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  • Navy ratings

    Back in September I read in the Navy Times that age old Navy job titles were going to be eliminated. I thought oh God are we going to get PC about that too. I could somewhat understand the thinking that the general public didn't know what the term "chief yeoman" might mean as well as private employers not knowing. This way they would have a better idea of what a Navy veteran's job skills were. Nonetheless, I knew tradition dies hard and in the Navy very hard. Well it looks like those in charge heard a thing or two about it.

    WASHINGTON (AP) — The Navy is scrapping its decision to eliminate dozens of enlisted sailors' job titles, including many that end in "man," after hitting an onslaught of opposition from the force.


    The decision to drop long-held traditional titles and instead refer to sailors by their rank was announced in September and signaled a sharp cultural shift for the Navy. Three months later, after hearing persistent complaints and questions from sailors around the world, Navy leaders are going back to the drawing board.


    Adm. John Richardson, the chief of naval operations, said in a memo that modernizing the job ratings or titles was designed to give sailors more flexibility in training and assignments. Switching to names more understandable to the civilian world, Navy leaders argued, would make it easier to get jobs once sailors left the service.


    But after hearing angry feedback from thousands of sailors, Richardson said Navy leaders believe they can find a way to provide better job flexibility without dropping the titles.
    "We have learned from you, and so effective immediately, all rating names are restored," he said.


    The memo will be publicly released at 8 a.m. Eastern time Wednesday, and sailors can expect to see correspondence from Navy leaders.
    Richardson outlined what he called a "course correction" in the memo, saying the Navy will continue to review ways to update the names.


    "Modernizing our industrial-age personnel system in order to provide sailors choice and flexibility still remains a priority for us," he said. "We will need to tackle the issue of managing rating names."


    The Navy called for a review of the titles in January, shortly after the Pentagon ordered that all combat jobs would now be open to women. The idea was to eliminate titles such as "chief yeoman," ''corpsman" or "boatswain's mate" — titles steeped in tradition but difficult for the public to translate or understand.


    Under the plan, sailors would be known by their ranks, such as petty officer or chief. And job titles would be made more gender-neutral.


    Navy Secretary Ray Mabus, who pushed the plan, said at the time that he wanted titles to better convey the job a sailor is doing.
    For example, few civilians know what a hospital corpsman does, Mabus said in a June interview. A corpsman could be called a medic or an emergency medical technician, much like "messman" was previously changed to culinary specialist, he added.


    Sailors, however, protested the decision, launching a White House petition and gaining some support from Capitol Hill. They said that while they liked the idea of more flexibility, they wanted to hold onto their traditional titles.
    It's unclear now whether the move to make titles gender neutral will continue.


    Richardson said that sailors who want to provide input can email their ideas to: [email protected]
    http://www.sfgate.com/news/politics/...s-10809809.php

  • #2
    Now the Navy Times says the Navy will still press head

    Navy leaders are reversing their controversial decision to eliminate sailors’ ratings and will restore job titles across the fleet, according to a Navy message set for release Wednesday.

    Effective immediately, enlisted sailors will officially regain their ratings, the traditional job titles that have inspired a deep cultural loyalty and that have defined enlisted career tracks for generations, Navy officials said.

    The move comes three months after the Navy stunned sailors around the world in September by eliminated ratings titles, including those such as boatswain’s mate that dated back to the founding of the service.

    The extraordinarily rare move comes after a fierce backlash from the fleet that became a distraction from the Navy's broader effort to reform the antiquated personnel system, Navy officials said.

    Adm. John Richardson, the chief of naval operations, called it a “course correction” and acknowledged the overwhelmingly negative reaction from the fleet was a key factor in the decision.

    “We have learned from you, and so effective immediately, all rating names are restored,” Richardson wrote in a Navy message set for release Wednesday. A copy of the message was obtained by Navy Times Tuesday.

    Cmdr. Chris Servello, Richardson’s spokesman, confirmed Tuesday night that the Navy planned to restore ratings Wednesday and that a fleet-wide message from the CNO would be released online in the morning, along with more details from CNO and Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy Steven Giordano.

    Navy Times
    Navy's top officer admits he misjudged backlash before dumping ratings
    Though the ratings have been restored, change still lies ahead as the Navy plans to press ahead with its broader effort to fundamentally change the rigid personnel system and make career paths more flexible in the future.

    “The feedback from current and former Sailors has been consistent that there is wide support for the flexibility that the plan offers, but the removal of rating titles detracted from accomplishing our major goals,” Richardson wrote.

    “There is a way to have the benefits of the rating modernization program without removing rating titles,” the CNO wrote in the message.

    “This course correction doesn’t mean our work is done – rating modernization will continue for all the right reason,” Richardson wrote. “Modernizing our industrial-age personnel system in order to provide Sailors choice and flexibility still remains a priority for us.”

    These changes will ultimately mean that sailors’ titles may have to change in the future, Richardson continues, but he’s going to solicit sailor feedback.

    As early word of the restoration spread on social media Tuesday night, many sailors celebrated the news, both because they welcomed the return of the traditional titles but also because the decision showed that the Navy’s leadership was responsive to the concerns of sailors.

    “Nobody wanted to see ratings taken away. The traditions and identities associated with them are undeniable. My sailors will be relieved and gratified that their voices appear to have been heard,” said one East Coast command master chief who spoke to Navy Times and asked not to be named to speak candidly about a high-level decision.

    “And I'm just glad I don't have to open a manual to find out what kind of Sailor I'm getting the next time orders cross my desk,” the command master chief said.

    The reversal did not surprise many sailors, though many believed it would come after a new Navy secretary takes over early in 2017.

