its proxies did the hack. But it was still illegal under our laws. We aren't doing much to punish it, but we can convey our intolerance to this kind of meddling and raise public consciousness to the threat by making a stink about it. It affects us all, regardless of party. That's why the GOP has taken the lead in launching Congressional investigations into the leak.

      Well, no. I'm not calling American voters stupid. Stupid is as stupid does.
      Last edited by JAD_333; 09 Jan 17,, 20:42.
      To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

      Comment


      • Originally posted by astralis View Post
        it seems to me that the GOP will do its best to ensure that the Trump Presidency is not humiliating-- IE they're not going to press impeachment proceedings on Trump even if massive conflict of interest issues arise.

        but if there's any real Trump policy that deviates from the standard conservative catechism, they will do their best to ignore it.

        there hasn't been all that much of that, because his biggest deviation is on trade issues where the executive has the most power anyways. they've also been trying their best to hem-haw their way around the proposed Trump infrastructure plan, too.

        by the way, i find the term "establishment" GOP and whatever it is that Trump represents to be meaningless. a significant portion, if not most, of the GOP members of Congress were a part of the 2010 Tea Party wave after all.
        Asty:

        We want Trump to succeed. And it's way too early to be passing judgement on him. Congress and the Supreme Court will be doubly more important going forward as checks against any illegal or outlandish actions on his part. If he outright breaks the law, he could well face impeachment (not as Clinton did, but as Nixon did, when both parties had no choice but to participate).

        By the way the Tea Party caucus has about 35 members in the House and 4 in the Senate. Hardly a majority. They're dedicated to "fiscal responsibility" which isn't far from the mainstream GOP position, if not always reflected in its actions.
        To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

        Comment


        • Originally posted by YellowFever View Post
          Can someone please tell me how the Russian hacks were a "threat to free and open election" or "our election process"?

          I keep asking and nobody seem to answer me.
          I was thinking of doing so even though the reasons are blatantly if one thinks about it. However JAD_333 did such a great job of it I would simply say what he said.

          Comment


          • JAD,

            Asty:

            We want Trump to succeed. And it's way too early to be passing judgement on him.
            oh, i'm not passing judgment on what his administration has done...because his administration hasn't started yet. :-)

            as for success, as you know the definition will be different depending on party. i sure hope the US becomes more prosperous, etc...but i sure don't wish to see the dismantling of the ACA without a better replacement, nor do i want to see deficits grow to give tax cuts to the wealthy.

            By the way the Tea Party caucus has about 35 members in the House and 4 in the Senate. Hardly a majority. They're dedicated to "fiscal responsibility" which isn't far from the mainstream GOP position, if not always reflected in its actions.
            i'm not referring to the Tea Party caucus specifically-- IIRC, most of the Republican congressmembers are fairly new and elected as part of the 2010 wave.

            in any case the mainstream GOP position has shifted so far to the right that there's virtually no difference between, say, the Tea Party Caucus and the Republican Study Group-- at most you're talking tactical timing. there IS a difference, however small, between what Trump supports and what your average GOP congressmember supports. which is why Trump won on the backs of defecting Dems and thus has little allegiance to the GOP, as we saw frequently during the election and as we see now.

            (as an aside, it was also rather darkly amusing during the election to see Ted Cruz fans finding out to their shock and horror that epithets like RINO were being used on THEM.)

            between repealing the ACA and especially the hated taxes that are a part of the ACA, Trump's infrastructure plan, Ryan's tax cut plan...don't see deficits being a real concern for the GOP here.
            There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

            Comment


            • Originally posted by astralis View Post
              JAD,



              oh, i'm not passing judgment on what his administration has done...because his administration hasn't started yet. :-)
              lol...a lot people think it has already started...

              as for success, as you know the definition will be different depending on party. i sure hope the US becomes more prosperous, etc...but i sure don't wish to see the dismantling of the ACA without a better replacement, nor do i want to see deficits grow to give tax cuts to the wealthy.
              Agree completely.

              The minimum threshold for success will be not making things worse than they are.
              To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

              Comment


              • Originally posted by astralis View Post
                GVChamp,



                you mean the 'narrative and poison discourse' which led a certain candidate to say "Russia, if you're listening, I hope you'll be able to find the 30,000 emails that are missing. I think you'll probably be rewarded mightily by our press"? :-)

                the DNC first announced that something funny was going on in May-June 16, after they hired Crowdstrike to look into it. that Crowdstrike report already blamed Russian government agencies. -not- November. intel officials were stating that this was true by July. the first official pronouncement by ODNI/DHS was in October.

                to put it in a way that you and YF might better appreciate, think of the way Clinton first responded to the media regarding her private server issues. reflexive Clintonworld deny-deny-deny, which just made things worse. Trump's response to all of this has been quite similar in result, giving the PERCEPTION that the Russians have successfully driven a wedge between the incoming administration and the US intel agencies which will work for him.

