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  • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
    To the extent there is a revolution, it's that lesser-educated whites are now voting like a minority group. But a lot of people have been talking about that shift for a while now.
    Trump cost Republicans college-educated voters and there's still some demographic change that lost NV and CO and basically makes VA a blue state now. Open question if the Republicans can actually keep that coalition together, but there's a LOT of room to go. And because of where lower-class whites are situated, they are electorally extremely important.

    Also, while I know I should not gloat, and don't really feel the need to here, Facebook is a totally different story. I like DOR and astralis just fine but those people (my friends, obviously!) have been living in a smug Wonderland the last 8 years and it's so incredibly gratifying seeing that bubble burst.
    Trump will have to deliver extremely well on the economic side, to keep both the fiscally conservative long term Republican voters, and new anti trade, protectionist, pro big government, white working class voters happy.

    The Dems won the popular vote, if less than 1 in 100 Trump voters had voted for Hillary instead, Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania would still be blue. If things go badly, especially on matters of the economy and trade, I'd expect this coalition to fall apart in short order.
    Last edited by InExile; 10 Nov 16,, 03:25.

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    • Roflmao, take a look at the black community and get back to me. We have no idea how the white working class is going to vote in the future, but we do know that this has been part of a long-term trend. This is a high-water mark, and may not be achievable again, but these people are active, motivated, and anti-Democrat.

      Maybe if Warren or Sanders runs the Dems can pull some voters.


      The Republicans also have easy growth in the Hispanic and College communities. Unstated in this election is that the Republicans had recovered a lot of their image in the Hispanic community until Trump won NH. And college-educated whites, who aren't as Trump friendly as they are Romney friendly, WILL vote for Republican Tea Party candidates.

      That means Rubio has a strong base to run and win and Trump quite frankly made that slightly easier.
      "The great questions of the day will not be settled by means of speeches and majority decisions but by iron and blood"-Otto Von Bismarck

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      • Originally posted by antimony View Post
        I am going to repeat what Michael Moore has written, because I can't express my feelings better myself:

        HILLARY CLINTON WON THE POPULAR VOTE.

        The MAJORITY of our fellow Americans preferred Hillary Clinton over Donald Trump. Period.


        The majority of Americans wanted Hillary, not Trump. The only reason he’s president is because of the Electoral College.

        We cannot change the rules to suit our desires, so we will accept Trump as President.

        In this country a majority of its citizens have said they believe there’s climate change, they believe women should be paid the same as men, they want a debt-free college education, they don’t want us invading countries, they want a raise in the minimum wage and they want a single-payer true universal health care system. None of that has changed. We live in a country where the majority agree with the “liberal” position. We just lack the liberal leadership to make that happen.

        So from now on, any Democratic member of Congress who didn’t wake up this morning ready to fight, resist and obstruct in the way Republicans did against President Obama every day for eight full years must step out of the way and let those who know the score lead the way in stopping the meanness and the madness that's about to begin.

        Hey President Trump, you won. Congratulations.

        This just got a little bit more interesting...

        California gave Hillary a bigger chunk. I think the US system is okay as it is. Not perfect, but at least it prevents the big states from deciding who the President is every time.
        "They want to test our feelings.They want to know whether Muslims are extremists or not. Death to them and their newspapers."

        Protester

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        • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
          Yup, and Al Gore "won" the popular vote, and Dubya took an actual majority in 2004.

          Note: Hillary did not take a majority. If she had, she would be President-Elect. She had a slight hair above Trump, smaller than the lead Gore had over Dubya, and both Gore and Dubya beat HRC's vote share. Dubya had more of a mandate in 00 than HRC does in 16
          As I pointed out Trump took only 47.5% of the TOTAL vote. That means Americans voted for someone, other than Trump, at 52.5%. Whether or not it was for two people or three people it does say that 52.5% didn't want Trump but rather someone else.

          Apparently some of them have now come out in very large numbers to protest him already in both Oakland and San Francisco's Castro District tonight. I suspect unity is not in the air.

