Modi gives free hand to forces over Pak ceasefire violation

[Officer of Engineers]

We should teach them a lesson this time that they wouldn't think of striking us again for a very loooong time.

Beyond the pay grade of the engaging OC.

[commander]

The army full well knows what it can and cannot do at all times. To suggest otherwise is ridiculous.

What you mean to say is supposedly there is more latitude with this govt. I'm not yet convinced that is the case. The rhetoric might support it but facts and comparisons with previous actions are hard to find. All i get are tiny snippets from this article or that.

If i can't verify then i don't believe.

DE , I was not talking about the capability, I was talking about the boundary. How long do they keep up the firing, do we start talks or do we let them start the talks. Do we engage them diplomatically or do we wait for them to come down from their current position etc. THAT is made clear this time around and our guys are given a nod to keep firing until the enemy backs down and made it clear no talks till firing ends.

The Paks resumed firing on Saturday after a break from Thursday. How long will this continue ? We will see.

The UN had already snubbed pakistan for it's complaint against India's alleged ceasefire violation. I don't think this is going to last longer unless the Pakistani's are stupid.

[commander]

Lol...that is a myth propagated by the BJP so show that they are "oh so strong".
Every, battalion has its response strategy chalked out and they respond according to it.


If the enemy escalated the calibre, we escalated in kind.

Also my understanding so far was that of the hands of those in IA are tied beyond a certain limit (a limit I am guessing is very strict) and they won't be allowed to do what they wish (an appropriate or greater response) or unless instructed to do.

[commander]

Beyond the pay grade of the engaging OC.

But Sir, our PM is in direct contact with the appropriate personnel, those that are in the border. So the person who executes the commands gets his authorization from the highest authority in India directly. What more does a OC need ?

[Officer of Engineers]

Your understanding is limited.

The engaging outposts are at best section size, more often than not assault group (4 man) size. Now, the Pakistanis might mass but that means a platoon (32 men) against an assault group but the size of engagements ain't going to need national approval.

The Captain told you that each battalion has its own responses. That is the practical limit. Battalion can re-enforce even at company level almost immediately. Beyond that, however, would require hours for brigade to redirect troops from elsewhere and at best, it would be a single company. It would be days before another battalion arrives on scene.

So, in practical terms, there is a limit to immediate escalations. After that, time would allow more analysis and decision making.

[commander]

Your understanding is limited.

The engaging outposts are at best section size, more often than not assault group (4 man) size. Now, the Pakistanis might mass but that means a platoon (32 men) against an assault group but the size of engagements ain't going to need national approval.

The Captain told you that each battalion has its own responses. That is the practical limit. Battalion can re-enforce even at company level almost immediately. Beyond that, however, would require hours for brigade to redirect troops from elsewhere and at best, it would be a single company. It would be days before another battalion arrives on scene.

So, in practical terms, there is a limit to immediate escalations. After that, time would allow more analysis and decision making.

Thanks for explaining that to me Colonel. But considering this has been going on for more than 2 weeks now, what are the chances that they might have just done that already. Is it possible to keep such movement of troops under wraps or is it too big to cover it up ?

[Officer of Engineers]

I wouldn't know and I should not know. This is OPSEC territory.

[commander]

I wouldn't know and I should not know. This is OPSEC territory.

Oopz got it. I guess I ventured too much into this I guess .

[Batista]

UN snubs Pakistan, refuses to interfere on Kashmir

In a major embarrassment for Pakistan, the United Nations today ignored Pakistan's renewed efforts to internationalise the Kashmir issue.

The UN has snubbed Pakistan by refusing to intervene in this matter and stressed that India and Pakistan need to resolve all differences through dialogue to find a long-term solution to the dispute.Earlier, a letter was sent by Pakistan to UN Secretary General Ban Ki-moon accusing ndia for the current escalations in violence along the disputed border which has resulted in casualties of civilians.

The letter signed by Sartaj Aziz, adviser to Pakistan Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif on national security and foreign affairs, had sought the intervention of the UN to resolve the border tensions."During the period of Oct 1-10, 2014, 20 ceasefire violations along the LoC were reported, resulting in 12 civilian deaths, 52 injured civilians and nine injured military personnel on the Pakistani side," Aziz said.

