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iowa turret#2 repairs??

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  • #16
    Bz28,

    I think I'll stick with the '60s Navy and the radar of the day - the one that's actually recognizable as a military force, not a day care for whatever....IMHO.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by RustyBattleship View Post
      The turret is manually operable in traversing of the turret and elevation of the guns. Which is very, very slow. The turret alone weighs 1,800 tons and each barrel weighs 118 tons so you can imagine the complexity of the reduction gearing. According to a verbal report given to me by the progressman, everything that was needed to fully repair the turret in Norfolk (including the repaired range finder) was on the pier waiting for the center panel of the turret top to be removed. The Class C armor bolts were loosened up with Wintergreen penetrating oil, the damaged section of the center powder hoist was already marked off for cutouts and replacements (the markings are still there) but suddenly funding was cut off.

      PBC inspections from 2006 until present found only a pile of boxes of nuts and bolts in one of the powder magazines labeled for the turret repair and a pile of damaged parts in an adjoining magazine. However, the last crew of the ship, while still in commission, cleaned everything else up very well and unless you were a turret expert you would think everything was ship-shape as you climb up from the powder magazine to the gun house itself. The crew did an excellent job of cleaning things up and repainting where necessary.

      But without electrical, hydraulic and medium pressure air supply the turret can only remain a memorial to the 47 lost lives. Also, of the loosened bolts on top, 47 were removed and the bolt holes capped with metal plates (see photos on pages 233 & 234 of my book). Presumably those bolts were removed and made into some sort of a memorial but I have no idea of where it may be.

      However, we would like to know where all those other parts are (range finder, fan motors, etc.) and store them aboard the ship in accordance with Navy regulations. The range finder itself would make a great display item without being reinstalled.
      Does the museum ever move the mounts, just to keep them from freezing up or for photo opportunities or any other reasons?

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      • #18
        I also have a question re. the functionality of the 16" turrets on all the 4 ships - I was under the impression from published media in the late '90s that in order for any of the IOWAs to be retained as museums, that the 16" turrets had to be rendered inoperative (so that the ships were effectively "demilitarized). This was to be accomplished by welding the rollers (which allowed the turrets to train) to their track thus in effect stopping any rotation of the turret. Congress mandated this prior to the Navy allowing the ships to be donated. So, my question is: Was this carried out? I thought that I had actually heard a conversation during the 2001 NEW JERSEY Vets Reunion that it in fact had been done.

        Hank

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        • #19
          Originally posted by bbvet View Post
          Tophatter wrote:



          As a Tar Heel and BB62 vet, I saw that article in the local press and would have to say that IMHO this is a true statement. The rules for decommissioning ships were much different in 1946-47 when THE SHOWBOAT was put into mothballs. The ship was for all practical purposes sealed up with everything aboard save the food and drink! Today the ships are stripped of everything that isn't welded in place. I would also imagine that other gov't agencies with their various agendas (EPA, OSHA, ATF to name a few) have all created regulations that also extend to deactivated naval vessels. NORTH CAROLINA had spaces unopened until whenever this article came out (I can't recall the dates) and much to EVERYONE's amazement had these inventories of new barrels, receivers, etc. for the 1.1" a/a guns and whatever else all sitting there waiting to be found :whome:

          I really need to take a weekend trip to Wilmington and go aboard and once again breath in that Luxor of Lube Oil to bring me back to some sense of reality and purpose :insane:

