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Thread: Ukraine Elections and Political Developments

  1. #361
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    Those are T-62M moved there in September, with most suggestions pointing towards a possible transfer to Syria (neither the Russian Army nor Russian Separatist Forces in Ukraine use the type). The satellite pictures are from October 13th.

  2. #362
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    T-64s most of them according to our people. Going to Syria but just happen to be 18km from the Ukrainian border... seriously? Yes I know they have been parked up there for a while - not shifted to Syria but Poroshenko is trying to use it in addition to the Kerch Strait attack to re-raise awareness of our on going war (and course boost his profile ahead of next years elections).

    I am not a Poroshenko fan in particular. I will be voting Democratic Alliance but we have next to no chance of winning a Presidential election so have teamed up with the Mayor of Lviv (Sadovyi) to stand in the Presidential election. Still no chance basically. If it comes to a second round between Poroshenko and Yulia I will have to vote for Poroshenko.

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    His Beatitude Epifaniy, Metropolitan of Kyiv and all Ukraine elected yesterday.
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    Last edited by snapper; 16 Dec 18, at 15:59.

  4. #364
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    HMS Echo in Odessa yesterday. This may be part of a plan to try to transfer further Ukrainian naval assets to the Sea of Azov (via the Kerch Strait). It is said OSCE representatives may go on the Ukrainian vessels and they will accompany HMS Echo on a courtesy visit to Mariupol. Big respect to the RN for stepping up on this. It would be great to see HMS Queen Elizabeth in the Black Sea one day.

  5. #365
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    UK Minister of Defence Gavin Williamson now in Odessa visiting HMS Echo.

  6. #366
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    The Ukrainian Orthodox Church is now independent again after 330+ yrs of having been 'absorbed' by the Muscovite Patriarchate. In 'hybrid war' terms this is a monumental victory.

  7. #367
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    Presidential elections on 31st of this month; seems we may get a comedian as new President; a guy called Volodymyr Zelensky who plays a fictional President in a popular TV comedy show "Servant of the People"; as in the US where a make believe 'great businessman' in a TV show became President the reality may mirror the fiction here. Opinion polls put Zelensky in the lead on around 24/25%, then either Poroshenko or Yulia Tymoshenko second on 16-18%.

    The way elections work in Ukraine is if nobody gets 50+% in the first round there is a second round between the top two candidates of the first round so the real fight is for who comes second in the first round as the chances/hopes are most sane voters will get behind the serious candidate.

    Zelensky, if elected, has not said much about he would do apart from continue with the IMF program and speak to Muscovites to "end the war"... not like anyone has tried that before.

    I am seriously not a Poroshenko fan; he is thick as two bricks and not clean from corruption (as recent defence procurement scandal has proved), has not done nearly enough in terms of reforming the systems of Government in virtually every area. Even those areas where 'reforms' are praised, such a the health service, remain appalling; the system is a shambles as I heard from a friend who visited Kyiv in January and had to go to hospital. One hospital in particular he said, and others have confirmed to me, resembles a prison camp more than a hospital.* However if the choice of the lesser of two evils it may be Poroshenko again; my husband is sure he will be re-elected.


    *So according to my friend he got a piece of chicken stuck in his down-pipe to the stomach - esophagus pipe. He knew this because he was eating chicken and suddenly could swallow nothing else - all came back, even water. Not an immediate emergency (like a hear attack or something) but uncomfortable etc and medium term threat due to dehydration. So he got through his day, slept and the next morning, when the condition had not changed, got someone to call an ambulance. He says he knew he needed an endoscopy. Ambulance turned up, various appliances and pokes done and the chief medic prescribes a pancreatic problem. For this sort of ailment apparently a patient is taken to the imaginatively named 'Hospital 13'. So having been taken to Hospital 13 my friend, the patient, was further examined by a doctor prodding his tummy, just as the ambulance person had, but concluding it was not a pancreatic problem. The doctor took my friends word that it an esophagus blockage and that having been established he was put back into the ambulance and taken to 'Hospital 17', during which the ambulance driver stopped to do shopping at a street market.