The Pakistani envoy said that utmost restraint was observed by Pakistan despite several provocations by Indian military."The Government of Pakistan sincerely hopes that better sense would prevail on the Indian side to prevent the situation from spiralling out of control," the advisor said.

India and Pakistan entered into a war of words last week over the situation at the LoC at the UN General Assembly where India said that it was a "matter of deep regret" that Pakistan violated the ceasefire.Defence Minister Arun Jaitley clearly said that the Indian s armed forces are "fully ready" to respond to "provocation". He also said that the onus of creating a positive environment for normalisation of relations is on Pakistan.

This was expected the "International Community" is not interested in the LIES of Pakistan and sick and tired of this drama queen.

[Oracle]

This was expected the "International Community" is not interested in the LIES of Pakistan and sick and tired of this drama queen.

In other words the International community is not interested in giving a lap dance to Indian and Pakistani complaints and concerns. You don't get it, there are more pressing issues than the Indo-Pak border. Not enough to blink the big boys.

[Batista]

In other words the International community is not interested in giving a lap dance to Indian and Pakistani complaints and concerns. You don't get it, there are more pressing issues than the Indo-Pak border. Not enough to blink the big boys.

India goes to UN and cry a river about it's issues and asks for intervention?

Seems like it's you who don't understand.

[barangai]

The response was possibly known to Pakistan already,they just want to put this news into international picture.

[Blademaster]

See what I said. Your hate for the Brits is legendary and yet you want to be knighted.

:slap:
Your sense of logic is impeccable.
To borrow a quote from a wise guy, "You are on crack"

You are not an Indian. Period.

Yes I am and you don't have the final say on this. So suck my neighbor's dog's dick.

So you haven't read. You don't and you never would.

oooohhh. Is that your comeback?? I am supposed to be stunned into silence by your gem of wisdom? Your level of intelligence (or rather a lack of) is shining like a beacon for all of us to see.

Demanded respect. From you? Who in the hell are you? You sure ain't getting it anywhere and you want it here?

Ha ha ha ha!! I already have earned the respect of several Wabbers on this forum long before you ever came aboard this forum and you are telling me that I got no respect. Listen clueless shit for brain, it is you that do not have respect despite your pathetic attempts of currying favor among the Wabbers.

Can anybody silence you? That's rich coming from you. You're sound like a trumpet on an eerie night.

And you sound like a braying ass stuck in a mudpit.

I voted for Modi and I like his policies. I have made that perfectly clear on this board numerous times. Action Item for you - go back and read my posts about Modi, instead of unnecessary rants.

Oh really?? Then what was all the posts about RSS, his "stance" against minorities, or catering to the far evil yindoo right? You criticized him left and right before and during the elections and thought that he shouldn't win or be the prime minister.

You still haven't come out clearly as to where your loyalty lies. An American who loyalty lies with India, or an Indian-origin confused soul living off of America. I find it amusing that you cry hoarse about the West all the time. And being ashamed for what ails India is the first step in recognizing what's wrong in India, unlike you I don't stand up for the wrongs or try to push them under the carpet. And that is not even your country I'm arguing with you for. Damn!

Because you do not have the right to question my loyalty. You don't even deserve to have the right to ask. And before asking, why don't you tell us this forum about yourself before asking anyone else to discuss his background. And the esteemed members of this forum understand where my loyalties lie and respect for who I am and that include OOE, who you have a fanboyish worship for. That also includes Col DCL and Captain Lemontree. You can ask them personally since you put their opinions so highly over me.

Only a person who have a fetish for Gestaponish organizations and ideology would ask that question. You asking this question has already revealed the character of who you are.

And who are you to talk about loyalty? After all, on several occasions, you have stated how ashamed you are to be Indian to the WAB. A true Indian wouldn't say such things.

I asked for data, commander didn't give any. If you have it, post it instead of whining.

I'm sorry that has to start with you, for someone so engrossed with himself.

Speaketh of somebody who has a very high opinion of himself that he tells posters off for being fanboyish or being stupid because they don't listen to OOE, DCL, and Captain Lemontree.