          Hank
          I know Rusty has had to deal with decommissioning numerous ships while working at LBNSY, I decommissioned two ships as a member of their respective crews, but also got involved in the preparations to decommission three others. Why involved with other ships not my own? Simply because while one is prepping the ship to make the trip under tow from San Diego to Bremerton, WA or Suison Bay, CA, to be delivered to the inactive ship facility that would serve as the ship's new home, and ultimately into the waiting hands of the subject matter experts (SME) on the long term layup of machinery and systems, the crew is shrinking and doing so at an ever-quickening pace. The fewer people there are remaining on board, the more difficult the day-to-day chores become. So, the powers that be stripped the crews down to bare skeleton status, and set up two to four ships to be inactivated at the same time, at the same pier in San Diego, under the supervision of one officer (the would be yours truly) overall, with one more officer and several CPOs assigned to each ship; and roughly 200 sailors to work in a kind of communal labor pool all four ships. So, a sailor nominally assigned to USS Brooke (FFG 1), might be working aboard USS Bradley (FF 1041) on Monday, and USS Ramsey (FFG 2) on Tuesday. It worked pretty well as we were getting those ships ready for long term layup, so training to operate them wasn't even in the job description, and then someone much higher in the food chain than I, got the bright idea of transferring these ships to the Brazilian and Pakistani navies. So we did an all back full emergency, and the team of officers, CPOs and enlisted personnel that was supposed to be readying the ships for inactivation became a de facto training team. It was a goat rope, but we made that work too.

          Just one more comment about getting the ship ready for inactivation. There is an entire manual that tells you how to do it, and the guys in charge of the program expect that process to be followed to the letter. Failure to do it exactly as written causes things to come to a stop, and one can pretty much guarantee a phone call from someone wearing stars. So you learn very quickly to do it right the first time, every time. It got easy after a while, but those first few acceptance inspections we had to go through with the guys from Bremerton or whatever were PAINFUL to say the least.

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          • #20
            Desertswo,

            (I'm not Tophatter, by the way - that's someone who I replied to) Your comments re. the decomm. process are very interesting. However, I believe the original question was regarding NORTH CAROLINA and her decomm. took place in the '46-'47 time period under which the rules of deactivating a ship were much different than in your period of service. My reply was simply to state that I believed Tophatter's question about the discovery of small arms/parts aboard NC was in fact a true event.

            Hank

            Comment


            • #21
              I don't know why I gravitate to political and int'l affairs threads. This Iowa stuff is much more interesting. Maybe it's because, as a former airedale, I don't know sh*t from Shinola when it comes to ships. I do have one question. Do the Iowa caretakers have useful points of contact with the Navy?
              To be Truly ignorant, Man requires an Education - Plato

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              • #22
                Originally posted by blackzz28 View Post
                Well u might as well get the latest radar to keep up with the navys upgrades lol
                Changing out to the "latest RADAR" is not just swapping antennas. The main receivers have to be changed out also and they are behind 3/4" thick HY-80 armor plate. Though I added bolted plate accesses to the armored compartments, it's still a hassel. And then all the repeaters throughout the ship may have to be changed out also.
                Able to leap tall tales in a single groan.

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                • #23
                  Not to mention replacing waveguide and re-doing all the emi surveys.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by bbvet View Post
                    Desertswo,

                    (I'm not Tophatter, by the way - that's someone who I replied to) Your comments re. the decomm. process are very interesting. However, I believe the original question was regarding NORTH CAROLINA and her decomm. took place in the '46-'47 time period under which the rules of deactivating a ship were much different than in your period of service. My reply was simply to state that I believed Tophatter's question about the discovery of small arms/parts aboard NC was in fact a true event.

                    Hank
                    I know. I was just providing some information that people, other than Rusty, Dreadnought, and the gang involved in the various museum ships, might not be aware of. Decommissioning a ship is a pain the ass for those involved, regardless of when it was done.

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                    • #25
                      10-4 on that. I was involved in the 1969 NEW JERSEY decommissioning (as part of ship's company) in Bremerton, WA. But, I think what we left those to follow in the 91 revival was well worth the effort.