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          • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
            Roflmao, take a look at the black community and get back to me. We have no idea how the white working class is going to vote in the future, but we do know that this has been part of a long-term trend. This is a high-water mark, and may not be achievable again, but these people are active, motivated, and anti-Democrat.

            Maybe if Warren or Sanders runs the Dems can pull some voters.


            The Republicans also have easy growth in the Hispanic and College communities. Unstated in this election is that the Republicans had recovered a lot of their image in the Hispanic community until Trump won NH. And college-educated whites, who aren't as Trump friendly as they are Romney friendly, WILL vote for Republican Tea Party candidates.

            That means Rubio has a strong base to run and win and Trump quite frankly made that slightly easier.

            Laugh if you like. I am not denying that this is a triumph for Trump, but it was on an extremely slender margin. Many voted for Trump holding their nose out of a fear of Clinton, and many may have been disaffected Bernie voters. You are right that we dont know how the white working class will vote in the future, but I think its premature to talk of a Trump coalition in the same way as the Obama coalition or maybe even a Reagan coalition.

            Sure, he may actually deliver and this unusual alliance of fiscal conservatives and the white working class might endure long term in an age of inequality. But I have my doubts. He would probably have to get several of those Yugeee new trade deals that he keeps talking about!
            Last edited by InExile; 10 Nov 16,, 06:06.

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            • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
              I guess you never learned how to spell g-e-r-r-y-m-a-n-d-e-r-i-n-g. Yeah, I know it is a big word.
              PETULANT.... As in you are being petulant. I did not even tiuch on the how or why just the what. Right now Conservatives/GOP will hold an edge in January not seen since Hoover was sworn in.

              If Trump can be effective enough to make it to a second term he will be able to stack SCOTUS for a generation and balance out a lot of Obama's district and appellate court apointees and maybe even reorganise some liberal bastions like the DOJ's EDNY. The House is a GOP lock till at least 2022. The next time the Senate comes round the Dems are defending more seats. 202p is likely the next real shot they have to seize the senate unless Trump turns into a Carter in GOP clothing.

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              • CONGRATS U.S.
                Looks like you just elected your own version of Ahmedinejad.
                Same brash style, but with blonde hair.

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                • Originally posted by tbm3fan View Post
                  As I pointed out Trump took only 47.5% of the TOTAL vote. That means Americans voted for someone, other than Trump, at 52.5%. Whether or not it was for two people or three people it does say that 52.5% didn't want Trump but rather someone else.

                  Apparently some of them have now come out in very large numbers to protest him already in both Oakland and San Francisco's Castro District tonight. I suspect unity is not in the air.
                  This was a wave election. The Dems were supposed to be riding high, instead they only won 220 of 3100 counties, almost all of them clustrered around a few big metro areas.

                  The Libertarians always get a couple million votes. Thier modest surge this year innvolves protest votes from both right and Left. However all the Green votes are lost Democrats.if you take the number of protest votes and add in the number of people identified in exit polling as voting against the other candidate then Hillary had more votes cast as an act against her than Trump did.

                  Sorry not sorry you're corrupt dowager empress didn't win. Trump has a mandate, it was a wave election and despite calls from both HRC and Obama the lefty loons who kept harping about how dangerous is, are now rioting and attacking people they suspect of being Trump supporters.

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                  • we all remember how the left screamed and yelled and pulled all kinds of crazy stuffs after brexit dont we? i'm afraid it will be even uglier this time.
                    i wrote this comment more than 1 week ago and once again, i was correct. just like post-brexit, democrats are very quick to point out those who didnt vote the way they like are just a bunch of uneducated, bigoted racists. (if only they could show the same kind of "tolerance" as they do to muslim terrorists to their own countrymen).

                    they are, of course, in their usual wisdom, also quick to point out how trump is gonna fail miserably as a president. its not like they already said the same thing about his presidency campaign. But hey, who knows, maybe they will get lucky and, for once, the universe will actually obey their wishful thinking.

                    To make sure people know they're dead serious, they dont forget to climb down from their moral high ground and rather see their own country fail than to see trump succeed (that's progressive all right!).

