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Thread: 2017 American Political Scene

  1. #361
    Senior Contributor Doktor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kato View Post
    Remember, American model. They don't do salary-based, or any sort of averaging like that.

    Typical "bronze" plans (ultra-low-coverage cheap plans, with currently on average $6000 (!) deductible) on the marketplace are $300-350 per month without government subsidies for a healthy working adult, i.e. around 8% of the average US salary; "silver" plans with half that deductible run around $400-450 per month. Premiums highly vary by individual risk class though, to the extent that a 60-year-old pays 2.5 times as much as a 30-year-old.

    The above 8% are also used in another way: If the cheapest available plan for you on the market exceeds 8% of your salary you... nope, you don't get the excess paid. Instead you're then exempt from the requirement to buy insurance.
    We would kill for 8% healthcare cost. Over here it's 20% and it is crap.
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  2. #362
    tankie Military Professional tankie's Avatar
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    Ahh cheers Asty ,,but no ta , cant be doing with all the libturds cuttin off their tiny members n the wimmin moanin without sex pfffftttn.


    Trust gets you killed, love gets you hurt, and being REAL gets you hated.

  3. #363
    Senior Contributor Doktor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tankie View Post
    Ahh cheers Asty ,,but no ta , cant be doing with all the libturds cuttin off their tiny members n the wimmin moanin without sex pfffftttn.
    FFS, we have sex. My ID card says male.
    No such thing as a good tax - Churchill

    To make mistakes is human. To blame someone else for your mistake, is strategic.

  4. #364
    Senior Contributor GVChamp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doktor View Post
    We would kill for 8% healthcare cost. Over here it's 20% and it is crap.
    Most of us are not covered on the ACA. The ACA exchanges are pretty small, even in the context of the ACA: most coverage increase came from Medicaid expansion (which is currently federally funded, but might be dumped entirely on the states in the future).

    Healthcare is pretty expensive and isn't a free lunch. Many developing nations are where we were (% GDP wise) when we first started debating Clinton care in the 90s. Someone needs to impose some payment discipline.
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

  5. #365
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    doktor,

    And the budget is funded via donations?
    your original assertion was that subsidies "still costs the budget", and that is not correct. if you said the subsidies would add to Obamacare taxes, then that would be a truer statement...although overall the system has reduced insurance spending because of the influx of new people.

    it doesn't add to the budget, and in fact the entire system as a whole lowers the budget deficit. as GVChamp noted, of course it's not a free lunch; the reason why it lowers the budget deficit is because it taxes people and forces people otherwise freeloading off the existing healthcare system to both contribute more and prevent even higher future public costs (the emergency healthcare).
    Last edited by astralis; Yesterday at 00:57.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

  6. #366
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doktor View Post
    We would kill for 8% healthcare cost. Over here it's 20% and it is crap.
    For those 8% you'd need to be a healthy adult who doesn't need any medical attention and is not prone to any risk of becoming needy of medical attention anytime soon. And if you still do then you pay on average the first 6000 Dollar in bills yourself before the insurance kicks in at all under those plans. And you'll have to travel a hundred miles to find a doctor who accepts your insurance...


    Quote Originally Posted by GVChamp View Post
    Most of us are not covered on the ACA.
    Realistically in my opinion it mostly squeezes out a very narrow margin of the middle class - but only those not covered by employer-bound insurance schemes. Anyone earning not just marginally less than average will be exempt anyway, anyone earning not just marginally more will realistically either be under employer coverage or buy some other insurance scheme outside ACA.

  7. #367
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    For me it’s not about being unable to afford health insurance, it’s about being unable to qualify for private insurance if I were no longer employed. Supposedly HIPPA is supposed to help with that, but I’ve heard horror stories.

  8. #368
    Senior Contributor GVChamp's Avatar
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    Asty,

    you call it free-loading, I call it "I don't need to pay for preventative prostate care screening at 29."
    "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

  9. #369
    Defense ProfessionalSenior Contributor tbm3fan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GVChamp View Post
    Asty,

    you call it free-loading, I call it "I don't need to pay for preventative prostate care screening at 29."
    Consequently, why everyone needs to be in. One day, given poetic justice, you will be 62 and end up with prostate cancer topped off with no decent insurance. Wouldn't that be a kick in the pants?

  10. #370
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    because it taxes people and forces people otherwise freeloading off the existing healthcare system to both contribute more and prevent even higher future public costs (the emergency healthcare).
    You might want to have a look at the Swiss model, which is somewhat what Obamacare was originally modelled after (except Obamacare doesn't go all the way).

    The Swiss model is to enforce a mandatory "basic" insurance for everyone without exceptions with variable deductibles - 300-2500 USD, which aside form location is the sole factor deciding how much you pay*. This basic insurance pretty much covers a limited spectrum of healthcare including any emergency care (but e.g. no dental at all). This basic insurance itself isn't provided by any government entity but instead bought from one of 70 licensed insurance companies. Most people then buy private insurance to top this up to better coverage from one of currently 90 private health insurance companies.

    * the government subsidizes this with tax money for families with multiple children and for low-income earners. Due to - similar to ACA - rising premiums around one-third of households are currently subsidized this way. The cost for the above basic insurance plans is around 350-550 USD depending on where you live, with similar income levels to the US.

  11. #371
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    GVChamp,

    Asty,

    you call it free-loading, I call it "I don't need to pay for preventative prostate care screening at 29."
    that'd be the same thing for auto accidents. old drivers get into more accidents than any other age group excepting teen drivers. so does that mean a 29 year old male should be exempt from auto insurance?
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

  12. #372
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    Today, Trump approves the laying of American pipe.

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