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Thread: 17 Indian soldiers killed in Kashmir attack, worst in recent days

  1. #16
    Contributor DarthSiddius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by n21 View Post
    It had happened, and it has happened again.
    Yup it did happen this time..

    Complete Army Statement On Surgical Strikes Across Line of Control (LoC)

    his is what Lt General Ranbir Singh, the army's Director General of Military Operations, said today:

    It has been a matter of serious concern that there has been continuing and increasing infiltration by terrorists across Line of Control in Jammu and Kashmir. This is reflected, amongst others, in the terrorist attacks on 11 and 18 September in Poonch and Uri respectively. Almost 20 infiltration attempts have also been foiled by the Army at or close to the Line of Control during this year.

    During these terrorist attacks and infiltration attempts, we have recovered various stores including GPS and items that clearly indicate their origins in Pakistan. Furthermore, captured terrorists hailing from Pakistan or Pakistan Occupied Kashmir have confessed to their training and arming in Pakistan or territory under its control. The matter had been taken up at highest diplomatic levels and through military channels. India has also offered consular access to these apprehended terrorists for Pakistan to verify their confessions. Furthermore, we had proposed that fingerprints and DNA samples of terrorists killed in Poonch and Uri could be made available to Pakistan for investigation.

    Despite our persistent urging that Pakistan respect its January 2004 commitment for not allowing its soil or territory under its control to be used for terrorism against India, there has been no let up in infiltration and terrorist actions from across the Line of Control. If damage was limited, this was primarily due to the efforts of our soldiers deployed in our multi-tiered counter-infiltration grid that has been effective in neutralizing infiltrating terrorists. The Indian Armed Forces have been extremely vigilant in the face of this continuing threat.


    Based on receiving specific and credible inputs that some terrorist teams had positioned themselves at launchpads along Line of Control to carry out infiltration and conduct terrorist strikes inside Jammu and Kashmir and in various metros in other states, the Indian Army conducted surgical strikes at several of these launchpads to pre-empt infiltration by terrorists. The operations were focused on ensuring that these terrorists do not succeed in their design to cause destruction and endanger the lives of our citizens.

    During these counter-terrorist operations, significant casualties were caused to terrorists and those providing support to them. The operations aimed at neutralizing terrorists have since ceased. We do not have any plans for further continuation. However, the Indian Armed Forces are fully prepared for any contingency that may arise.

    I have been in touch with Pakistan Army DGMO and have informed him of our actions. It is India's intention to maintain peace and tranquility in the region. But we cannot allow the terrorists to operate across the Line of Control with impunity and attack citizens of our country at will. In line with Pakistan's commitment in January 2004 not to allow its soil and territory under its control to be used for attacks against India, we expect the Pakistani army to cooperate with us to erase the menace of terrorism from the region.

  2. #17
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarthSiddius View Post
    Can this be verified?

    Spl Forces Cross LoC; Kill 20 Terrorists



    EDIT: It was a whole load of BS!
    No longer BS. You posted that a week ago. Makes me wonder when this operation actually took place.

    See how its being played down on the other side.

    http://www.dawn.com/news/1286881/arm...-killed-at-loc

    That's going to be their line.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 29 Sep 16, at 16:05.

  3. #18
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by astralis View Post
    DE,



    but how long have you guys been duking it out with Pakistan over Kashmir? I understand no base can be 100% secure, but this seems really bad.

    hope some heads will roll over this, just like what happened after the 2012 Camp Bastion attack in Afghanistan.
    What i noticed is the mood in the country this time was very different compared to the attack on the air base at Pathankot this Jan 2.

    Different because the last attack was foiled and casualties were at a minimum. They proposed to send over an investigation team to our surprise. We allowed it. But they wanted a lot of info some of which was confidential and did not have any bearing whatsoever to do with the case. A week later we hear in the Pak media that this team says India staged the whole incident to defame Pakistan. The report was never made public so nobody knows what it really says but the Pak govt's silence on the matter for a good two days gives one pause.

    This time the perps used incendiaries on the tents and the soldiers died after from burns. More soldiers killed, the manner in which created an outburst. Last time i noticed something similar is when our soldiers got beheaded a few years back, long thread here.

    i think what has pushed things more this time is China. They want to build a highway through territory we dispute, territory that was gifted to them back in the 60s. By doing so and China could care less about our protests here is it will legitimise the territory that Pakistan occupies. If that border is hot the Chinese are going to think twice about building anything there any time soon. At least not until such time that the parties concerned can work something out.

    Not sure if i answered your question. They picked a camp that was more vulnerable than others. They only need to succeed once, we never hear of the several times they failed.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 29 Sep 16, at 16:18.