    On arriving at Hospital 17 'reception' I quote my friends account "There was an older woman and younger woman eating sandwiches and drinking something with vodka, watching a film on the computer at desk in a small room. I saw them refilling their glasses with vodka from the desk drawer. They did not even acknowledge my or the medics arrival in their space, though nobody else was there, until the ambulance driver became impatient and shouted something at them." Apparently a further doctor was eventually found who did the same prodding and poking procedure and it was deemed that a third hospital should be found for the patient; the Kyiv State Emergency Hospital.

    This 'Kyiv State Emergency Hospital' is apparently some way outside central Kyiv - like 45mins drive. So my friend was next taken this by all accounts appalling 'facility', the medics again taking him in. Similar prods and pokes were made of the patients stomach and it was decided that an x-ray was required. For this my friend was told, though he had full travel and health insurance, he had to pay some relatively sum for something. This substance - some form of liquid - having been purchased from what seemed a privately owned apotheca/chemist inside this 'hospital' and here I quote directly again "I was asked to follow a nurse down some corridors I can only describe as resembling Bedlam: Half lit, with shadows of people lying or sitting against the walls so it was difficult to pass. At one point in a corridor a young man was being restrained by people in white coats; he had blood all over him and was screaming hysterically. The 'doctor' who spoke some English told me not to worry about him. We proceeded until we reached an elevator in a half lit 'foyer' where plaster fallen from the walls littered the floor. The elevator having arrived we ascended - there was no door that closed or opened for there was no door and bare crumbling brick of the interior was visible as we ascended to another layer of this filthy hell that was only better as it appeared absolutely deserted of the screaming hysterics and groaning crowds below." Apparently on this upper floor, which was entirely deserted, he was lead to ancient x ray room. Here he had to drink the liquid which he had previously for. The x ray having been taken he was lead immediately back downstairs - without the x ray images - where the doctor pronounced him in perfect health; you will feel better tomorrow. He was told turn right for a bus or left for a train back to Kyiv but of course had no idea where he was.

    At this point, having been dismissed, he 'phoned a friend' (a mutual friend in this case who confirms all the rest). The friend has been drinking and can't drive but his Brother will and they do some net search for 'endoscopy Kyiv' and find a private hospital, the 'Boris Clinic' that online it can do the procedure. So after some time the cavalry arrive, take the patient in their car to the Boris Clinic. After some waiting a doctor at this private clinic tells them that by law, or proclamation of the 'acting' Health Minister - considered a great reformer - Ulana Suprun, only the 17th Hospital may conduct such a procedure as an endoscopy.

    So, mad it may seem, apparently they drove back to Hospital 17, where my friend had been some hours before. Apparently the same two women had been joined by another two and were eating supper. A doctor having been called - he confirmed that apparently only their hospital could do an endoscopy but they had neither the working equipment nor a qualified endoscopy doctor to perform the procedure. He agreed though that an x ray is unlikely to show an esophagus block. This doctor then said the Boris Clinic could do it. So the Boris Clinic's objections were explained and a the doctor of the 17th Hospital apparently had to telephone the Boris Clinic to convince them to essentially break the law, the patient clearly not being 'cured' and unable to swallow anything still.

    After this our mutual friends drove the patient back to the Boris Clinic (again) where after about an hour he eventually got an endoscopy where a piece of chicken was recovered that got stuck in his down pipe. Problem solved.

    I recount this sadly true anecdote (our mutual friends who arrived as the cavalry confirmed to me the danger of admittance into the "Kyiv State Emergency Hospital" as they had previously got their Mater out of there, which apparently saved her life according to later medical opinion) because partly people think Ulana Suprun has 'reformed' the Ukrainian Health Service and everything is great now. It very clearly is not. It needs money of course, new hospitals etc... None of the would be 'Presidents' have a real plan for this yet we wonder why the population is declining. Secondly my friends experience, while it seems absurd and extraordinary to him, is in so many ways "normal" in anything you want to do in Ukraine; from planning permission to build literally anything from a garden shed to a glass conservatory to asking for more blankets and sleeping bags in the front line trenches in mid winter. All the time you end going in circles and being dealt with by uncouth, self interested seat sitters who have no interest in your problem or project or whatever it may be - just to do their hours, skim whatever they can and 'get by'. It is depressing to meet these seat sitters - and you can recognise them in an instant - and if you want to shake them 'awake' (which is not always possible) by threats or promise of reward they can prove to be non automatons of some post communist state.