                Anything prior to the inter-agency report isn't a consensus view of the US government, it's speculation that I as a voter have absolutely no ability to assess the reliability of. And how were the reports of hacking into the DNC reported? As a cudgel to attack Trump, because he's obviously the Manchurian Candidate.

                If people want to play it politically, it's going to get played politically. And I don't really blame them, but I am going to roll my eyes when people are obviously trying to score political points at Trump and then complain when Trump throws it back at them.

                Personally I don't see how Trump could have handled it better. This "Bash everyone who attacks me" isn't the demeanor of a civilized President, but you don't treat scum with anything besides boxing gloves.


                This particular action isn't a big deal, otherwise Moscow would already be a glow ball and we'd all be dead. Contrast what happened here if Russia had actually tried rigging elections or tried to assassinate Hillary. This crosses a red-line but it's info-propaganda, not an offensive operation. That's not to say we shouldn't respond (again, should've done it in 2004), but it's not an act of war.

                Should also add that the anti-fracking, anti-oil pipeline crowd is also firmly aligned with the Russian infowars campaign as well, not that anyone is using that to score cheap political points.
                Last edited by GVChamp; 10 Jan 17,, 02:25.
                "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

                Comment


                • Edit: Apologies...I keep getting these tiny stars when I copy/paste fron my phone




                  Forget for a moment that the Russians were behind the DNC hack, and consider the imbalance it created. One of the major parties had all its filing cabinets stolen and the contents made public. The other did not. Is that fair? You can bet the farm that the RNC's files were just as juicy and filled with opposition research, none of it revealed, whereas the DNC's opposition research was and may have helped GOP congressional candidates win in several close district elections. Of course, much more was revealed in the files.

                  Two points:

                  Was it fair to Hillary or the DNC?* Of course it wasn't. No denying it.

                  What do you think should have been done?* I don't have* idea one...you tell me.

                  Should we have delayed the election?

                  Should we have made the Republicans release their emails?

                  I think we both agree those are ludicrous ideas.

                  So what should have been done?

                  Because as soon as those emails were released, we were not going to have a "fair and free election" by your standards with no way to rectify the situation.

                  So let's..ahem....move on (apologies to snapper for using that word)


                  "Free and fair elections", if I may borrow from an independent source, "allow people living in a representative democracy to determine the political makeup and future policy direction of their nation's government." Obviously, any secret attempt by a foreign entity to control the outcome of an election infringes on this right. It's none of their fu*king business. Thus, by definition, the hack, now attributable to Russians cannot be seen as anything else but a threat to free and fair elections. Left unchecked the threat will grow. More and more entities with a stake in the outcome of our elections at a national, even state, level will try to sway our elections. Making a big deal out of Russia's hack may seem like a tempest in a teapot, but Americans who think so lack foresight.
                  *


                  In my eyes, I see no difference in a foreign power trying to influence matters of other countries affairs, either covertly or overtly.

                  Tankie is still pissed about Obama going over there and trying to influence their BREXIT vote. LoL.

                  And I never said the problem should be left unchecked to grow and cause greater damage in the future.* What I am saying is it is a big deal and the steps Obama took look feable and weak and just what exactly did it accomplish?

                  Yes, Putin got one over us, and yes, we should cause a stink and whine like hell.** And yes, we are doing that right now.

                  Yes, we should use overt means to cause them damage (we better be doing this right now because if it comes out sometime in the future that those "sanctions" are the only steps Obama took, I will definitely agree with Bluesman that this guy is indeed WORSE.THAN.CARTER.)

                  So what else can we as a nation do?

                  Pretty much nothing in public and just take our lumps and go on.

                  Now, as stated above, if you do nothing OUT of the public eyes, then I would be extremely pissed.

                  People are worried Trump will do nothing when he gets to the White House.

                  Well, I'm more pissed Obama did nothing for the past 8 years to tell the truth.

                  What I find offensive about this whole episode is that it is big deal and we should concentrate on that but there are some on the left trying to make political hay out of this.

                  Indeed there are* whispers (started when the "election hack" made the airwaves and getting stronger) growing by the day from the left that Trump is an "illegitamite" president.

                  I've never thought much of Joe Biden but the man earned my respect the other day with his handling of the ratification process.

                  Look, they tried to influence an election. There is a big difference between the words "influence" or "control" or "hack".

