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Thread: The Walking Dead zombie bug seems to have given its living characters brain damage

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    The Walking Dead zombie bug seems to have given its living characters brain damage

    in addition to turning its dead characters into zombies. What are the elementary mistakes made by the Walking Dead community that even its Stone Age counterpart would have avoided? I'll start this off with the following items:

    1. They use valuable (and irreplaceable) gasoline/diesel to burn staked zombies instead of firewood.
    2. They rely on existing wire fences to keep out the zombies, instead of constructing palisades.
    3. They don't build watch towers so they can see zombies or hostile humans coming from far away.
    4. They don't clear the foliage for at least a few hundred yards around the settlement so they can have greater visibility around the compound.
    5. They don't dig pits around the fences so as to make it more difficult for zombies to either topple or climb the fences.
    6. They don't sweep around the settlement in increasingly large circles in order to enlarge the zone of safety around the settlement.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mithridates View Post
    in addition to turning its dead characters into zombies. What are the elementary mistakes made by the Walking Dead community that even its Stone Age counterpart would have avoided? I'll start this off with the following items:

    1. They use valuable (and irreplaceable) gasoline/diesel to burn staked zombies instead of firewood.
    2. They rely on existing wire fences to keep out the zombies, instead of constructing palisades.
    3. They don't build watch towers so they can see zombies or hostile humans coming from far away.
    4. They don't clear the foliage for at least a few hundred yards around the settlement so they can have greater visibility around the compound.
    5. They don't dig pits around the fences so as to make it more difficult for zombies to either topple or climb the fences.
    6. They don't sweep around the settlement in increasingly large circles in order to enlarge the zone of safety around the settlement.
    7 - That no one got the brains to ask the Klingons for help.

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    Senior Contributor Monash's Avatar
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    So in the first few days after the 'pandemic' started US authorities didn't have the manpower and resources to secure at least a few islands, peninsulas, mountain tops etc as refuges? What happened to all that Nuclear conflict planning? No secure facilities for government, no secure communications no ships to take off refugees?
    Last edited by Monash; 20 May 14, at 04:20.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Monash View Post
    So in the first few days after the 'pandemic' started US authorities didn't have the manpower and resources to secure at least a few islands, peninsulas, mountain tops etc as refuges? What happened to all that Nuclear conflict planning? No secure facilities for government, no secure communications no ships to take off refugees?
    I think the show's assumption is that they were overwhelmed before they figured out the nature of the zombies. Obviously it concerns itself with the day-to-day lives of people who are cut off from any semblance of civilization (i.e. large scale human settlements of at least thousands). Even if we accept the basic premise of the show, that central authority is history, for the moment, the behavior of the protagonists is so dumb, if we substituted a wolf for every zombie in the show, the protagonists would all be dead.

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    Senior Contributor Monash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mithridates View Post
    Even if we accept the basic premise of the show, that central authority is history, for the moment, the behavior of the protagonists is so dumb, if we substituted a wolf for every zombie in the show, the protagonists would all be dead.
    My point still stands though, wholesale nuclear strikes don't exactly proceed at zombie like speed. They should have been able to initiate some kind of limited response. My faith in the American Government and the efficiency of its bureaucracy is shattered I tell you, shattered!

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigross86 View Post
    It's Hollywood. What do you expect?

    My friend and I watched the remake of Dawn of the Dead in the theater. Remember that scene where the gun store owner set up on the roof of his store and picked off zombies for fun? My friend asked me how much ammo does an average gun store like that have? My answer was "enough to clear a small city of zombies."

    If zombies were the "Walking Dead" type walkers rather than the super fast tidal wave zombies like "World War Z" or "Dawn of the Dead," then an average gun owner like me could clear a few thousands without breaking a sweat.
    "Only Nixon can go to China." -- Old Vulcan proverb.

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    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigross86 View Post
    There are a lot of things the author gets wrong. And most of them are spelled out in the comments section so I won't repeat them here.
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

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    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monash View Post
    My point still stands though, wholesale nuclear strikes don't exactly proceed at zombie like speed. They should have been able to initiate some kind of limited response. My faith in the American Government and the efficiency of its bureaucracy is shattered I tell you, shattered!
    If you watch the first season, it does show the military bombing a city. There is also a tank shown at an intersection when Rick goes into Atlanta and the CDC is surrounded with built up fighting positions that were overrun.

    I've never read the comic books but am a fan of the TV series.

    I don't know the percentage of people that were infected in the first wave, Ben's link uses 99%. But lets say that it was somewhere around 20%. This affects the military also.

    Soldiers don't walk around with a combat load of ammo all the time. Units normally only have ammo on hand for the OOD and SOG (60rds 9mm) and a few mags each for the Armory guard/react force. Lets say 10 individuals x 30 rds for 300 rds of 5.56. During the day that ammo is kept locked up normally at the armory. Same place the weapons are held. The airfields don't keep fueled and loaded planes on deck (unless they are on alert or conducting training). And the bases have a limited amount of fuel stored on base. Same with ammo in the ammo dump. 2d MarDiv is not stepping off base with enough Beans , Bullets and bandages to conduct to sustained operations. Neither is 2d MAW going to have pilots, mechs, fuel and ammo to conduct a minor campaign. Don't forget that everyone bit/killed turns into a zombie.

    How many armorers turned? How many people at the ammo dump? How many people in the chain turned? Did the guy that carries the nuclear football turn? How many people in the silos turned? How many that didn't turn would refuse to nuke American soil?

