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why do people lie about their military service?

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  • #16
    Walter Mitty Marine: Ex-wife exposes bogus war hero in Cenotaph march

    As the Royal Marines marched past the Cenotaph on Remembrance Sunday, Elaine Deane spotted a familiar face on her TV screen.
    It was her ex-husband Paul McFarlane - and he was up to his old tricks.
    Contrary to the medals and regimental beret he was wearing, he never served in the Royal Marines.
    Paul Mcfarlane marches past the Cenotaph alongside genuine war veterans on Remembrance Sunday

    He was kicked out after a couple of weeks in basic training.
    Yet the 54-year-old former lorry driver persists in masquerading as a war hero who saw action in the Falklands.
    ‘I was livid to see him parading in that uniform and medals he hasn’t earned,’ said Miss Deane, 49, who kicked him out of their home near Chester after discovering his lies.
    ‘He’s been going on marches for years but when I found out the truth I contacted every organisation in a 30-mile radius. He’s obviously got around that by going to London.
    ‘I don’t know why he does it but I think it makes him feel important.’

    McFarlane met Miss Deane in January 1995 and, when they married three months later, he wore a Royal Marines uniform.
    ‘He was all dressed up, as bold as brass, even though I had friends from the military there,’ she said.
    ‘He was very comfortable with it all and said he’d been posted to Cyprus, Germany and, for some reason, Jersey.’
    Doubts crept in when she heard him claiming he had served in the Royal Engineers, contradicting what he had told her.
    But she stood by her husband, who like her had three children from a previous marriage, although he was often unemployed and she had to do two jobs as a cook and care assistant to support the family.
    In January 2008 she heard that he was claiming they owned a holiday home in Spain. Doubting everything he had ever told her, she demanded he send off for his service record – and had her worst fears confirmed.
    ‘I said I’d had enough and told him to pack his bags,’
    she said.
    After he had gone she said she found military regalia including uniforms and canes in the attic, along with keys which turned out to fit the munitions cupboard of a navy cadet force where he had helped.
    McFarlane, who is now living with his third wife, Debbie, and works as a doorman, insisted his military record was genuine when confronted at their home in Hawarden, north Wales.
    He said: ‘I joined the Royal Marines in Brighton as a
    cadet from school. I then served at Bickleigh Barracks [near Plymouth] from 1972
    to 1991.
    ‘I am a Falklands veteran. I sailed out on Canberra and came back on the QE2.
    Of course I never served in the Royal Engineers - that’s a contradiction in terms, isn’t it?’ His new wife added that he had medals for ‘Northern Ireland, the South Antarctic and In the Service of Peace’, saying: ‘My grandfather was in the First World War and I don’t believe Paul would have tried to bluff his way through about serving in the Royal Marines, knowing that.’


    However, McFarlane failed to produce a single piece of evidence of his time in the service or any photographs showing him with fellow Marines in combat zones or other postings.
    When pressed about Royal Marines Association membership, he admitted having the uncompleted paperwork at his house. He also gave three different final ranks – colour sergeant, corporal and lance corporal.
    And given the opportunity to ask former colleagues to confirm his claims, he said: ‘All the people who could vouch for me being in the Royal Marines have told me they would rather not get involved.’
    At the Cenotaph, McFarlane wore the uniform, cap badge and belt buckle of the Royal Engineers along with the General Service Medal of 1962 and the United Nations Force in Cyprus Medal, awarded for three months’ service keeping peace between Greek and Turkish Cypriots.
    The Royal Marines Association yesterday said that members were issued with tickets to join the march past the Cenotaph but McFarlane might have managed to slip in without one. A spokesman said: ‘I don’t recognise him and we don’t have a member by that name.’
    A Ministry of Defence source confirmed the service number McFarlane gave to the Daily Mail does not exist and is not even similar to typical Royal Marine identification numbers.
    He added: ‘It’s safe to say he’s never been in the Marines.’
    Told that McFarlane claimed to have served for 19 years from 1972, an MoD spokesman said: ‘Between those dates there is no one of that name who served with the Royal Navy or the Marine

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    • #17
      Originally posted by desertswo View Post
      I find it interesting that you don't know the answer...........
      Of course I knew the answer or an answer. I was being quite facitious for the benefit of our studio audience at home.

      The way I heard it was that Admirals would carry around their own special cooks and would provide them with the answers to ensure they kept them.

      So the books were locked up, but why the XO? Because the Admiral signed the CO's fitrep but not necessarily the XO's. In a way they do, but not directly, so it was a step removed from being to influence the holder of the books before the test.

      As it was, that was one of those "shi**y little jobs" I did, proctoring the rating exams, checking the MS ones in and out from the XO, and destroying those that required it.