                    Isnt it faster if they just leave the country like many of their beloved liberal "celebrities" said they will if trump wins? Of course, being true leftists, those celebrities are just a bunch a hypocritical liars and i doubt any of them would move their rich a$$. Still i cant help noticing most of them said they would move to canada instead of mexico (i always thought they love latino people so much).

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                    • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post
                      On the flip side, Dems did not turn out their whole base, which is just as big of a story. Trump actually didn't fare too much differently than Romney, but Hillary WAY under-performed.
                      And I think that's the key right there as to why Hillary didn't win; people didn't turn out in nearly as large of numbers as they did for Barack in 2006 and 2012. My best guess is that they just assumed Hillary would win, with or without their vote (or they didn't care either way), and simply stayed home instead of voting. Oops! By the time people realized what was happening, it was too late. No crying over spilled milk . . .
                      "There is never enough time to do or say all the things that we would wish. The thing is to try to do as much as you can in the time that you have. Remember Scrooge, time is short, and suddenly, you're not there any more." -Ghost of Christmas Present, Scrooge

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                      • Originally posted by GVChamp View Post

                        On the flip side, Dems did not turn out their whole base, which is just as big of a story. Trump actually didn't fare too much differently than Romney, but Hillary WAY under-performed.

                        Dems are on their back foot right now, but they are hardly down and out. They still hold almost half the Senate.

                        a simple logic that many (supposedly educated) democrats dont seem to understand is that a NO VOTE is a vote itself.

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                        • Interesting analysis at the NR. Turnout in 2016 may be down from 2012, and Trump ultimately got almost 6 million votes less than Obama did in 2012 and even 2 million less than Romney.

                          However, turnout is way higher when one considers the critical swing states. And it does appear that Trump would have edged Obama in Florida, Ohio and even (just barely) Pennsylvania. This adds up to a small electoral college victory for Trump over Obama himself. As the writer himself points out this is apples to oranges, but it does seem to show that higher Republican (mostly white) turnout in key states was a greater contributor to Trump's victory than depressed Democratic turnout.

                          http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...ten-obama-2012

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                          • Originally posted by InExile View Post
                            Interesting analysis at the NR. Turnout in 2016 may be down from 2012, and Trump ultimately got almost 6 million votes less than Obama did in 2012 and even 2 million less than Romney.

                            However, turnout is way higher when one considers the critical swing states. And it does appear that Trump would have edged Obama in Florida, Ohio and even (just barely) Pennsylvania. This adds up to a small electoral college victory for Trump over Obama himself. As the writer himself points out this is apples to oranges, but it does seem to show that higher Republican (mostly white) turnout in key states was a greater contributor to Trump's victory than depressed Democratic turnout.

                            http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...ten-obama-2012
                            from the same highly educated writer

                            My Prediction: Clinton 322, Trump 216
                            http://www.nationalreview.com/corner...-322-trump-216

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                            • Originally posted by drhuy View Post
                              a simple logic that many (supposedly educated) democrats dont seem to understand is that a NO VOTE is a vote itself.
                              You don't seem to understand that those leftist voters who abstained know that. Their no vote is a vote against the candidate and the party establishment. I know this because I have friends in that column. The wrong supposition is to think they vote for party affiliation rather than ideology.
                              Last edited by Triple C; 10 Nov 16,, 09:22.
                              All those who are merciful with the cruel will come to be cruel to the merciful.
                              -Talmud Kohelet Rabbah, 7:16.

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                              • Originally posted by Stitch View Post
                                And I think that's the key right there as to why Hillary didn't win; people didn't turn out in nearly as large of numbers as they did for Barack in 2006 and 2012. My best guess is that they just assumed Hillary would win, with or without their vote (or they didn't care either way), and simply stayed home instead of voting. Oops! By the time people realized what was happening, it was too late. No crying over spilled milk . . .

                                But isn't the converse also true of the right? How many NeverTrumpers stayed at home? Had they voted for Trump, how much bigger would his margin have been?
                                "They want to test our feelings.They want to know whether Muslims are extremists or not. Death to them and their newspapers."

                                Protester

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