    How many people, in the first days, wouldn't shoot because they didn't understand the threat? Or because they zombies were their family, friends, neighbors, co-workers?
    Last edited by Gun Grape; 21 May 14, at 04:51.
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

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    Senior Contributor Triple C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monash View Post
    So in the first few days after the 'pandemic' started US authorities didn't have the manpower and resources to secure at least a few islands, peninsulas, mountain tops etc as refuges? What happened to all that Nuclear conflict planning? No secure facilities for government, no secure communications no ships to take off refugees?
    Exactly what happened in World War Z the novel. The world governments survived by building fire bases to defend vital industries and air-supplied survivor pockets. Then when they had enough ammo and manpower, they pushed out in a ten year long offensive that wiped out the zombies.
    All those who are merciful with the cruel will come to be cruel to the merciful.
    -Talmud Kohelet Rabbah, 7:16.

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    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple C View Post
    Exactly what happened in World War Z the novel. The world governments survived by building fire bases to defend vital industries and air-supplied survivor pockets. Then when they had enough ammo and manpower, they pushed out in a ten year long offensive that wiped out the zombies.
    But this is a different type of Zombie and from the looks of it the infection happened quickly.
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mithridates View Post
    in addition to turning its dead characters into zombies. What are the elementary mistakes made by the Walking Dead community that even its Stone Age counterpart would have avoided? I'll start this off with the following items:

    [*]They use valuable (and irreplaceable) gasoline/diesel to burn staked zombies instead of firewood.
    Why do you think gas is more valuable than firewood?

    Ever tried to cook with a gasoline or diesel fire? or use it to stay warm?
    Not a lot of running vehicles or generators to use that fuel in.
    [*]They rely on existing wire fences to keep out the zombies, instead of constructing palisades.[*]They don't build watch towers so they can see zombies or hostile humans coming from far away.[*]They don't clear the foliage for at least a few hundred yards around the settlement so they can have greater visibility around the compound.[*]They don't dig pits around the fences so as to make it more difficult for zombies to either topple or climb the fences.[*]They don't sweep around the settlement in increasingly large circles in order to enlarge the zone of safety around the settlement.
    They are , for the most part, civilian types and not schooled in military history. Nor are most skilled in the use of tools, or growing food.

    They wouldn't know about clearing "fields of fire" or creating "Zones of Safety". There have been a few exceptions spread out among the various groups.

    Another thing is that all these things are labor intensive. Doesn't seem to be many backhoes/buldozers, or the skilled operators hanging around. And the noise would bring lots of walkers.

    Or other survivors that may not be so nice. Notice how the Gov and his last group decided they wanted the prison. And sharing with the people there wasn't an option to them. Een though they were offered the chance to come in and join the community. Not everyone wants to play nice. And when there is no law, some do not have the moral compass to do the right thing.

    Except for Woodbury, the groups have not been large enough to do those things.
    How many of the people in Ricks group have the skills to build walls or guard towers? Where do the tools and materials come from?

    While building the palisades, digging the pits, what is the ratio of workers to security?

    Why would you not use the fence and guard towers already in place?

    The last issue is diet. Its early in the infection and most survivors are subsisting by scavenging. The things you want then to do require energy. The people on the WD are, for the most part living on a sustainment diet at best. You are wanting them to burn calories they don't have.

    Kirkman doesn't get everything right. but he isn't doing a horrible job.
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

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    Senior Contributor Triple C's Avatar
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    Not sure about the zombies being different. It's been awhile but in so far as I recall, World War Z is also classic Romero zombie, with the exception that it's strongly implied to be caused by a weaponized virus.
    All those who are merciful with the cruel will come to be cruel to the merciful.
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    Resident Curmudgeon Military Professional Gun Grape's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Triple C View Post
    Not sure about the zombies being different. It's been awhile but in so far as I recall, World War Z is also classic Romero zombie, with the exception that it's strongly implied to be caused by a weaponized virus.
    By different, I mean that the zombies on Walking Dead are a fast happening event. Like the Romero zombies in Night of the Living Dead. One day the dead just rise up.

    In WWZ, it started as an isolated incident in Russia. Countries had time to take actions before the virus spread worldwide. WWZ zombies are also fast runners not the classic slow walking Romero one
    Its called Tourist Season. So why can't we shoot them?

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    Senior Contributor Monash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gun Grape View Post
    By different, I mean that the zombies on Walking Dead are a fast happening event. Like the Romero zombies in Night of the Living Dead. One day the dead just rise up.
    Wow there a second. They cant be that fast happening. I mean the dead can't just 'rise up' and take over like that. On any one day the % of dead bodies in the average community is surprisingly small. Sure the ones at the local undertaker or the hospital morgue can 'rise up' but the ones at the cemetery or crematorium aren't going anywhere. (You try digging yourself out from under and 6ft of compressed earth, coffin or no coffin. So that means the infection (in Walking dead I believe it was a virus) has to be spread. You either get bit which if I remember correctly takes a couple of days to kill you or you die from some other means and then rise up.

    Which brings me to another of my personal bones of contention with The Walking Dead. If as the survivors later discover everyone is infected due to the (apparently) airborne spread of the disease why does being being bitten kill you but not any other wound, cut or incision? How many times have members of the cast been shot, stabbed, given birth or otherwise been left bleeding out copious amounts of blood with no apparent 'zombie like' effects yet all it takes is one little hickey from a Walker and your toast?
    Last edited by Monash; 11 Jun 14, at 12:33.

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