  4. #19
    Contributor DarthSiddius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    That's going to be their line.
    They don't have a choice, wouldn't acknowledging this amount to accepting the existence of the terrorist bases attacked?

  5. #20
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarthSiddius View Post
    They don't have a choice, wouldn't acknowledging this amount to accepting the existence of the terrorist bases attacked?
    Sure but it means they looked the other way. Now both sides got what they wanted.

    All these years they've been probing for our red lines. So i see this as a first in our attempts in a long while to discover theirs. They continue denying it we're in the clear.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 29 Sep 16, at 17:16.

  6. #21
    Contributor ambidex's Avatar
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  7. #22
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    5 days after our glorious surgical strike we get...

    Baramulla attack: 2 BSF jawans injured in exchange of fire with terrorists, gunfire going on | IE | Oct 03 2016

    Let's see how many sleeper cells they are going to activate.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 02 Oct 16, at 20:00.

  8. #23
    Liberté, Unité, Egalité Senior Contributor Tronic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Let's see how many sleeper cells they are going to activate.
    Activate them all.. Atleast they'll come out of hiding..

    More strikes on terror camps inside Pakistan are needed; especially on their leadership hiding safely and getting fat deep inside Pakistani Punjab. It's high time this unconventional war is taken to their own house. India has the money, it just needs to develop and hone it's sub-conventional capabilities. Hell, even the Afghan NDS hasn't shied away from carrying out hits against anti-Afghanistan militant leaders deep inside Pakistan; why does India?
    The real voyage of discovery consists not in seeking new lands but seeing with new eyes.

  9. #24
    Contributor anil's Avatar
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    Pakistani media won't cover stories from the isolated camps that got struck. Wonder why.

    Remaining camps have been shifted to populated centres.

    Meanwhile, al jazeera is running stories that India is the aggressor. They sure stick together.

  10. #25
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tronic View Post
    Activate them all.. Atleast they'll come out of hiding..
    Recall after Kargil they stepped up activities a lot. Our guys are going to be hit, we will not be able to successfully every single attack.

    More strikes on terror camps inside Pakistan are needed; especially on their leadership hiding safely and getting fat deep inside Pakistani Punjab. It's high time this unconventional war is taken to their own house. India has the money, it just needs to develop and hone it's sub-conventional capabilities. Hell, even the Afghan NDS hasn't shied away from carrying out hits against anti-Afghanistan militant leaders deep inside Pakistan; why does India?
    Right now, the argument doing the rounds is whether the govt should release proof of the attack. Two schools of thought there.

    To do so would put the PA on the offensive. Increase public pressure and they could act erratically. What good did any proof do for 26/11. Did catching OBL and killing him make any difference. Do people there even accept that he was found in Pakistan in the first place. Right now the message has been sent to the right people the non state actors as well as their handlers. The public don't need to know. There are security concerns with releasing such footage.

    Or the counter, it allows to publicly humiliate them and this will make them change or at least influence the way they think. since we admitted we did it why not show the world what we did. Then how will the Paks look after denying anything happened.

    Quote Originally Posted by anil View Post
    Meanwhile, al jazeera is running stories that India is the aggressor. They sure stick together.
    We call it a pre-emptive strike based on intelligence that the perps were about to move in on us.

    Not an attack on the PA. Not an attack on or even in Pakistan.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 04 Oct 16, at 00:48.

  11. #26
    Liberté, Unité, Egalité Senior Contributor Tronic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Recall after Kargil they stepped up activities a lot. Our guys are going to be hit, we will not be able to successfully every single attack.
    Hit them back. Each attack on the Indian side should be retaliated with an attack on Jihadi leadership inside Pakistan.. not just POK but Pakistani Punjab.

    Right now, the argument doing the rounds is whether the govt should release proof of the attack. Two schools of thought there.

    To do so would put the PA on the offensive. Increase public pressure and they could act erratically. What good did any proof do for 26/11. Did catching OBL and killing him make any difference. Do people there even accept that he was found in Pakistan in the first place. Right now the message has been sent to the right people the non state actors as well as their handlers. The public don't need to know. There are security concerns with releasing such footage.

    Or the counter, it allows to publicly humiliate them and this will make them change or at least influence the way they think. since we admitted we did it why not show the world what we did. Then how will the Paks look after denying anything happened.
    In my opinion, releasing or not releasing the videos of the strike is irrelevant. Pakistan will just claim they're made up anyways. Point is to hit their public terror figureheads. Next time Hafeez Sayed gives a public speech, or a rally, or a press conference, threatening more attacks against India; make sure his ride out of the venue ends up in a fireball. Disrupt his speeches with an attack on his entourage. Even if he survives; just him being seen under attack deep inside Pakistan will deliver home a clear message. That itself makes more of a point than releasing videos which will just be denied as doctored by the Pakistanis. In carrying out such attacks, India must continue to publicly announce when they strike inside Pakistan. This will force Pakistan to act, either against the militants itself, or if it is too scared of it's own dogs, then in support of the militants to protect them. It either faces the demons within or continue to loose face in the international community.

