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Thread: Tearful but proud daughter salutes Col MN Rai

  1. #16
    Senior Contributor antimony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deltacamelately View Post
    Also the Indian Army's casualty appetite has been pretty high for ages. Time to scale it down and lower the tolerance aspect as well. It takes decades to groom such fine soldiers and then waste them in a trifle.
    Col. Delta,

    The fact that the InA cares about collateral damage and is willing to put the blood of men and officers in line, instead of making do air strikes like some other in the neighbourhood, is what makes us all proud of our army.

    Yes, it is sad that our soldiers and officers get martyred, but I would submit that that should be resolved by getting people out of insurgency rather than placing less stress on collateral damage
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" ~ Epicurus

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by antimony View Post
    Col. Delta,

    The fact that the InA cares about collateral damage and is willing to put the blood of men and officers in line, instead of making do air strikes like some other in the neighbourhood, is what makes us all proud of our army.

    Yes, it is sad that our soldiers and officers get martyred, but I would submit that that should be resolved by getting people out of insurgency rather than placing less stress on collateral damage
    Patton and his followers would strongly disagree with you (and count me as one of them). Here's one of his quote,
    I want you to remember, that no poor dumb bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it, by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country.

  3. #18
    Senior Contributor antimony's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blademaster View Post
    Patton and his followers would strongly disagree with you (and count me as one of them). Here's one of his quote,
    We are talking about collateral damage, i.e. non-combatants. Patton would have put himself in the line of fire to save them. Shooting at innocents is not heroics, saving them is. And that is why we have the Indian Army, not the Pakistani one.
    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" ~ Epicurus

  4. #19
    Military Professional Deltacamelately's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by antimony View Post
    Col. Delta,

    The fact that the InA cares about collateral damage and is willing to put the blood of men and officers in line, instead of making do air strikes like some other in the neighbourhood, is what makes us all proud of our army.

    Yes, it is sad that our soldiers and officers get martyred, but I would submit that that should be resolved by getting people out of insurgency rather than placing less stress on collateral damage
    Antimony,

    My point is about the leaderships tolerance level. Nobody I know is itching to get trigger happy. They just want a free hand while dealing with the fkcks while people deliberate on why to remove AFSPA.
    And on the sixth day, God created the Field Artillery...

  5. #20
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    Colonel,

    I'm not reading the same book. What do you mean by "free hand?"
    Chimo

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Officer of Engineers View Post
    I'm not reading the same book. What do you mean by "free hand?"
    Sir, IIRC, their standard policy for many years is that local Kashmiri terrorists are encouraged to negotiate a surrender to the senior-most officer commanding the operations (as an assurance to the tango and the intermediaries that it is a legit offer); by contrast the foreign terrorists are killed immediately. In this case the tango's father and brother assured the COL that he was willing to surrender, and when the COL approached him the COL was killed through treachery. "Free Hand" can mean many things, but mostly it is a call to give more initiative to the lower ranks to assess the risks and make small deviations from the playbook so that operations don't become too predictable and thus exploitable.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cactus View Post
    Sir, IIRC, their standard policy for many years is that local Kashmiri terrorists are encouraged to negotiate a surrender to the senior-most officer commanding the operations (as an assurance to the tango and the intermediaries that it is a legit offer); by contrast the foreign terrorists are killed immediately. In this case the tango's father and brother assured the COL that he was willing to surrender, and when the COL approached him the COL was killed through treachery. "Free Hand" can mean many things, but mostly it is a call to give more initiative to the lower ranks to assess the risks and make small deviations from the playbook so that operations don't become too predictable and thus exploitable.
    Thank you.
    Chimo

  8. #23
    Military Professional Deltacamelately's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cactus View Post
    Sir, IIRC, their standard policy for many years is that local Kashmiri terrorists are encouraged to negotiate a surrender to the senior-most officer commanding the operations (as an assurance to the tango and the intermediaries that it is a legit offer); by contrast the foreign terrorists are killed immediately. In this case the tango's father and brother assured the COL that he was willing to surrender, and when the COL approached him the COL was killed through treachery. "Free Hand" can mean many things, but mostly it is a call to give more initiative to the lower ranks to assess the risks and make small deviations from the playbook so that operations don't become too predictable and thus exploitable.
    Thanks Cactus. I couldn't put it better.
    And on the sixth day, God created the Field Artillery...

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