      SHRUG........while when you are seen by the command as an excess officer, such things happen, it can be informative to see what information this or that rate is required to know.
      Last edited by Tamara; 08 Jul 14,, 20:43.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Tamara View Post
        Of course I knew the answer or an answer. I was being quite facitious for the benefit of our studio audience at home.

        The way I heard it was that Admirals would carry around their own special cooks and would provide them with the answers to ensure they kept them.

        So the books were locked up, but why the XO? Because the Admiral signed the CO's fitrep but not necessarily the XO's. In a way they do, but not directly, so it was a step removed from being to influence the holder of the books before the test.
        Never spent much time around Flag and General Officers, have you? I'm not slamming you, but the first thing one learns when working on a major staff that has more freaking stars than a night sky in the desert outside my window, is that they don't have time to get into that sort of nonsense. Now, one of their "palace dogs" (someone like me for instance; four stripes our no, I made my share of coffee for the "heavies"), might well take some off the wall comment by his or her boss FORAC, but even that is rare (See Henry II and Thomas Becket; murder of).

        Regardless, the real issue at the time was that many of the non-Filipino people in the MS rating were falling behind because the fix wasn't in for them. They complained, and someone listened.
        Last edited by desertswo; 08 Jul 14,, 20:50.

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        • #19
          BTW Tamara, did you put two and two together on why I and my three friends were thumped a bit while trying to access the base back in 1973 (something we routinely did as all three of us were dependents, and we used to go to the movies. 25 cents was all it cost back then, a deal no matter how you cut it)? Here's a hint; "Yom Kippur." ;)

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          • #20
            Originally posted by Tamara View Post
            As it was, that was one of those "shi**y little jobs" I did, proctoring the rating exams, checking the MS ones in and out from the XO, and destroying those that required it.
            Don't think SLJs stop just because one achieves a certain pay grade. You know what my routine SLJ was on the Joint Staff? I was the "witness" for Navy Flag Officers peeing in the bottle during the monthly random urinalysis. I had to watch Admiral Billy Joe Jim Bob wiz away. They wouldn't accept anything less than a Captain, so it was "Tag, your it!"

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            • #21
              Originally posted by desertswo View Post
              Never spent much time around Flag and General Officers, have you? I'm not slamming you, but the first thing one learns when working on a major staff that has more freaking stars than a night sky in the desert outside my window, is that they don't have time to get into that sort of nonsense. Now, one of their "palace dogs" (someone like me for instance; four stripes our no, I made my share of coffee for the "heavies"), might well take some off the wall comment by his or her boss FORAC, but even that is rare (See Henry II and Thomas Becket; murder of).

              Regardless, the real issue at the time was that many of the non-Filipino people in the MS rating were falling behind because the fix wasn't in for them. They complained, and someone listened.
              Well, (about time around), No.....and Yes.

              On sea duty, No. I remember once being around the exchange area and seeing with something of awe this officer with a star on his collar. For a few seconds, I didn't quite know what I was seeing for usually, the highest one usually sees was full birds. As it was, after saluting, I realized that he was the Charleston Base Commander. Once there, I saw an approaching van, flags flying, headlights on approaching on the main drive. I stopped, came to attention, and saluted on the side of the street and I think an aide in the shotgun seat returned the salute as they passed by. A non USNA Admiral did my SWOS graduation. And I believe it was SURFLANT who came to "visit" us on one ship I was on.

              But other than those 4 times, on sea duty, no, hardly at all.

              When I was a Security Officer at a shore station, different item though, although as previously stated, that particular posting was an assortment of unique situations. One of the biggest ones was that my Captain was the most senior Captain in the Navy and there only about 5 people or so between him and the President in my chain of command............so there weren't that many people who could override his orders to me.

              Now I don't recall in that job meeting, seeing too many flag officers around where I was. I was in an isolated area. There was a General at a gate search who didn't like it that I was going to search his Bronco (I think). Ie, went something like this, "And there is nothing I can say to dissuade you?"
              "No, Sir." A few minutes later, he took the only option he had and left the station. On the way out, he stopped astride of the gate shack, leaned out, and said,
              "Lieutenant, I'm leaving! I don't have time for such nonsense."
              And I came to attention, clicked my boots, saluted,and said, "As you wish, Sir.".

              I did get called to a POTUS security briefing which had lowly me and a lot of O-4's through O-6's at it. There may have been a flag there as well, may have been a flag who said he didn't trust sailors with guns which infuriated me silently because I had spent so much time, money, and effort training the ASF for such jobs, but I don't clearly recall now.