    In attacking the Jihadi leadership, Masood Azhar should not be touched and allowed to remain as a token reminder of Chinese complicity in Pakistani sponsored terrorism.
    Last edited by Tronic; 04 Oct 16, at 02:12.
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  12. #27
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    This came out the day after.



    Post mortem of why the attack happened. Uri should be a wake up call to the politicians not to ignore army requirements. Not as glamorous as jet fighters or as expensive but the embarassment caused to the army and the country needs to be addressed. They had to do something because the credibility of the ruling party itself as well as the PM was in question.

    The attack did succeed in releasing pressure on the valley. We got distracted and went off some where else.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 04 Oct 16, at 21:26.

  13. #28
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tronic View Post
    Hit them back. Each attack on the Indian side should be retaliated with an attack on Jihadi leadership inside Pakistan.. not just POK but Pakistani Punjab.
    It can't be too difficult, any number of guns for hire there. It's not like Pak leaders themselves haven't been offed over the years for crossing whatever lines. Two attempts on Musharaf alone.

    The political decision is yet to come from our end.

    Not different to what the americans on behalf of the afghans are doing anyway. Baituallh mehsud, mullah mansour etc. They use drones.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tronic View Post
    In my opinion, releasing or not releasing the videos of the strike is irrelevant. Pakistan will just claim they're made up anyways. Point is to hit their public terror figureheads. Next time Hafeez Sayed gives a public speech, or a rally, or a press conference, threatening more attacks against India; make sure his ride out of the venue ends up in a fireball. Disrupt his speeches with an attack on his entourage. Even if he survives; just him being seen under attack deep inside Pakistan will deliver home a clear message. That itself makes more of a point than releasing videos which will just be denied as doctored by the Pakistanis.
    The point being driven home with these attacks is If India can't even secure their army bases then what hope does the rest of the country have.

    In carrying out such attacks, India must continue to publicly announce when they strike inside Pakistan. This will force Pakistan to act, either against the militants itself, or if it is too scared of it's own dogs, then in support of the militants to protect them. It either faces the demons within or continue to loose face in the international community.

    In attacking the Jihadi leadership, Masood Azhar should not be touched and allowed to remain as a token reminder of Chinese complicity in Pakistani sponsored terrorism.
    yeah, this public acknowledgement is what is being pushed for. Not always plausible deniability.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 04 Oct 16, at 21:31.

  14. #29
    Turbanator Senior Contributor Double Edge's Avatar
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    Interesting rumblings..

    http://www.dawn.com/news/1288350/exc...-tell-military

    All off the record unfortunately. Over 200 comments but curiously without the usual bashing.

    What to make of it ? Zardari was useless he had to go along with the PA if he wanted to keep his job and Gheelani the ISI. The only reason we got a proper transition of pwer from one administration to the next is both leaders toed the PA's line.

    Does Nawaz have any political life left. The PA have steadily whittled it away over the years. Not only is there a proxy war going on with other countries it also very much exists against the voters of Pakistan too.

    This isolation or pushback from the world has affected the way the deep state behaves. Some articles i read suggest the attacks in India against civilians dropped after 26/11 because it just wasn't any longer in their interest. The cost outweighed the benefits.
    Last edited by Double Edge; 06 Oct 16, at 18:41.

  15. #30
    Contributor DarthSiddius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Edge View Post
    Interesting rumblings..

    http://www.dawn.com/news/1288350/exc...-tell-military

    All off the record unfortunately. Over 200 comments but curiously without the usual bashing.

    What to make of it ? Zardari was useless he had to go along with the PA if he wanted to keep his job and Gheelani the ISI. The only reason we got a proper transition of pwer from one administration to the next is both leaders toed the PA's line.

    Does Nawaz have any political life left. The PA have steadily whittled it away over the years. Not only is there a proxy war going on with other countries it also very much exists against the voters of Pakistan too.

    This isolation or pushback from the world has affected the way the deep state behaves. Some articles i read suggest the attacks in India against civilians dropped after 26/11 because it just wasn't any longer in their interest. The cost outweighed the benefits.
    Might be him hedging his government's policy against the military's, aimed at both, the domestic and the audiences abroad. Could even be a genuine plea/ultimatum to the ISI only time will tell I guess.
    Last edited by DarthSiddius; 06 Oct 16, at 21:20.

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