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  • GVChamp,

    For what it's worth, people in the US hate Putin as much as they hate ISIS.
    not really. there's always been a portion of the extreme left that views Putin as the antidote to imperialist America, while there's a rather larger portion of the right that views Putin as what a Real Leader should be. just go to Breitbart or the Blaze or Newsmax every time Russia does something with Syria and you'll see a huge circle jerk of conservatives talking about how Putin is killing all the terrorists the Muslim Kenyan socialist Obama is funding.

    nothing comparable with ISIS.
    There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "My ignorance is just as good as your knowledge."- Isaac Asimov

    Comment


    • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
      In 6 months almost no one in the US is going to remember this
      That's not limited to the US though. Europe was just about to forget "je suis Charlie". Madrid, London? No one remembers that here either. Tsunami? You'd have people asking you if you meant Fukushima. If they connect anything with it at all.

      Comment


      • And another one today we can forget about in a few weeks .


        At least 27 people are feared dead after Islamist extremists with guns and grenades stormed a luxury hotel in Mali.
        UN peacekeepers say they saw at least 27 bodies in the Radisson Blu hotel in the capital Bamako.
        Wounded civilians were this evening being evacuated from the hotel, popular with airline staff, Western tourists and local dignitaries.
        Some of the gunmen remain dug in on the upper floors of the hotel but they are no longer believed to be holding hostages.
        State television showed footage of troops in camouflage fatigues wielding AK47s in the lobby of the hotel, one of the country's smartest.
        In the background, a body lay under a brown blanket at the bottom of a flight of stairs.
        Around 10 men armed with guns and grenades entered the hotel at around 7am local time.
        They were shouting and screaming "Allahu Akbar", which means "God Is great" in Arabic.
        Witnesses reported seeing some of the men approach the hotel in a car, wearing dark suits and sunglasses.
        They opened fire on security guards before raiding the building.
        More than 150 people were originally taken hostage by the attackers.
        The Malian forces moved "floor by floor" rescuing people, assisted by elite US and French troops, witnesses said.
        Among the dead are thought to be a Belgian local government official, according to a source.
        Geoffrey Dieudonne had been in Mali for a convention, a parliament spokesman told Belga news agency.
        Two security guards have been injured in the assault.
        At least two gunmen are among the dead, a Malian military source said.
        One of the freed hostages, a singer from Guinea, said he heard attackers in the next room speaking English.
        "I heard them say in English 'Did you load it?', 'Let's go'," Sékouba 'Bambino' Diabate told Reuters.
        Al Mourabitoun, an African Jihadist group affiliated with al Qaeda, has claimed responsibility for the attack.
        The Radisson Blu's head of security said the attackers arrived in a large vehicle and forced their way through a security barrier.
        A security source said 20 hostages were released by the gunmen after being made to recite verses from the Koran.
        Two women told an AFP journalist they had seen the body of a fair-skinned man lying on the floor of the hotel.
        Turkish Airlines said seven of its staff were among the hostages, but five including two pilots had managed to escape.
        Air France said it had 12 crew in the hotel but all were safely "extracted". As a precaution it has cancelled Friday's flights to and from Bamako.
        The hostages also include 20 Indians, seven Algerians, six Americans and two Germans who have all been rescued along with three of 10 Chinese nationals.
        The owners of the hotel, which attracts many foreign visitors, originally said 140 guests and 30 employees had been "locked in" by two raiders.
        The Rezidor Hotel Group have since revised the figure to 13 employees, making the total number of hostages 153.
        The US and French embassies have asked their citizens in Bamako to take shelter.
        Mali's President has cut short a visit to Chad where he was attending a regional summit.
        President Francois Hollande has said France will "yet again stand firm and show our solidarity" with its former colony.
        It is to send extra troops to boost the 1,000 who remain there.
        The attack comes a week after the Paris massacre in which 130 people were killed .

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        • I see that the Sarajveo one, two days ago,went completely unnoticed.

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          • Originally posted by astralis View Post
            GVChamp,



            not really. there's always been a portion of the extreme left that views Putin as the antidote to imperialist America, while there's a rather larger portion of the right that views Putin as what a Real Leader should be. just go to Breitbart or the Blaze or Newsmax every time Russia does something with Syria and you'll see a huge circle jerk of conservatives talking about how Putin is killing all the terrorists the Muslim Kenyan socialist Obama is funding.

            nothing comparable with ISIS.
            I think the Conservatives don't "like" Putin, they just respect Putin.
            "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

            Comment


            • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
              I think the Conservatives don't "like" Putin, they just respect Putin.
              Well you can certainly get a lot more done when you don't have to worry about pesky things like constitutional rights and voters. There have always been strains within left and right who get all hot'n'heavy over dictators who get the stuff they want done done. Sometimes the comittment to democracy, constitutionality & human rights isn't quite as deep as some people would have us believe. Putin presents as a hyper-masculine leader prepared to use violence to get what he wants. I suspect there is a Psych thesis or two worth of material in examining the connection between this and 'respect'.
              sigpic

              Win nervously lose tragically - Reds C C

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              • And another one tonight, an explosive device has been thrown at the commander in chief of Bosnian army, while he was driving trough the tunnel, close to the town of Mostar. Like a previous one, this one has been directed towards military personnel.