                  Hell, everyone foreign and domestic tries to influence our election one way or another. Saudis giving money to Hillary is influencing our election.

                  I do not think this episode meets the criteria of threatening an "open and free election"* or "process of an election" simply because you try to influence it.

                  If you use the words "control" or "hack", then it does.*

                  I guess it's a matter of personal choice on what word to use dependong on your political beliefs.

                  But now, I think even Obama using the word "influence"....which tells us something.

                  Now one might argue, as some do, that the DNC servers were relatively insecure. So they got what was coming to them. That's the same argument rapists use when they argue that the woman's dress was seductive. The argument doesn't fly. The hack was illegal. If the RNC had done the hack, grand juries would be convening as we speak. In this case, a foreign government or its proxies did the hack. But it was still illegal under our laws. We aren't doing much to punish it, but we can convey our intolerance to this kind of meddling and raise public consciousness to the threat by making a stink about it. It affects us all, regardless of party. That's why the GOP has taken the lead in launching Congressional investigations into the leak.

                  If we are talking about rape, I would agree with you.

                  A more accurate analogy would be if a person kept leaving his front door open when he knows there are thieves all over the place.

                  If he gets robbed MORE THAN ONCE because he kept getting tricked into giving his keys out, he at least deserves a slap upside the head and a "what were you thinking" speech.

                  That doesn't mean we shouldn't punish the thieves or make stealing painful for the thieves or not making the neighborhood aware of the thieves around but I won't give the guy that got robbed multiple times a hug and I definitely won't give him much sympathy.

                  And as you say, we aren't doing much to punish the robbers but we are spending a whole lot of times making the neighbor, who had nothing to do with the robbery (Trump) explain himself while we should be spending the time fortifying the house.
                  Last edited by YellowFever; 10 Jan 17,, 03:23.

                  Comment


                  • Except for the recent interim, Russia has always been trying to subvert and influence our elections. Cyber now adds new vulnerabilities.

                    We need to respond to Russia with a comprehensive strategy that leverages our advantages and patches our vulnerabilities.

                    First, we need to upgrade our conventional military footprint in Europe.

                    Second, we need to recapitalize and reinvigorate our nuclear weapons enterprise and expand our deployed arsenal back to parity with the Russians.

                    Third, we need to vigorously pursue the third offset in military capabilities.

                    Fourth, we need to develop and put into practice covert cyberband disinformation capabilities centered around Russian vulnerabilities.

                    Fifth, we need to ensure the continuation of a robust sanctions regime.

                    Sixth, we need to ensure long term continuation of a low ceiling in global energy prices.

                    Lastly, all of this should be done while our leadership utilizes conciliatory diplomacy to define the overt US Russian competition within safe boundaries and seek cooperation where ever possible. Our strong and far reaching actions need to be offset by conciliatory and face saving words in public.

                    So far, Trump seems to be checking or say that he will check a lot of the above boxes. Thus, I remain optimistic about his ability to manage Russia.

                    In dealing with Russia, we need to remember the teaching of Louis XI: "He who does not know how to dissimulate dies not know how to rule."
                    Last edited by citanon; 10 Jan 17,, 02:59.

                    Comment


                    • Mitch McConnell …the hypocrisy is strong in this one.

                      Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer has returned an identical letter that Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell sent to Harry Reid in 2009 on the Cabinet nomination process, calling on Republicans Monday to comply with the same conditions Republicans demanded when it came to President Obama’s nominees. At the time, McConnell was the minority leader and Democrats controlled the nomination process.

                      http://www.cbsnews.com/news/chuck-sc...ation-process/


                      Republicans Think Capitol Hill’s Rules Are for Suckers

                      To an impressive extent, the story of Barack Obama’s presidency was written by Republican congressional leaders, who recognized that Robert’s Rules of parliamentary order weren’t binding on anyone—but that Democrats would proceed as if old comities would ultimately prevail.

                      For years before the 2008 election, Senate filibuster rules had been put to slowly increasing use, but when Mitch McConnell became minority leader in 2007 he turned supermajority requirements into the expectation rather than the exception. The GOP’s massive-resistance approach to obstructing Obama’s agenda was an innovation, but to people paying attention to the late George W. Bush years it wasn’t unexpected.

                      After regaining power in Congress, Republicans would later weaponize the debt limit and other basic, deadline-driven legislative responsibilities. They used hostage-taking tactics to impose a conservative agenda on Democrats, rather than negotiate with them toward mutually agreeable compromises. This pattern prefigured the death of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia and McConnell’s decision to void Obama’s power to appoint a new justice with a full year left in his second term.

                      https://newrepublic.com/article/1397...-rules-suckers
                      Trust me?
                      I'm an economist!

