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Thread: British army (maybe) getting a new MBT?

  1. #1
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    British army (maybe) getting a new MBT?

    Looks like the british army maybe getting a new MBT. Or maybe the Challenger finally gets upgraded:

    British Army considers new MBT in response to Russia's Armata

    Weren't there some atempts at replacing the gun? Maybe they should team up with Jordan, who's carrying out upgrades on their Challenger 1...

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    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    I hear the US Army has something like 6000 Abrams tanks in their inventory, despite only wanting around 2000. They apparently keep buying tanks at the behest of congress when they would prefer to use those funds elsewhere. Perhaps the US could donate a couple thousand to the UK or anyone else in NATO that wants new toys. Are the Europeans ok with DU armor and projectiles?
    Last edited by SteveDaPirate; 22 Sep 15, at 16:46.

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    I doubt they'd go with the M1, tbh. If they didn't choose it before, why go that way now?

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    Senior Contributor SteveDaPirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlvfr View Post
    I doubt they'd go with the M1, tbh. If they didn't choose it before, why go that way now?
    BAE does a lot of work on the Abrams, but I think a Challenger 3 is the most likely outcome.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveDaPirate View Post
    BAE does a lot of work on the Abrams, but I think a Challenger 3 is the most likely outcome.
    You mean a full new vehicle? Budget...

    I see a full upgrade, tbh: new gun, fire control, engine (?), suspension...

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    Senior Contributor Doktor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlvfr View Post
    You mean a full new vehicle? Budget...

    I see a full upgrade, tbh: new gun, fire control, engine (?), suspension...
    More differences than between Golf IV and VII.
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    At the current rate of European defense spending I wouldn't be surprised if this new tank is another CGI rendering.

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    Senior Contributor Monash's Avatar
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    Sounds more like a BAE 'wish list' than a real proposal. I mean come on, after taking the axe to defense spending so recently how could the British Government justify an expensive project like that just for the Army? An given the current state of defense spending in Europe who do they think is going to 'buy in' as a partner and give it the necessary economies of scale to make it past even initial development. As for using the Armata as an excuse, that's pretty lame.

    Firstly the Russians, despite all the press releases still haven't worked all the kinks out of the design yet and then they've got to come up with the money they need to build it in significant numbers while at the same time dealing with the other massive obsolescence issues they are face across the board with all their other high end military weapon systems. (Maybe they could do it when oil prices were at their historical peak but not now and not for the foreseeable future.)

    And that's not to mention coming up with a scenario where British armored units go head to head with Russian ones in the absence of the full support from their NATO Allies - as far as I am aware the Armata is not ocean going.
    Last edited by Monash; 23 Sep 15, at 12:06.

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    Senior Contributor Triple C's Avatar
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    UK MoD's Army 2020 cut British Army armor down to three brigades. I think that's a pretty clear indication of priorities. Nothing wrong with Challenger 2 anyway. Btw, how likely do you all think that there will be a joint EU project in next gen armor?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple C View Post
    UK MoD's Army 2020 cut British Army armor down to three brigades. I think that's a pretty clear indication of priorities.
    But still need those 3. And wasn't that issued after the "Armada scare"?

    Quote Originally Posted by Triple C View Post
    Nothing wrong with Challenger 2 anyway.
    Apart from (at least) an old rifled gun that can't fire the more modern versions of APFSDS, overweight issues...

    Quote Originally Posted by Triple C View Post
    Btw, how likely do you all think that there will be a joint EU project in next gen armor?
    Doubtfull, tbh. The french are still developing the Leclerc, the germans are transforming the Leopard 2 beyong recognition, and the rest don't have the $$$ or armies to think about a new tank...

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    Armchair Worrier Senior Contributor bolo121's Avatar
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    Ya know it always seems like the UK has the kit India wants.
    Our carrier is crap.....the UK has the nifty new QE class.
    Our air defence vessels are not that great, the UK has the Daring class.
    Our subs are deathtraps, the UK builds excellent astute classes after a few incidents to start with.

    It would be great if the UK could build us a 21st century chobham protected challenger III instead of T90 related horror
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    Quote Originally Posted by bolo121 View Post
    Ya know it always seems like the UK has the kit India wants.
    Our carrier is crap.....the UK has the nifty new QE class.
    Our air defence vessels are not that great, the UK has the Daring class.
    Our subs are deathtraps, the UK builds excellent astute classes after a few incidents to start with.

    It would be great if the UK could build us a 21st century chobham protected challenger III instead of T90 related horror
    Imho, India's problem isn't technology, but systemic corruption... that ruins every program at every level...

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    Senior Contributor Stitch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jlvfr View Post
    Apart from (at least) an old rifled gun that can't fire the more modern versions of APFSDS, overweight issues...
    Sounds like the Brits need to move into the 21st century, and go with the Rheinmetall L55 smooth-bore . . .
    Last edited by Stitch; 24 Sep 15, at 04:24.
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    Well…the L7/M68 105mm was such a winner that the Brits are probably reluctant to admit that the Rheinmetall L55 smoothbore is the way to go. Thought the Chinese or Russians had some tank they're developing with a 140mm gun on it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by S2 View Post
    Well…the L7/M68 105mm was such a winner that the Brits are probably reluctant to admit that the Rheinmetall L55 smoothbore is the way to go. Thought the Chinese or Russians had some tank they're developing with a 140mm gun on it.
    Bet you've heard it will be very very cheap and produced en masse.
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