    Ukraine is a reform program not even half way done and for this Poroshenko is to blame, but sadly the choices are bad all ways and he may still be the best.
    Last edited by snapper; 11 Mar 19, at 19:35.

  8. #368
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    Last polls show Poroshenko overtaking Yulia Tymoshenko in 2nd and 3rd place respectively and catching Zelinsky, who it was discovered has undisclosed 10 bedroom villa in Italy neighbouring several wealthy Muscovites such as Abramovitch.

  9. #369
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    First exit poll in todays Presidential Election:

    Zelenskiy: 30.7%
    Poroshenko: 18.6%
    Tymoshenko: 13.9%
    Boyko: 10.3%
    Hrytsenko: 7.3%

    Looks like second round between Zelinskiy and Poroshenko.

  10. #370
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    Stiff competition for Trump no doubt. so All those people died so a comedian could become president lika new version of insanity...

  11. #371
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    He may not be President. By Ukrainian law if no candidate get 50+% of the vote in the first round a second round is held between the two candidates that got the most votes in the first round so a second round will occur on April 21st between Zelinsky and Poroshenko to decide who shall be the next President.

  12. #372
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    HMCS Toronto in Oddessa:

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    Among Americas countries Canada is usually rated as Ukrainians 'best friend', largely perhaps it has the largest Ukrainian diaspora.
    Last edited by snapper; 02 Apr 19, at 23:14.

  13. #373
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    Grr...

  14. #374
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    Quote Originally Posted by snapper View Post
    First exit poll in todays Presidential Election:

    Zelenskiy: 30.7%
    Poroshenko: 18.6%
    Tymoshenko: 13.9%
    Boyko: 10.3%
    Hrytsenko: 7.3%

    Looks like second round between Zelinskiy and Poroshenko.
    I take it that Tymoshenko's votes will go to Poroshenko but where will Boyko's and Hrytsenko's votes go? Assuming you want to discuss it?

  15. #375
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    Quote Originally Posted by montgomery View Post
    I take it that Tymoshenko's votes will go to Poroshenko but where will Boyko's and Hrytsenko's votes go? Assuming you want to discuss it?
    I think it would be a mistake to assume that all or even most who voted for Yulia in the first round will vote for Poroshenko in the second. Boyko was a Moscow candidate from the start and to promote himself and another traitor and oligarch Medvedchuk went to Moscow together and "negotiated a great gas deal" for Ukraine - which would be operable if Boyko won. Turned out their "great gas deal" was more expensive per cubic meter than the deals Naftogaz (the Ukrainian state owned gas supplier) has now with European allies. Kind of ended of them and both are under investigation for various criminal offences.

    Since then the second round has descended into a farce regarding drug testing of all things. People were asking for a debate between the two candidates left so the comedian put out a video;



    So drug tests were done - Poroshenko turned up on time at a WADA testing facility and Zelinsky turned up late at a private clinic where apparently he only had a blood test (as opposed to blood, urine and hair test Poroshenko undertook).

    In the meantime Zelinsky had called for Yulia Tymoshenko to be the 'chair' of the debate and Poroshenko released a similar glossy video which I cannot find an English translation to go with it but you can find here; https://www.rferl.org/a/ukraine-zele.../29861296.html

    Yesterday the Mayor of Kyiv, the former boxer Vitali Klitschko, challenged both candidates to turn up at the Olympic Stadium together for a further round of drug tests. Poroshenko turned up and Zelensky did not.

    We had the opportunity to meet Zelensky recently (my Husband and I) and while I think he may be pleasant enough company at dinner I would say he is useless and clueless on policy and to some extent reality. I shall be voting for Poroshenko as a devil we know rather than a clown we don't.

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