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by YellowFever View Post


                        Two points:

                        Was it fair to Hillary or the DNC?* Of course it wasn't. No denying it.

                        What do you think should have been done?* I don't have* idea one...you tell me.

                        Should we have delayed the election?

                        Should we have made the Republicans release their emails?

                        I think we both agree those are ludicrous ideas.

                        So what should have been done?

                        I agree those are ludicrous ideas. Nothing could have been done to redress the unfairness to Clinton once the leaks began appearing.

                        Actually, I was just answering your question, what are free and fair elections. You had said in previous posts that nobody answer it, so I gave it a go. I don't have anything to add to it.



                        Because as soon as those emails were released, we were not going to have a "fair and free election" by your standards with no way to rectify the situation.
                        Correct, but those standards are not mine alone. They go back to the founding fathers. My degree is in poly sci, so I was already familiar with the concept.



                        In my eyes, I see no difference in a foreign power trying to influence matters of other countries affairs, either covertly or overtly.
                        The difference is right in your sentence. Covertly is in secret; overtly is in the open. The difference is akin to stealing money or earning it. Would the KGB alert the FBI that they are about to hack the DNC's servers? No; because it's illegal. If they want to do it, they'll do it secretly. On the other hand, they can do it legally by directing RT Television-US, their puppet in the US, to fashion stories critical of the candidate they don't want to win and lay off the one they do want to win, which they did. But at least RT's stuff can be seen and judged true or not by everybody. The candidate can deny it or counter it through speeches and media interviews. But countering the words in documents stolen from your own party is a much harder lift.

                        Tankie is still pissed about Obama going over there and trying to influence their BREXIT vote. LoL.
                        Yeah, bad form, but open and above board. No hacking Nigel's sex tapes, if he has any.

                        And I never said the problem should be left unchecked to grow and cause greater damage in the future.* What I am saying is it is a big deal and the steps Obama took look feable and weak and just what exactly did it accomplish?
                        There could be more here than meets the eye. Mount intel reports and encourage Congressional investigations to attract public and media attention. Objectives: First, inform the people that a foreign government messed with our election. We must prevent future intrusions (need budget to fund security measures). Second, strengthen public opinion to prevent next administration from radically changing US foreign policy toward Russia.


                        What I find offensive about this whole episode is that it is big deal and we should concentrate on that but there are some on the left trying to make political hay out of this.

                        Indeed there are* whispers (started when the "election hack" made the airwaves and getting stronger) growing by the day from the left that Trump is an "illegitamite" president.

                        I've never thought much of Joe Biden but the man earned my respect the other day with his handling of the ratification process.

                        Those voices will never go away. The establishment, GOP and Dems, knows it's best to accept the election results and have a smooth transition.

                        Short of real collusion with Putin, Trump is in the clear.
                        To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by YellowFever View Post
                          Edit: Apologies...I keep getting these tiny stars when I copy/paste fron my phone




                          Forget for a moment that the Russians were behind the DNC hack, and consider the imbalance it created. One of the major parties had all its filing cabinets stolen and the contents made public. The other did not. Is that fair? You can bet the farm that the RNC's files were just as juicy and filled with opposition research, none of it revealed, whereas the DNC's opposition research was and may have helped GOP congressional candidates win in several close district elections. Of course, much more was revealed in the files.

                          Two points:

                          Was it fair to Hillary or the DNC?* Of course it wasn't. No denying it.

                          What do you think should have been done?* I don't have* idea one...you tell me.

                          Should we have delayed the election?

                          Should we have made the Republicans release their emails?

                          I think we both agree those are ludicrous ideas.

                          So what should have been done?

                          Because as soon as those emails were released, we were not going to have a "fair and free election" by your standards with no way to rectify the situation.

                          So let's..ahem....move on (apologies to snapper for using that word)


                          "Free and fair elections", if I may borrow from an independent source, "allow people living in a representative democracy to determine the political makeup and future policy direction of their nation's government." Obviously, any secret attempt by a foreign entity to control the outcome of an election infringes on this right. It's none of their fu*king business. Thus, by definition, the hack, now attributable to Russians cannot be seen as anything else but a threat to free and fair elections. Left unchecked the threat will grow. More and more entities with a stake in the outcome of our elections at a national, even state, level will try to sway our elections. Making a big deal out of Russia's hack may seem like a tempest in a teapot, but Americans who think so lack foresight.
                          *


                          In my eyes, I see no difference in a foreign power trying to influence matters of other countries affairs, either covertly or overtly.

                          Tankie is still pissed about Obama going over there and trying to influence their BREXIT vote. LoL.