You are now saying things for me? Fail. Since I never said those. If Indian soldiers have been killed, so have Pakistani soldiers too. Actions from the Pakistan side are matched equally or more. And what about nuking Pakistan I don't understand? Or missed? Make me understand instead of acting like a teenage girl on periods.

So? Enlighten me the one, the one and only Genius of 21st Century America. India should nuke Pakistan, then Pakistan would nuke India, while fanbois like you living 1000's of miles away sit on the couch, watch it on TV while sipping a cappuccino?

And where do you exactly live? Do you live right near the borders? After all you live 1000 mile away from the Indo-Pak border and you sit on your sofa sipping chai and hacking away at your PC and watching tv. Do you not see the (il)logic of your post?

I would take a mix of OOE+DCL+LT and some more posters anyday, than yours.

Funny, in almost every post I make, I would get a cordial response from OOE, DCL, or LT or one of the other posters. Have you been ignoring those responses? Or you prefer not to acknowledge them knowing that these people do not share your outlook of me? You are a class act.

Really? Then please help me learn since it is you who claim 4K+ posts and 'I'm longer here' and 'I'm intelligent' on almost all of your posts directed towards me. Infact, OOE helps me out when I don't know things or for that matter TH. What do you do? You go on a rampage, trying to portray you know all. Your posts and you get a thrashing when it is not directed at me, just one example would be the Ukraine thread.

At least I have the courage to speak on what's on my mind and say what is good for India no matter how distasteful it may sounds to the western posters. After all, I didn't suck up to the westerners by saying how ashamed I was of GoI for staying silent on Russia's actions. Funny how you questioned my loyalty when you should have known that Russia has stood by India during her hours of greatest needs and crises and that staying silent on such issues, India is showing the world that she would not abandon her friend and ally. But no, you want India to abandon Russia to curry favor with the West because you think the West are right and morally superior and that you were ashamed of India. In fact y you have stated several times that you are ashamed to be Indian.

As for throwing a rant, I didn't throw off a rant, I pointed out the duplicity and hypocrisy of the western stance and some posters, including TH, had very thin skin about it. After all, they keep banning Russian posters and passing their posts off as some propaganda machine.

I have an image that perfectly describes who you are like this person here before Jayalitha, only you before a westerner.

Google Image Result for http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/03/26/article-2120782-12583E04000005DC-67_634x640.jpg

That is the problem, you invoke WAB. You need to speak for yourself.

No, you are the one that keep invoking WAB and I returned the favor to you to show that YOU NEED TO SPEAK FOR YOURSELF! Case in point, you kept referring to the Ukraine thread and the alleged "thrashing" I got (only in your imagination) and on other instances you have referred to the WAB rules when you have taken the role of correcting a poster.

Doesn't sound like a poster speaking for himself but attempting to use the WAB against the other person. Funny how the tables are turned against you? ?

[Blademaster]

In other words the International community is not interested in giving a lap dance to Indian and Pakistani complaints and concerns. You don't get it, there are more pressing issues than the Indo-Pak border. Not enough to blink the big boys.

You don't get it. Pakistan is the one that is bringing up the issues, not India. Pakistan was the first to complain about it and India responded with the evidence and the "International Community" took a pass on it.

[Double Edge]

How long do they keep up the firing, do we start talks or do we let them start the talks. Do we engage them diplomatically or do we wait for them to come down from their current position etc. THAT is made clear this time around and our guys are given a nod to keep firing until the enemy backs down and made it clear no talks till firing ends.

My daily had this to say

Top security officials are not expecting a sudden lull on the border where Pakistan has been violating ceasefire in the past couple of weeks.

Though there is no firing from the Pakistani side for now, sources said the forces have been asked to stay alert as the border will remain hot for some time.

“Our position has not changed. Do not provoke but if there is a provocation, retaliate. If there is firing, return fire is the dictum,” a senior official said.

In the meeting attended by Home Secretary Anil Goswami, Intelligence Bureau Director Asif Ibrahim and Border Security Force Director-General D K Pathak, the home minister instructed that there should be strong retaliation if the border posts were targeted.

The UN had already snubbed pakistan for it's complaint against India's alleged ceasefire violation. I don't think this is going to last longer unless the Pakistani's are stupid.

our guys say otherwise

Looks like the PA is testing the new administrations resolve and vice versa. Getting to know each other.