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                • Originally posted by Bigfella View Post
                  Well you can certainly get a lot more done when you don't have to worry about pesky things like constitutional rights and voters. There have always been strains within left and right who get all hot'n'heavy over dictators who get the stuff they want done done. Sometimes the comittment to democracy, constitutionality & human rights isn't quite as deep as some people would have us believe. Putin presents as a hyper-masculine leader prepared to use violence to get what he wants. I suspect there is a Psych thesis or two worth of material in examining the connection between this and 'respect'.
                  Leaving aside the horrible bipartisan perversion of the US Constitution since the Civil War, this is about international affairs, not domestic policy. No one respects Putin trampling the rights of his own people: it's about standing up for Russia on the international stage and actually doing something, instead of "leading from behind."
                  "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by snapper View Post
                    Not sure you really understand democracy or what a rules based system means; there is no wealth requirement to vote
                    Having a vote doesn't matter through if you're not voting with the majority - and you don't get the majority to vote your way by begging or robbing. Ukraine represents what, 6-7% of the population west of Russia?

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                    • Belgian police have arrested 16 more people in late-night raids searching for those behind the deadly November 13 attacks in Paris, but failed to find a prime suspect.

                      Salah Abdeslam, the 26-year-old suspect from Brussels who has been on the run since he left Paris hours after his elder brother blew himself up at a cafe there, continues to elude a Europe-wide manhunt.

                      A third brother, who was not involved, said Abdeslam may have thought better of going through with the killing. Belgian police fear he returned home to launch new attacks.
                      "What we fear is an attack similar to the one in Paris, with several individuals who could possibly launch several attacks at the same time in multiple locations," Prime Minister Charles Michel said early on Sunday evening (local time).

                      Shortly afterwards, armed police backed by armoured vehicles and helicopters stationed overhead began a series of raids in which 19 premises in Brussels and three in the industrial city of Charleroi, 50km to the south, were searched.
                      Prosecutor Eric van der Sypt told a news conference early on Monday that no weapons or explosives were found and that a judge would review the detentions of the 16 arrested.

                      In one incident, police fired on a car that was later found in Brussels, but it was not clear, van der Sypt said, if it was linked to the case.
                      Continues
                      In the realm of spirit, seek clarity; in the material world, seek utility.

                      Leibniz

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                      • This arsewipe aint killing anyone again , blew himself up .

                        Paris terrorist was welcomed ashore in Greece and given help and clothes by French volunteers




                        One of the Paris suicide bombers was helped on to a Greek island and clothed by French volunteers before making his way through Europe to his target, it emerged yesterday.

                        The IS fanatic, known as Ahmad Almohammad from a fake Syrian passport found at Stade De France, had sailed to Leros with a group of English-speaking pals, reports the Sun.

                        Officials said they were helped ashore with nearly 200 refugees after deliberately driving a knife through their boat as they neared land on October 3. Two were then discovered with fake Syrian passports and arrested.

                        But Almohammad, 25, was ushered through and moved to a camp staffed by French charity Médecins Sans Frontières.

                        Less than 24 hours later, in a black tracksuit given to him by the volunteers, he was in a group of six buying tickets to Athens.

                        Travel agent Dimitris Kastis, 42, recalled: “One of his pals who spoke English ordered the tickets. When I heard about him I was very surprised. He didn’t look suspicious.”

                        Almohammad took the ten-hour boat trip to Athens on October 5.

                        Police say he spent two days there before heading through Macedonia to request asylum in Serbia.

                        He entered Croatia on October 8 and made his way to France where he is thought to have blown himself up outside the France-Germany match.

                        Leros harbourmaster Sakellarios Biliris remembered his group sabotaging their boat.

                        He said: “No one saw anything wrong with his passport. The situation was chaotic. One week 3,500 refugees came here.”

                        As stated before by several European politicians, Middle-East sources and ISIS themselves, ISIS is in fact sending terrorists with the flow of migrants and refugees. The question is - how many?

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                        • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
                          Hmm, I'm not surprised re: support
                          Support package by Germany planned out so far, pretty thin in my opinion:

                          - expanding mandate for Mali to 650 soldiers, 200 current (EU mission, component mission joint with Netherlands - was already planned anyway, just relabeled)
                          - expanding mandate for Iraq to 150 soldiers, 100 current (unilateral, military aid for Peshmerga)
                          - 4-6 forward-based recce Tornado for targeting in joint operations and a A310 MRTT for air refueling for French and other combat aircraft (anti-ISIS coalition)
                          - a frigate escorting Charles de Gaulle (bilateral) - (read: also full AAW recon over Western Syria)
                          - making certain German SATINT available to anti-ISIS coalition (in addition to already being shared with France)

                          There were supposedly some talks about sending ECR (ie. SEAD/DEAD) Tornados additionally, but approving that was rather moot anyway.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Mihais View Post
                            Back to Paris,the direct link between the war there and the attacks in Europe is virtualy non-existent.There is however an effort to hasten the split between the European peoples and their migrant populations.
                            This ^

                            How many more attacks will it take though.