    “I genuinely believe sailors expected this. I think we've all been waiting and watching to see if someone was going to take a step back and determine that an interesting idea had been pushed too quickly,” the master chief said.
    https://www.navytimes.com/articles/r...ob-titles-back

    Well if they are going to press ahead can we also start using left, right, front, back and steering wheel to name a few???

    Comment


    • #3
      Terms of endearment....

      "Well if they are going to press ahead can we also start using left, right, front, back and steering wheel to name a few???

      Yikes... splice the brace!

      Comment


      • #4
        The petition I signed went way above the required number. Every sailor I have spoken(including command officers) with since the decision was made to drop them, was/were not happy at all and saw it as nothing more than PC! The uproar was loud and undeniable! They (those PC so-called "leaders") not only misjudged, they blew it and they knew it! You mess with tradition too much and you will get bit! Now, here's hoping the new SECNAV reflects common sense and restores many of the other traditions that have been ransacked by that idiot, Mabus!
        BTW, to quote something a Commander said, "because it has "man" in the title?? So does the title "woman"!"

        Comment


        • #5
          Navy Abandons Plan to Use PC Job Titles After Sailors Complain

          A few months ago the Navy announced that it wanted to "modernize" the job titles for enlisted sailors, largely because it wanted to remove the ever-offensive "man" from many of the descriptions. The sailors hated it, didn't stop complaining, and finally prevailed.

          The Navy is scrapping its decision to eliminate dozens of enlisted sailors' job titles, including many that end in "man," after hitting an onslaught of opposition from the force.
          The decision to drop long-held traditional titles and instead refer to sailors by their rank was announced in September and signaled a sharp cultural shift for the Navy. Three months later, after hearing persistent complaints and questions from sailors around the world, Navy leaders are going back to the drawing board.

          Adm. John Richardson, the chief of naval operations, said in a memo that modernizing the job ratings or titles was designed to give sailors more flexibility in training and assignments. Switching to names more understandable to the civilian world, Navy leaders argued, would make it easier to get jobs once sailors left the service.

          But after hearing angry feedback from thousands of sailors, Richardson said Navy leaders believe they can find a way to provide better job flexibility without dropping the titles.

          While offering excuses for this unwanted modernization, the higher-ups were making it seem as if being called "Yeoman" while in the Navy was a severe impediment to getting work in the civilian world. Maybe it was if the person doing the hiring was an angry feminist, but it probably wasn't something that necessitated an internal review in an entire branch of the military.

          A tradition-rich fighting force tasked with protecting a great nation shouldn't be subjected to the caprice of delicate civilians who are engaged in a social crusade.

          This is only a reprieve from this misbegotten nonsense, unfortunately. Hopefully, the will of the people who literally make the ship run will be given more consideration before the fact the next time management feels pressure to adapt to external wishes. Link
          “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by blidgepump View Post
            Yikes... splice the brace!
            Apparently blidgepump is having trouble with his back...

            Comment


            • #7
              I knew back in the 1980's when we reactivated the Iowa class Battleships, most of their Captains were promoted to REAR ADMIRAL (a TWO star rank). Ding-a-Lings in D.C, apparently do not read history. They wanted to rename newly promoted Admirals with a ONE STAR rank but they wanted to call them "REAR ADMIRAL - LOWER END".

              Yes, we did have a one star rank as late as the Korean War. BUT, it had a much less demeaning title. It was called COMMADORE.
              Able to leap tall tales in a single groan.

              Comment


              • #8
                Yet just another attempt towards the total emasculation of the male in our society by the Socialist Left - USNI had this as their lead story in their daily briefings. But, it's not over yet - give it some time, unless the Trump Admin. puts an end to it.

                I don't know whether this story or the total failure of the ZUMWALT piece of shit should take top honors as the most asinine waste of taxpayer money...F35, ZUMWALT, Navy Ratings, Air Force One, new POTUS limo - take your pick!!!! I'm sure there are more that deserve mention.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by bbvet View Post
                  I don't know whether this story or the total failure of the ZUMWALT piece of shit should take top honors as the most asinine waste of taxpayer money...F35, ZUMWALT, Navy Ratings, Air Force One, new POTUS limo - take your pick!!!! I'm sure there are more that deserve mention.
                  Air Force One isn't hardly an asinine waste of taxpayer money (provided of course there aren't the usual massive cost overruns).
                  “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    TopHatter wrote:
                    Air Force One isn't hardly an asinine waste of taxpayer money (provided of course there aren't the usual massive cost overruns).
                    Precisely what I was getting at - sorry for not explicitly stating that fact! Trouble is, cost overruns are the norm, not the exception today.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by bbvet View Post
                      TopHatter wrote:

                      Precisely what I was getting at - sorry for not explicitly stating that fact! Trouble is, cost overruns are the norm, not the exception today.
                      No argument there.
                      “He was the most prodigious personification of all human inferiorities. He was an utterly incapable, unadapted, irresponsible, psychopathic personality, full of empty, infantile fantasies, but cursed with the keen intuition of a rat or a guttersnipe. He represented the shadow, the inferior part of everybody’s personality, in an overwhelming degree, and this was another reason why they fell for him.”

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by RustyBattleship View Post
                        I knew back in the 1980's when we reactivated the Iowa class Battleships, most of their Captains were promoted to REAR ADMIRAL (a TWO star rank). Ding-a-Lings in D.C, apparently do not read history. They wanted to rename newly promoted Admirals with a ONE STAR rank but they wanted to call them "REAR ADMIRAL - LOWER END".

                        Yes, we did have a one star rank as late as the Korean War. BUT, it had a much less demeaning title. It was called COMMADORE.
                        In the 80's we used the commodore rank too- I recall when Jeremy Boorda was Desron 10 he was called Commodore and had 1 star.

                        Comment

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