                          And I never said the problem should be left unchecked to grow and cause greater damage in the future.* What I am saying is it is a big deal and the steps Obama took look feable and weak and just what exactly did it accomplish?

                          Yes, Putin got one over us, and yes, we should cause a stink and whine like hell.** And yes, we are doing that right now.

                          Yes, we should use overt means to cause them damage (we better be doing this right now because if it comes out sometime in the future that those "sanctions" are the only steps Obama took, I will definitely agree with Bluesman that this guy is indeed WORSE.THAN.CARTER.)

                          So what else can we as a nation do?

                          Pretty much nothing in public and just take our lumps and go on.

                          Now, as stated above, if you do nothing OUT of the public eyes, then I would be extremely pissed.

                          People are worried Trump will do nothing when he gets to the White House.

                          Well, I'm more pissed Obama did nothing for the past 8 years to tell the truth.

                          What I find offensive about this whole episode is that it is big deal and we should concentrate on that but there are some on the left trying to make political hay out of this.

                          Indeed there are* whispers (started when the "election hack" made the airwaves and getting stronger) growing by the day from the left that Trump is an "illegitamite" president.

                          I've never thought much of Joe Biden but the man earned my respect the other day with his handling of the ratification process.

                          Look, they tried to influence an election. There is a big difference between the words "influence" or "control" or "hack".

                          Hell, everyone foreign and domestic tries to influence our election one way or another. Saudis giving money to Hillary is influencing our election.

                          I do not think this episode meets the criteria of threatening an "open and free election"* or "process of an election" simply because you try to influence it.

                          If you use the words "control" or "hack", then it does.*

                          I guess it's a matter of personal choice on what word to use dependong on your political beliefs.

                          But now, I think even Obama using the word "influence"....which tells us something.

                          Now one might argue, as some do, that the DNC servers were relatively insecure. So they got what was coming to them. That's the same argument rapists use when they argue that the woman's dress was seductive. The argument doesn't fly. The hack was illegal. If the RNC had done the hack, grand juries would be convening as we speak. In this case, a foreign government or its proxies did the hack. But it was still illegal under our laws. We aren't doing much to punish it, but we can convey our intolerance to this kind of meddling and raise public consciousness to the threat by making a stink about it. It affects us all, regardless of party. That's why the GOP has taken the lead in launching Congressional investigations into the leak.

                          If we are talking about rape, I would agree with you.

                          A more accurate analogy would be if a person kept leaving his front door open when he knows there are thieves all over the place.

                          If he gets robbed MORE THAN ONCE because he kept getting tricked into giving his keys out, he at least deserves a slap upside the head and a "what were you thinking" speech.

                          That doesn't mean we shouldn't punish the thieves or make stealing painful for the thieves or not making the neighborhood aware of the thieves around but I won't give the guy that got robbed multiple times a hug and I definitely won't give him much sympathy.

                          And as you say, we aren't doing much to punish the robbers but we are spending a whole lot of times making the neighbor, who had nothing to do with the robbery (Trump) explain himself while we should be spending the time fortifying the house.
                          Wheres the like button , haaaa Mr kenyaobumma , influenced our brexit vote n im pissed orrff ,,,,,nahhhhhhh Jason , im chuffed haktchooly , another gig he f####d up . heheh .

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by DOR View Post
                            Mitch McConnell …the hypocrisy is strong in this one.

                            Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer has returned an identical letter that Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell sent to Harry Reid in 2009 on the Cabinet nomination process, calling on Republicans Monday to comply with the same conditions Republicans demanded when it came to President Obama’s nominees. At the time, McConnell was the minority leader and Democrats controlled the nomination process.

                            http://www.cbsnews.com/news/chuck-sc...ation-process/
                            You left out an important detail. The letter was dated February 12, 2009. Most of Obama's cabinet appointments had been confirmed by that time. The letter listed basic procedures for completing the advice and consent phase of sub-cabinet appointments. The senate as yet to reach that phase, so it is premature to accuse McConnell of hypocrisy. I am surprised that Schumer resorted to this cheap trick.
                            To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by JAD_333 View Post
                              Yeah, I just busted all your points in my post number 131.

                              Neener Neener!

                              What are you going to do about it?
                              Umm...nothing.

                              I can't dispute anything you said.

                              Curse you!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by tankie View Post
                                Wheres the like button , haaaa Mr kenyaobumma , influenced our brexit vote n im pissed orrff ,,,,,nahhhhhhh Jason , im chuffed haktchooly , another gig he f####d up . heheh .
                                :O

                                I would love to know what "chuffed haktchooly" means...

                                Comment

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