              Going in and out of NAF at Andrews AFB, we were cautioned that a lot of high rollers such as Admirals and Secretaries go through there, be careful what you say for you don't know who might overhear, but I think the closest I came to a run in was seeing the Aide, a woman, salute outside the Norfolk shuttle. On a side point to that world, did have to go through the Pentagon once to and from the Naval Annex. Little officer lost in the BIG world, two things I recall. First of all, I was at the Pentagon because that was the only place I could find to park. Still not knowing how to get to the Naval Annex other than hoofing it, I asked a passing Air Force Sgt., addressed him as "Technical Sgt." and found out about the shuttle. It's a minor point but to me, it's memorable in how in a very complex world, I moved in it using dossiers and protocols as my guide.

              Secondly, when I was at the Annex, someone looking for help sought me out because on my name tag was "Security Officer" (but with my command's name). If you look proper, impressive, the lost seem to find you.

              And after a while in that job, I had, I guess, a reputation for being ruthless, mercenary. Admiral Kelso was coming to visit an interior command and that security message has sent me a message of, "Tamm, Kelso is a prima donna! Handle with kid gloves!". Don't think I saw him that day, though.

              Now, about 1973 and Yom Kippur.

              In 1973 during the Yom Kippur war, I was still a child, living in....................Dhahran, Saudi Arabia.

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              • #22
                By the way, the corrollary to SLJO is a JAFSO.....Just Another F-ing Staff Officer!!!

                I completed my years of service with 2 rows of ribbons, a couple of pairs of wings and a CIB w Blank Adapter (AKA an EIB).

                Despite 3 different sets of orders I did not go to Desert Storm (though I had been in the AO prior to it). Was too you for Viet Nam (THANK GOD!!!)

                Despite all of that I never believed I had to make up any stories to improve my "standing". I figured I stood on the wall in Geramny against the Soviet Union back at a time when we truly believed the next LARIAT ADVANCED was going to be for real. We built the doctrine, organizations and equipment that made DS/DS possible. I proudly was a rifle company comamnder, when that went to war about 9 months after I left command and by all accounts did damn well. And turned into a damn good logistician whose ideas were validated and executed by others in the crucible of several conflicts. So I figured my accomplishments were good enough.

                I did my bit.

                I just figured my life was too rich and rewarding to try to be in the other guys' war story.
                “Loyalty to country ALWAYS. Loyalty to government, when it deserves it.”
                Mark Twain

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by desertswo View Post
                  Don't think SLJs stop just because one achieves a certain pay grade. You know what my routine SLJ was on the Joint Staff? I was the "witness" for Navy Flag Officers peeing in the bottle during the monthly random urinalysis. I had to watch Admiral Billy Joe Jim Bob wiz away. They wouldn't accept anything less than a Captain, so it was "Tag, your it!"
                  That was a miserable job and one of my harsh learning lessons.

                  I had to observe an O-5 do it. At the time, I was somewhat entrenched in my learned respect for senior officers though I had already been stabbed in the back before by one or two on ships for it. I allowed the Commander lots of "courtesies" by not observing directly, not requiring removal of the jacket, and the Commander slammed me down for it, took the program away from my "MP" department and gave it over to the chiefs.

                  IF a senior officer is doing drugs, they will do anything they can to stop you from finding out, that would stop them from getting their retirement pay. They will come in with hidden bottles of someone else's pee, lie to you, intimidate you, perhaps even discredit you, set you up for a fall, or worse.

                  So considering the full extent of it, it creates quite a paradox in a world where one "is brought up" to obey and respect their senior officers. Over time, I suppose, one could develop a complex wondering if each word told to them is the actual word......or if someone is "cheating".

                  The best solution is to follow the procedures absolutely.

                  Even so, back then, talking with other Vets at times, I've ran into enough who believed that they didn't have to follow the regulations, that they didn't have to listen to "military police", that they knew better themselves.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Albany Rifles View Post
                    ..........Despite all of that I never believed I had to make up any stories to improve my "standing"...............
                    By nature, I don't make up stories. One knows what Francis Powers said, yes? "The hardest thing about lying is remembering your lies.".

                    But both by knack and by training, I do have a talent for "operational deception" on various levels. I am often quite aware that for what I say, people will get the wrong thought in their head and since I don't correct what they are thinking, they will run with it and believe it.

                    SHOULD I correct those thoughts? Should I talk with enough details so people clearly understand the situation? No and perhaps Yes.

                    No, because that is my life, that is what I do, that is how I am effective. If I start playing nice, thinking that I should guide people's thinking, then I might impair my natural ability to always be ready to see things in that light. A modern "example", in both directions.

                    A couple of years back in a class on special police units, we were doing a quick exercise of a local incident, say a shooting, and my group were the "dispatchers". I insisted that one of our answers was to request a counter intelligence officer to monitor our communications, our public information line, to detect whether or not there could be someone "out there" who was trying to get more information than what a concerned member of the public should be trying to get. My classmates, most of them career civil police officers, had never heard of doing that, having a counter intelligence officer around. To me, it was one of the things I had learned to watch out for in the Navy and afterwards.