                      Hank

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by RustyBattleship View Post
                        Changing out to the "latest RADAR" is not just swapping antennas. The main receivers have to be changed out also and they are behind 3/4" thick HY-80 armor plate. Though I added bolted plate accesses to the armored compartments, it's still a hassel. And then all the repeaters throughout the ship may have to be changed out also.
                        Thanks rusty I figured as much , so it can be done just a pain?? Gotta yea, oh I just ordered your book, cant wait to read it:Dancing-Banana:

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Desertswo said: Just one more comment about getting the ship ready for inactivation. There is an entire manual that tells you how to do it, and the guys in charge of the program expect that process to be followed to the letter. Failure to do it exactly as written causes things to come to a stop, and one can pretty much guarantee a phone call from someone wearing stars. So you learn very quickly to do it right the first time, every time. It got easy after a while, but those first few acceptance inspections we had to go through with the guys from Bremerton or whatever were PAINFUL to say the least.

                          I know. I have a copy of that manual -- somewhere between 2 and 4 feet of my computer.

                          bbvet said: I also have a question re. the functionality of the 16" turrets on all the 4 ships - I was under the impression from published media in the late '90s that in order for any of the IOWAs to be retained as museums, that the 16" turrets had to be rendered inoperative (so that the ships were effectively "demilitarized). This was to be accomplished by welding the rollers (which allowed the turrets to train) to their track thus in effect stopping any rotation of the turret. Congress mandated this prior to the Navy allowing the ships to be donated. So, my question is: Was this carried out? I thought that I had actually heard a conversation during the 2001 NEW JERSEY Vets Reunion that it in fact had been done.

                          Welding up the 16"guns was an unauthorized order given out by (probably) some Congressman who hates guns and knows nothing about them. When that order got to Bremerton, they did start to tack weld the elevating gears on the New Jersey. Then that order was cancelled and fortunately the welding could easily be chipped loose and ground flush. The INACTSHIP personnel at Bremerton went ape when they found out that welding was actually done. They only informed the shops of what was the latest but were reluctant to do it. Upon discovery they (supposedly) yelled, "You didn't do what we told you to do, did you?" Their intent was to hold off until the inactivation manual (mentioned above) was officially revised to include that.

                          The only guns that have to be demilitarized are those that use pre-fixed ammuniton (bullet, case, powder & primer all in one piece). And that's not even Navy rules but from the BATFE.

                          When we towed Iowa down to Richmond, we found that one of the forward turrets was about 1 degree off center but locked in place. None of her gun mechanisms were welded so I got a call of how to realign the turret. The answer was quite simple. On each side of the turret are rack and pinion locking wedges that are screwed down into notches cut into the top of the barbette. I merely suggested they loosen up the wedges enough to manually crank the turret into zero degree battery, then crank both wedges down at the same time. Or even put a shim of thin steel on the wedge face to keep it from moving back. It worked, fortunately, and without a shim.
                          Able to leap tall tales in a single groan.

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                          • #28
                            Dick,

                            Thanks so much for updating me on what actually occurred. Whew, I was not happy about what I had heard, so your reply was welcome news.

                            Hank

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                            • #29
                              I can assure anyone that New Jerseys guns do indeed elevate. They have been "manually" elevated several times since becoming a museum for display purposes and for buckler replacements.
                              Fortitude.....The strength to persist...The courage to endure.

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                              • #30
                                Rusty, just to make a minor correction to something you said earlier: I was there the morning in September of 1998 when the Iowa arrived in Rhode Island, and the 4 midships ABLs were already gone by then. In fact, if you look closely you can see that they're missing from this photo: http://www.navsource.org/archives/01/0161009.jpg , which is dated 9/93. So they removed 'em in Philly, and probably either stuck 'em on a couple of Spruances (and subsequently sunk 'em), or buried 'em in a warehouse somewhere.

                                The other thing you can see in that photo is the little cart for refueling the RPVs. That was still on board the entire time she was in Philly and RI, and some of the pictures of her arriving in Benicia in '01 still show it, so if it's not stored on the ship somewhere then you guys might wanna talk to MARAD and see if someone knows what happened to it...

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