                            Consider bombs going off in India every few months, low intensity but multiple locations from 2005 culminating in 26/11 in 2008. Did not succeed.

                            More you do it the less effective it becomes. Do it other countries and the result is the same.

                            We'll see more of this,because this,like CH a few months ago, is nothing but a test.The next level is doing this in several locations simultaneously and the conquest of city.
                            That might be going a bit quick. We will see more. As they try to grow their troops on the enemy's terrain.
                            Last edited by Double Edge; 30 Nov 15,, 17:43.

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                            • Originally posted by tankie View Post
                              Post stolen from a friend .

                              Apologies for the long post but I think I've finally figured out what is happening in the Middle East:
                              President Assad (who is bad) is a nasty guy who got so nasty his people rebelled and the Rebels (who are good) started winning (Hurrah!). But then some of the rebels turned a bit nasty and are now called Islamic State ( who are definitely bad!) and some continued to support democracy (who are still good.)
                              So the Americans (who are good) started bombing Islamic State (who are bad) and giving arms to the Syrian Rebels (who are good) so they could fight Assad (who is still bad) which was good.
                              By the way, there is a breakaway state in the north run by the Kurds who want to fight IS ( which is a good thing ) but the Turkish authorities think they are bad, so we have to say they are bad whilst secretly thinking they're good and giving them guns to fight IS (which is good) but that is another matter.
                              Getting back to Syria.
                              So President Putin ( who is bad, cos he invaded Crimea and the Ukraine and killed lots of folks including that nice Russian man in London with polonium poisoned sushi ) has decided to back Assad (who is still bad) by attacking IS (who are also bad) which is sort of a good thing?
                              But Putin ( still bad ) thinks the Syrian Rebels (who are good) are also bad, and so he bombs them too, much to the annoyance of the Americans (who are good) who are busy backing and arming the rebels (who are also good).
                              Now Iran (who used to be bad, but now they have agreed not to build any nuclear weapons and bomb Israel are now good) are going to provide ground troops to support Assad (still bad) as are the Russians (bad) who now have ground troops and aircraft in Syria.
                              So a Coalition of Assad (still bad) Putin (extra bad) and the Iranians (good, but in a bad sort of way) are going to attack IS (who are bad) which is a good thing, but also the Syrian Rebels (who are good) which is bad.
                              Now the British (obviously good, except some freak called Corbyn who, incidentally wears a corduroy jacket, which is dead give away as that's never good) and the Americans (also good) cannot attack Assad (still bad) for fear of upsetting Putin (bad) and Iran (good / bad) and now they have to accept that Assad might not be that bad after all compared to IS (who are super bad).
                              So Assad (bad) is now probably good, being better than IS (but let’s face it, drinking your own wee is better than IS so no real choice there) and since Putin and Iran are also fighting IS that may now make them Good. America (still Good) will find it hard to arm a group of rebels being attacked by the Russians for fear of upsetting Mr Putin (now good) and that nice mad Ayatollah in Iran (also Good) and so they may be forced to say that the Rebels are now Bad, or at the very least abandon them to their fate. This will lead most of them to flee to Turkey and on to Europe or join IS (still the only constantly bad group).
                              To Sunni Muslims, an attack by Shia Muslims (Assad and Iran) backed by Russians will be seen as something of a Holy War, and the ranks of IS will now be seen by the Sunnis as the only Jihadis fighting in the Holy War and hence many Muslims will now see IS as Good (Doh!)
                              Sunni Muslims will also see the lack of action by Britain and America in support of their Sunni rebel brothers as something of a betrayal (mmmm... might have a point) and hence we will be seen as Bad.
                              So now we have America (now bad) and Britain (also bad) providing limited support to Sunni Rebels (bad) many of whom are looking to IS (Good / bad) for support against Assad (now good) who, along with Iran (also Good) and Putin (also, now, unbelievably, Good) are attempting to retake the country Assad used to run before all this started?
                              I hope that clears all this up for you.
                              LOL, this is why your syria thread a hundred odd pages and counting is still going stong :D

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                              • You know why the attack in Paris was so much more "important" than other attacks like the ones in Beirut just the night before, or the attack a week later in Mali? Because people vacation in Paris. They don't vacation in Beirut or Mali. This attack hits home for western media. Beirut or Mali or Libya or Mumbai are quaint little places where CNN and BBC send reporters to and exploit them for political gains. Paris is where these western "intellectuals" spend their time talking about how evil capitalism is and how best to help those poor muslims exploited by the racist white men. This is like getting mugged in your gun-free zone, your gated community, your safe space.

                                Newsflash: bad guys don't give a shit about your gun-free zone or safe space.

                                So....how's that "pivot to Asia" working out?
                                "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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