                    Same class, take home final, now it was a shooting of an unknown type in a building at an university. Ie, shots fired, someone down, but no knowledge of what's going on in the building. We were given for our disposal special police units, besides patrol and SWAT, mounted patrol and narcotics (probably a few others, but I recall those). Realizing that any relative with a student there would be descending on the university, I said put them and press on one of the athletic fields far from the incident...........and then put narcotics in that crowd, undercover, to look for, detect, potential counter agents, confederates.

                    As said, that's how I think, that's often my value today in such matters. To start playing nice and being fully informative to what I say may harm that ability.

                    But.....Yes.......because my way of communicating probably makes me no better than a politician.....................

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                    • #25
                      It the stylish uniforms...find the story of "MSgt Soup Sandwich". Pictures or it didn't happen....





                      Poser piss me off, too. Sometimes people lie to downplay their service to avoid unnecessary and stupid questions (like a guy I once met who looked like he could bench press a rhino - and worked in admin). And some are just oxygen theives.
                      Attached Files
                      "Bother", said Poo, chambering another round.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Tamara View Post
                        I had to observe an O-5 do it. At the time, I was somewhat entrenched in my learned respect for senior officers though I had already been stabbed in the back before by one or two on ships for it. I allowed the Commander lots of "courtesies" by not observing directly, not requiring removal of the jacket, and the Commander slammed me down for it, took the program away from my "MP" department and gave it over to the chiefs.
                        on my last 2 ships, it was generally E6 and above that were the observers for the random urinalysis, and if the Chief in charge caught you walking around the ship without anything to do, he'd ask if you wanted to assist him on conducting it, especially on my last command the USS Halsey. Since we were in a 5 section rotation as CSOOW, it didn't bother me too much to do it..

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                        • #27
                          No idea why people do it. I still feel a bit stupid for hVing the military professional tag here. My military service was like army tourism. Lots of posters here are real proffesionals whom I admire.
                          Originally posted by GVChamp
                          College students are very, very, very dumb. But that's what you get when the government subsidizes children to sit in the middle of a corn field to drink alcohol and fuck.

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                          • #28
                            A large part of society idolizes the military, so people will lie about their service record to be admired.
                            A large part of society idolizes clergy, so people will lie about being a reverend to be admired.
                            A large part of society idolizes doctors, so people will lie about being a doctor to be admired.

                            If I'm not mistaken people used to wear airline pilot uniforms on their night out to get laid.
                            So some people will ie about being a pilot I guess.

                            I look a bit with suspicion at this whole "idolizing" of the military.
                            A bit too similar to what I've read about how the Germans considered their military before WW1 and WW2.
                            Appreciation of the military is OK, appreciation to the point of idolizing, not for me.

                            May not sit well with some of the military professionals here, but it wouldn't really change my opinion.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by FJV View Post
                              A large part of society idolizes the military, so people will lie about their service record to be admired.
                              A large part of society idolizes clergy, so people will lie about being a reverend to be admired.
                              A large part of society idolizes doctors, so people will lie about being a doctor to be admired.

                              If I'm not mistaken people used to wear airline pilot uniforms on their night out to get laid.
                              So some people will ie about being a pilot I guess.

                              I look a bit with suspicion at this whole "idolizing" of the military.
                              A bit too similar to what I've read about how the Germans considered their military before WW1 and WW2.
                              Appreciation of the military is OK, appreciation to the point of idolizing, not for me.

                              May not sit well with some of the military professionals here, but it wouldn't really change my opinion.
                              \

                              Actually, I rather doubt you'd find any military professionals here who would have a problem with not being "idolized." I'll give you an example; when people learn that I am a retired officer these days, they come up with this almost Pavlovian response by saying, "Thank you for your service." That is a relatively recent phenomenon, and certainly not something that occurred routinely in my 25 years of active duty. I'm 58, so I remember when we weren't too popular, and more to the point were often the butt of jokes and stereotypes at our expense, so being thanked does beat that. However, I really don't know how to respond, which just ends up making me feel uncomfortable, even though I know they mean well. The God's honest truth is that with a few exceptions and rough times we all have "on the job," I really had a hell of a good time, and while I wouldn't have done it for free, I probably would have taken less every month for the pleasure.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Ha Desertstwo, I got a thank you in California in a gay bar of all places. I said dont thank me I was just a reservist. He was dead serious too and repeated it. Did I mention he was the stripper? Threw me big time and I went red.

                                In my defence the wife wanted to go in to see naked dudes and I take her to the peelers so fair is fair. I got some free drinks too!

                                Score.
                                Originally posted by GVChamp
                                College students are very, very, very dumb. But that's what you get when the government subsidizes children to sit in the middle of a corn field to drink alcohol and fuck.

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